'32 Roadster top color

[acchaplin]

Any of you guys know the correct '32 Roadster top color, please?

In the Stayfast top site they list a Oyster with Tan backing, and a Tan with Tan backing.

Which one is the correct color? Thanks

[DavidG]

There's no color t0p material that Ford referred to as "drab" for 1932-39 deluxe open car top material among the current Haartz Stayfast offerings. Dark beige is the closest, but lacks the hint of olive green of the original. Their near-white oyster color is about as close to the original as their reds and blues.

[acchaplin]

Originally Posted by DavidG

There's no color t0p material that Ford referred to as "drab" for 1932-39 deluxe open car top material among the current Haartz Stayfast offerings. Dark beige is the closest, but lacks the hint of olive green of the original. Their near-white oyster color is about as close to the original as their reds and blues.

Thanks for the reply.

However,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, your comment(s) is "very" confusing and hard for me to understand.

Your black white, and "tinted" (?) pictures in your '32 books of Tops and upholstery material colors are "very hard" for me to see one color from the other. I "see" one color, someone else "sees" another color. Another person "sees" a entirely different color.

Looking through the 100's of pictures of '32 roadster tops that GOOGLE supplied. The three colors that stand out, is the Black, and the lighter tans, dark(er) tans.

You once told me (PM) that Stayfast makes the closest '32 Roadster/Phaeton top material.

In Stayfast's web site they show both a "Oyster" with tan backing, and a "Tan" with a tan backing. (either color looks correct compaired to the pictures in your book) I posted the question, which one of those colors is the correct '32 material? You stated above. That, "Dark Beige is the closest" (Stayfast does not list a "Dark Beige" color) I do not understand your comment of, "but lacks the Olive Green of the original."

Then you state, the near white "Oyster" color (which Stayfast offers) is about as close to the original,,,,,,,,. What in the world does "Red and Blue" have anything to do with original '32 top colors!?

According to your above statements either color is the "closest." (???)

Please tell me how can I "word" the question, "which one of Stayfast's top colors listed is the correct '32 roadster top?"

[rockfla]

Originally Posted by acchaplin

Thanks for the reply.

However,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, your comment(s) is "very" confusing and hard for me to understand.

Your black white, and "tinted" (?) pictures in your '32 books of Tops and upholstery material colors are "very hard" for me to see one color from the other. I "see" one color, someone else "sees" another color. Another person "sees" a entirely different color.

Looking through the 100's of pictures of '32 roadster tops that GOOGLE supplied. The three colors that stand out, is the Black, and the lighter tans, dark(er) tans.

You once told me (PM) that Stayfast makes the closest '32 Roadster/Phaeton top material.

In Stayfast's web site they show both a "Oyster" with tan backing, and a "Tan" with a tan backing. (either color looks correct compaired to the pictures in your book) I posted the question, which one of those colors is the correct '32 material? You stated above. That, "Dark Beige is the closest" (Stayfast does not list a "Dark Beige" color) I do not understand your comment of, "but lacks the Olive Green of the original."

Then you state, the near white "Oyster" color (which Stayfast offers) is about as close to the original,,,,,,,,. What in the world does "Red and Blue" have anything to do with original '32 top colors!?

According to your above statements either color is the "closest." (???)

Please tell me how can I "word" the question, "which one of Stayfast's top colors listed is the correct '32 roadster top?"

There is NO stayfast color that is an exact match, you will have to choose (to your eye) the lesser of evils. Perhaps the two attached photos will help you as to the "Green hue" of the true original stayfast color (with David's blessing, hoepfully) IF you look at the two attached photos of these extraordinary restorations you will see how the top material has a "greenish/olive"y" hue to the appearance. Especially the 37 picture

[rockfla]

Perhaps this Maroon 33 roadster will also translate on here like it does in the actual picture? The top does not appear tan against the Maroon

[rockfla]

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acchaplin


Here is a link that I think will ALSO show a high quality picture and the greenish hue of the more correct top material


https://www.conceptcarz.com/profile/...8-special.aspx

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by rockfla

There is NO stayfast color that is an exact match, you will have to choose (to your eye) the lesser of evils. Perhaps the two attached photos will help you as to the "Green hue" of the true original stayfast color (with David's blessing, hoepfully) IF you look at the two attached photos of these extraordinary restorations you will see how the top material has a "greenish/olive"y" hue to the appearance. Especially the 37 picture

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by rockfla

Perhaps this Maroon 33 roadster will also translate on here like it does in the actual picture? The top does not appear tan against the Maroon

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by rockfla

acchaplin


Here is a link that I think will ALSO show a high quality picture and the greenish hue of the more correct top material


https://www.conceptcarz.com/profile/...8-special.aspx

[DavidG]

Robert,


Not an oyster in the house!


Thanks.


acchaplin,


Between this posing and the numerous personal messages on this topic and the colors of the standard and deluxe upholstery material (they are not the same nor are the colors of their top material the same), you've worn me out.


You are on your own henceforth.


P.S. There are no tinted photos in the book. The photos are either black and white or in full color as captured by a camera.

[acchaplin]

Originally Posted by DavidG

Robert,


Not an oyster in the house!


Thanks.


acchaplin,


Between this posing and the numerous personal messages on this topic and the colors of the standard and deluxe upholstery material (they are not the same nor are the colors of their top material the same), you've worn me out.

No wonder it's rare (even though it's nice for reference) to see a fully restored '32! It's too complicated. One person sez-suggests one thing, another person sez something entirely non related. Another person will make a statement, then later on say completely the opposite.
"you" my friend, say "you" are wore out!? wheeee! I am so confused, flustrated over such a seemingly simple quest of wanting a close as possible to OEM color and style of Roadster interior and top as I can obtain. Every time, I feel "this is it" that idea is not avaible, or gets pulled out from under me. Then back to "square one" again!

I stared inquiring (posting) about OEM style top and interior information in late '22. Obtaining color samples, going through just about every upholstery company's sample offerings searching, asking. Always drawing a blank.

David, the pictures in your book look drab green.
So I search for a greenish material. Can't find a match. Webster's defines Copra Drab as a bland, non exciting "brown" color!!?? Your pictures don't look brown! Which color is it, brown or green!? I would ask a upholstery supply company if they have any Copra Drab colored material. They would reply with a generic comment of, "we don't know," and then show me 500 samples to choose from! I can't make a choice, because I'm not 100% positive about the color myself! Several of the so called "restored" Roadsters and Phaetons the tan upholstery material is so bright one needs sun glasses. I know that bright of tan/brown is not right!

Since '22, all I have accomplished, is more questions than answers, not sure of who to ask, where to ask, what to ask, a stack of useless upholstery sample colors. However! I DO have the tan rubber floor mat made, cut, and installed!!!

You are on your own henceforth. Okey-Doakey


P.S. There are no tinted photos in the book. The photos are either black and white or in full color as captured by a camera.

Some pictures look like they are "tinted."

[acchaplin]

There is NO stayfast color that is an exact match, you will have to choose (to your eye) the lesser of evils. Perhaps the two attached photos will help you as to the "Green hue" of the true original stayfast color (with David's blessing, hoepfully) IF you look at the two attached photos of these extraordinary restorations you will see how the top material has a "greenish/olive"y" hue to the appearance. Especially the 37 picture

THANK YOU! Ah,,,,,, I "see" now sez the blind man! What confused me was, I didn't see any "olive" hue in David's pictures! David's pictures the top looks Oyster with a similar backing, or Tan(ish) with a similar color backing.

David told me that Stayfast makes the closest '32 top material. Fine and dandy. Go into Stayfast's site, see two colors that (looks) are similar to David's pictures. Ask (post) a seemingly simple question, which one is the correct color,,,,,,,,,,? Then all hell breaks loose! Like I cussed out the Pope or something.

Most of the rainbow colors are then mentioned further confusing, "now what!?" David mentions a "Dark Beige" Stayfast doesn't offer a "Dark Beige"! Very flustrating and confusing, when one is told about Stayfast, then told a color they don't offer!? Stayfast offers a plain Beige with a BLACK backing. Nothing is David's books shows a dark or black backing.

Didn't know you needed David's,,,,,, blessing (!?) to explain (in detail) what this "olive" hue was. Thank you again for your detailed explaination!

Now if someone can tell me the meaning of the "Red and Blue" top colors comment.

I am going to surmise that David's comment, "Not a Oyster in sight." Means that the Oyster with tan backing color isn't the correct colored top? So that leaves the Tan w/tan backing must be the correct choice? Or,,,,,, are you guys privy to a color Stayfast makes that isn't listed,,,,,,, that is being mentioned?

[acchaplin]

Originally Posted by rockfla

acchaplin


here is a link that i think will also show a high quality picture and the greenish hue of the more correct top material


https://www.conceptcarz.com/profile/...8-special.aspx

thank you!

[rockfla]

As I have followed and read ALL the post, It was clear to me...your "best" option is "among the current Haartz Stayfast offerings. Dark beige is the closest" and that the "oyster" option would be about as close as "red" or "blue" which my interpretation is.....not even close!!!! JMO

[acchaplin]

Originally Posted by rockfla

As I have followed and read ALL the post, It was clear to me...your "best" option is "among the current Haartz Stayfast offerings. Dark beige is the closest" and that the "oyster" option would be about as close as "red" or "blue" which my interpretation is.....not even close!!!! JMO

Sigh, still have no idea what red or blue colors have anything to do with a "Oyster" color.

The "black backing" is not in David's pictures. So, since the Dark Beige colors were mentioned again. I just emailed Stayfast and asked if they made a Dark Beige with a Beige or Tan backing. I'll post what they say.

[glennpm]

From LeBaron Bonney

[tubman]

In situations like this, I like to use "sarcasm" emoji to clarify things.

There are some people out there who seem to take everything seriously and need a little help.

[acchaplin]

Originally Posted by glennpm

From LeBaron Bonney

Thanks Glenn. Since LB (or anyone else?) no longer offers "any" OEM colored Roadster/Phaeton upholstery/top material. The questions I have been trying to find out, WHO does!? I'm either, then given a upholstery supplier's name, or told, none exist or not knowing of any close matches. Some have seemingly been tight lipped. Times I get answers that make absoultely no sense (to me) at all.

As I have mentioned, contacted several larger (famous) upholstery shops, several upholstery material suppliers, asking about Copra Drab. I'm told "they don't know" and given a web site with multiple color samples. Even their pictures are off. Because when I receive a sample, it's not even close to the picture(s) on the web sites.

I have yet to find a clear percise OEM color or sample piece that I can get matched! I have received several pictures, but when I try and copy and paste any of those pictures, the color changes somewhat, or the pictures show different colors to different eyes, making it more difficult to "guess" on the match.

I am NOT making some "one off" wild upholstery design and colors! Just a plain, (should be) simple, ORIGINAL color and style upholstery in a Deuce Roadster! And as I have discovered, it's NOT that simple/easy!

Sure would like to "borrow" (we call it barrie) those sample pieces you have there. Gard to see your pictures, but which one of those samples is the OEM seat and side panel Roadster color? Thanks again.

[rockfla]

Acchaplin
Unless you find someone who has some old material left OR lying around, the original material is un-obtainium. Haartz is the main manufacturer of the “Stayfast” canvas and we were informed by a Haartz supplier they “ONLY” make a limited color offering AND some color offerings like green, they only do lot runs of that color every 8/10 years or SO and that is it till the next run of that color, if it runs out before hand then it runs out!!! I am most certain LB had custom lots run several years apart ordering, a bare minimum linear footage amount each time, maybe more. I would also bet, that custom run took months IF not years of planning for that to take place. SO, IMO, you are on the correct track on the search for the Dark Tan with a tan backing and to be satisfied with that.
NOW, with that said, I had heard, at one time, there was a certain “special” material Stidabacker used on there interiors and was “specific” to them only. The National Studabavker Club solicited all it member for a fairly reasonable donation and they contracted with the material maker of that time to do a “special” run of that material and the club stored and sold it to its memebers. I don’t know how true it is OR “IF” that could be done today but it would take the financial comitment of “many” to make that happen. I for one would be a potential willing investor in such an endeavor.

[acchaplin]

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alumcantandthd
09-18-2021 @ 10:48 AM
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Several questions, please.

Where might I find good detailed pictures of a original Deuce Roadster interior? You know, like a 'blueprint' or something, that I can take to an upholstery shop?

Has anyone bought a Deuce Roadster and removed the original interior for some other reason, that I 'might' be able to buy, bum, beg, borrow or steal?

I have some decent detailed pictures of a DeLuxe Roadster interior from Cartouche. (rolling eyes, while shaking bowed head slowly back and forth) Reminds me of those 'custom fit' seat covers, upholstery panels, etc, JC Whitney sold in the '60's-'70's. I understand the kick and door panel pictures, but the other panels they have pictures of, I have no ideal where they are to go!

Is the seat, part of the side, rear or back panel? Or does the 'back' panels goes from door post around to door post, then the seat set in? What I seem to have pictured in my mind, isn't what it actually is. Receiving a vague description is worse, because having Dyslexia doesn't help to get a fully 'mental picture' either.

Thanks!

3w2
09-19-2021 @ 7:11 AM
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You can obtain copies of the original engineering drawings (blueprints) of the various upholstery components from the Benson Ford Research Center in Dearborn. However, you will the original part numbers of those components in order to obtain those drawings. The part numbers are listed in the 1932 body parts catalog (known as the "Body Parts Price List"), which is available in reprint form from many hobby dealers. (Used reprints and originals often show up for sale on Amazon and ebay.)

The illustration below is from that catalog and it shows most of the various components of the deluxe roadster interior. It is a fairly simple interior consisting of a pair of cowl side, door, and seat side trim panels for the front compartment in addition to the seat bottom and back cushions. The seat side (or shoulder) trim panels terminate beyond the back of the sides of the seat back cushion. They are independent and do not attach to the seat back cushion sides. In other words, in response to your last paragraph, no upholstery trim or multiples of it, extend from door post to door post (B pillars in automotive speak).

You will not likely find any good photo of the area behind the top of the front seat back cushion known as the package tray. The first attached photograph is from Ford's archives and gives an overall elevated view of the interior upholstery. Unfortunately, with the top down, and the top boot in place, nothing of the area behind the top of the front seat back cushion is shown. It is very narrow, front to back, and with the top in place even a photo inside would not be either easy to take or be all that informative. You can see part of the vertical portion of the trim on the belt rail in the second photograph (the fasteners shown are for the attachment of the top boot).

The horizontal or bottom portion of the package tray is formed by two upholstery-covered curved and lipped steel panels, which you presumably have in bare form. The rear of the two is permanently attached to the front of the upper back panel of the body and the front piece is attached with wood screws to the back of the framework of the front seat back cushion. When the seat back cushion is installed that front piece fits beneath and is attached to the rear piece with oval-headed nickel-plated screws and finishing washers thereby securing the back of the front seat cushion to the body structure. (There are two sets of holes for each attachment point allowing a slight adjustment of the front seat back cushion.) The remainder of the trim for the package tray involves the trim covering the curved wood rail on the top edge of the upper back and quarter panels.

If you provide your email address I can send you LeBaron Bonney's instructions for the front seat back installations and how the curved wood rail and the rest of the package tray is trimmed.

The rumble seat compartment upholstery consists of five components, namely the two cushions, a pair of side trim panels, and textured heavy cardboard panel covering the back of the front seat back cushion. Portions of all of those components are shown in the attached photos.

David (as in DavidG on fordbarn.com)

P.S. While I loaded the photos in the order of the text, this site produces them in reverse order; sorry. (Bruce, That's something for your to do list.)

This message was edited by 3w2 on 9-19-21 @ 7:15 AM

alumcantandthd
09-20-2021 @ 3:55 PM
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THANK YOU! I 'see' now sez the blind man! Your picture there really helped me understand! Thanks again!

Ok, I have to 'make,' or get ideas on how to make, a (#?) piece panel for the sides and back from the "B" pillar all the way around to the other side pillar. For I have 'made' my seat. It's a couple inches wider, bottom and back than the replacement OEM seat frames they sell. I used three of those rear seats that are in the Ford Econoline Vans to make the frame, hinges, springs and foam.

Plus, my windshield is chopped, so my seat has to set a little lower, and still have spring and foam comfort. Not just the hi-density sculptered foam I see the 'custom' seats are made of.

The simple stitching design pattern that are on the door panels, I can 'extend' around to the panels beside and behind the seat.

The back of the seat I made, folds forward, and the bottom part lifts up, (not at the same time) for storage space, also the hinges are hidden. It will 'resemble' a OEM roadster seat somewhat.

I was thinking, I could use the Cartouche interior kit, then 'copy' the panels design behind the seat. Not now, after seeing 'their' picture construction, no way!

Here is my email addy, for you to send me LB's picture instructions. (or ANY other pictures)
[email protected]

Thank you again for your help.

3w2
09-20-2021 @ 7:10 PM
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So, why here and on fordbarn.com did you make no mention up front of using a non-original seat and your ideas as to the rest of the upholstery? Quite the contrary, you strongly implied that you wanted original type upholstery.

HAMB is the site you need for your kind of car as this one is for information on cars that more or less fall with the mandate of the Club which is to preserve the cars as they were built by Ford.

alumcantandthd
09-25-2021 @ 2:58 AM
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Wow!

I really do know know how to respond to your __________ (rolling eyes while shaking bowed head slowly back and forth) ____ comment!

Please accept my humble, sincere, apology for insulting your ego! I did NOT know that I am required (by law?) to build 'my' car, with 'my' $$$, to 'your' standards!? Do you also 'correct' others that have a 'restored' looking car, only the entire body is fiberglass,,,,,,,,,?

However,,,,,,, your pictures helped me a lot on understanding how the OEM interior panels were installed around the seat, and how I can 'make' the seat upholstery, and the panels around and behind the seat I made, look OEM. Thank you. Googling, 'original' Deuce Roadster interior pictures turned up everything but OEM. I asked for pictures on the HAMB site, but was refered to 'this site.'

I thought NOT cutting up one of those $$$ re-production '32 seat frame and springs, modifying it to sit a little lower. That taking 3 seats given to me for free, and making a 'folding' OEM looking seat would be a better idea. But (sigh) I was wrong.

I won't mention how I made a 1940's-early 1950's OEM 'looking' oil bath air cleaner outta' a couple of hubcaps.

3w2
09-25-2021 @ 8:59 AM
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If you did not know how to respond, why did you bother? I repeat, HAMB is the website for rods, this one isn't for rods.

RETRACT. I stated that I started in "late '22" working on the OEM style Roadster interior. I found out I was wrong on the date. Here is some "flack" I ran into in 2021!