The Ford Barn

IGotIt · 07-20-2014, 01:17 PM

Looking for some help because I am truly stumped. I was driving my banger A one day and it just shut off like you turned the key off. I checked for spark and had none. I have since put in points, condenser, coil, cap, rotor, plug wires, plugs and an ignition switch. I have been through all the wiring and everything checks out but I still do not have spark. Everything else electrical is working and fine except the ignition. I checked the wore from the lower plate to the upper and it has the modern points. I can't get any spark from the coil wire to the head either. I get I nice little blue spark at the points.

Any ideas? I could use a little help about now.

Thank you in advance

GotIt

Mitch//pa · 07-20-2014, 02:41 PM

ck the wire at the ignition coil from the switch. its usually the red wire with a test light. everytime you manually open/close the points the light should flash.. if it does you most likely have a bad coil or coil wire...
if it does not flash the problem may lie between the wiring from the coil to the points incld the switch , armored cable, cable screwed in to far on dist, plate wiring

Willie Krash · 07-20-2014, 03:51 PM

IGotIt,
In the most respectful manner may I suggest that every part replaced makes the solution to the problem all the more difficult.
You indicated you get a blue spark across the points, that indicates to me you have current flowing thru' the coil.
If you take the coil wire and hold it near the head and open and close the points and get no spark it sounds like the coil wire or coil may be bad.

Just as Mitch said.

If so all the other variables you interjected into the problem will have to be proven good. Now do not buy a coil. Take one of your plug wires (it sounds like you are using a modern set up) and try it in place of the existing one on the coil. BTW coils are very reliable.
Please write back and walk it thru a step at a time. Try not to replace any more parts.

Summation, Your points aren't grounded, the key is working, cap, rotor, plug wires and even the condenser are off the table by what you've told us.
So I'm trying to help you isolate the issue. In my world the less I have to think about the easier the solution ought to be.

1937pickup · 07-20-2014, 04:04 PM

I can't remember if the Model A has a ballast resistor in the ignition circuit-if it does you should check it.

Tom Wesenberg · 07-20-2014, 04:25 PM

Most, but not all, Model A's have the coil wired through the ammeter, so you can crank the engine with the key ON and should see the ammeter needle flicker each time the points open and close.

IGotIt · 07-20-2014, 05:01 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

I did all the parts swap before it died and wouldn't re start except I changed the coil and ignition after the problem. Steve at Bert's suggested this swap. I did change the cap rotor and wires after the problem also. I am going to try a condensor now and see if by chance that is the problem.

The way it is now I do not get any spark from the coil wire to ground while cranking

vermontboy · 07-20-2014, 05:51 PM

In your original post you said that you did all the parts swaps after it died. In your last post you state that you did the parts swaps before it died. Please clarify - makes a huge difference.

IGotIt · 07-20-2014, 05:56 PM

I did the points and condensor before the problem. I just now tried all new parts and its still the same but when I put a delco 12 v coil in I had spark from the coil lead for a couple times of the points opening

IGotIt · 07-20-2014, 07:10 PM

Ok. I am getting somewhere I guess. If I open and close the points by hand I will get spark on occasion but I noticed when I do get spark that the spark at the points is greater also.

Mean anything to anyone?

Willie Krash · 07-20-2014, 07:50 PM

The current has to go thru the points to ground to make a spark.
You could put a piece of paper between the points and test that the moving point is hot with key on. Take a piece of wire and touch the swing arm and the other end touch the head, tap, tap tap. Simulate your points. The coil wire you have next to the head should spark each time. If it does your problem has been isolated. It's at the dist.
Kind of an obtuse way to do it but you will know where to look. Sorry I have dinner engagement, gotta go.

Don't use bare wire, might bite you.

IGotIt · 07-20-2014, 07:50 PM

Ok. I figured it out. It had been a while of tinkering when I had time and the answer was so simple. The fuel pump I had wired in to the acc. Port on the key switch and it was keeping it from sparking. Why I have no idea but it did. It worked fine for a couple months and then decided it wasn't having it but I am back up and functional.

Thank you for all the great ideas and suggestion

700rpm · 07-20-2014, 10:58 PM

You have a fuel pump? What are you running?

IGotIt · 07-20-2014, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 700rpm

You have a fuel pump? What are you running?

A banger but I have 2 strombergs on it.

Mike V. Florida · 07-20-2014, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IGotIt

Ok. I figured it out. It had been a while of tinkering when I had time and the answer was so simple. The fuel pump I had wired in to the acc. Port on the key switch and it was keeping it from sparking. Why I have no idea but it did. It worked fine for a couple months and then decided it wasn't having it but I am back up and functional.

Thank you for all the great ideas and suggestion

Feels good when you figure it out!!

Willie Krash · 07-21-2014, 12:10 AM

Good luck. I hope you found it. Drive safe.
mike

George Miller · 07-21-2014, 07:47 AM

I,m glad you found the problem.
It is help full if you can tell us every thing you have done that is different than a stock Model A.

Mitch//pa · 07-21-2014, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Miller

I,m glade you found the problem.
It is help full if you can tell us every thing you have done that is different than a stock Model A.

yep happens all the time here :::;

i am glad the problem was found also

IGotIt · 07-21-2014, 09:45 AM

I never would have guessed the pump would have been the issue. It ran fine for quite a while. I had the fuel lines off to time it and kept cranking to see if there was spark and had nothing. I decided I was tired of the little fuel spitting every time my dad turned the key on so I disconnected the wire and had spark. Simple yet so hard to figure out

Thank you so much for all the helpful responses

07-20-2014, 01:17 PM	#1
IGotIt Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 21	Model a has no spark. Please help Looking for some help because I am truly stumped. I was driving my banger A one day and it just shut off like you turned the key off. I checked for spark and had none. I have since put in points, condenser, coil, cap, rotor, plug wires, plugs and an ignition switch. I have been through all the wiring and everything checks out but I still do not have spark. Everything else electrical is working and fine except the ignition. I checked the wore from the lower plate to the upper and it has the modern points. I can't get any spark from the coil wire to the head either. I get I nice little blue spark at the points. Any ideas? I could use a little help about now. Thank you in advance GotIt

07-20-2014, 02:41 PM	#2
Mitch//pa BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bucks County, PA Posts: 11,454	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help ck the wire at the ignition coil from the switch. its usually the red wire with a test light. everytime you manually open/close the points the light should flash.. if it does you most likely have a bad coil or coil wire... if it does not flash the problem may lie between the wiring from the coil to the points incld the switch , armored cable, cable screwed in to far on dist, plate wiring Last edited by Mitch//pa; 07-20-2014 at 02:50 PM.

07-20-2014, 03:51 PM	#3
Willie Krash Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Phoenix, Oregon Posts: 661	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help IGotIt, In the most respectful manner may I suggest that every part replaced makes the solution to the problem all the more difficult. You indicated you get a blue spark across the points, that indicates to me you have current flowing thru' the coil. If you take the coil wire and hold it near the head and open and close the points and get no spark it sounds like the coil wire or coil may be bad. Just as Mitch said. If so all the other variables you interjected into the problem will have to be proven good. Now do not buy a coil. Take one of your plug wires (it sounds like you are using a modern set up) and try it in place of the existing one on the coil. BTW coils are very reliable. Please write back and walk it thru a step at a time. Try not to replace any more parts. Summation, Your points aren't grounded, the key is working, cap, rotor, plug wires and even the condenser are off the table by what you've told us. So I'm trying to help you isolate the issue. In my world the less I have to think about the easier the solution ought to be. __________________ Mike Stitt "A business that make nothing but money is a poor business." -Henry Ford Last edited by Willie Krash; 07-20-2014 at 03:58 PM.

07-20-2014, 04:04 PM	#4
1937pickup Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 586	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help I can't remember if the Model A has a ballast resistor in the ignition circuit-if it does you should check it.

07-20-2014, 04:25 PM	#5
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help Most, but not all, Model A's have the coil wired through the ammeter, so you can crank the engine with the key ON and should see the ammeter needle flicker each time the points open and close.

07-20-2014, 05:01 PM	#6
IGotIt Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 21	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I did all the parts swap before it died and wouldn't re start except I changed the coil and ignition after the problem. Steve at Bert's suggested this swap. I did change the cap rotor and wires after the problem also. I am going to try a condensor now and see if by chance that is the problem. The way it is now I do not get any spark from the coil wire to ground while cranking

07-20-2014, 05:51 PM	#7
vermontboy Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Webster, NY Posts: 84	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help In your original post you said that you did all the parts swaps after it died. In your last post you state that you did the parts swaps before it died. Please clarify - makes a huge difference.

07-20-2014, 05:56 PM	#8
IGotIt Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 21	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help I did the points and condensor before the problem. I just now tried all new parts and its still the same but when I put a delco 12 v coil in I had spark from the coil lead for a couple times of the points opening

07-20-2014, 07:10 PM	#9
IGotIt Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 21	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help Ok. I am getting somewhere I guess. If I open and close the points by hand I will get spark on occasion but I noticed when I do get spark that the spark at the points is greater also. Mean anything to anyone?

07-20-2014, 07:50 PM	#10
Willie Krash Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Phoenix, Oregon Posts: 661	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help The current has to go thru the points to ground to make a spark. You could put a piece of paper between the points and test that the moving point is hot with key on. Take a piece of wire and touch the swing arm and the other end touch the head, tap, tap tap. Simulate your points. The coil wire you have next to the head should spark each time. If it does your problem has been isolated. It's at the dist. Kind of an obtuse way to do it but you will know where to look. Sorry I have dinner engagement, gotta go. Don't use bare wire, might bite you. __________________ Mike Stitt "A business that make nothing but money is a poor business." -Henry Ford

07-20-2014, 10:58 PM	#12
700rpm Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 5,925	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help You have a fuel pump? What are you running? __________________ Ray Horton, Portland, OR As you go through life, keep your eye on the donut, not the hole.

07-21-2014, 12:10 AM	#15
Willie Krash Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Phoenix, Oregon Posts: 661	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help Good luck. I hope you found it. Drive safe. mike __________________ Mike Stitt "A business that make nothing but money is a poor business." -Henry Ford

07-21-2014, 07:47 AM	#16
George Miller Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NC Posts: 2,975	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help I,m glad you found the problem. It is help full if you can tell us every thing you have done that is different than a stock Model A. Last edited by George Miller; 07-21-2014 at 08:03 AM.

07-21-2014, 09:45 AM	#18
IGotIt Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 21	Re: Model a has no spark. Please help I never would have guessed the pump would have been the issue. It ran fine for quite a while. I had the fuel lines off to time it and kept cranking to see if there was spark and had nothing. I decided I was tired of the little fuel spitting every time my dad turned the key on so I disconnected the wire and had spark. Simple yet so hard to figure out Thank you so much for all the helpful responses