The Ford Barn

theodore · 03-22-2013, 11:20 AM

my 34 roadster has a lot of clutch chatter when backing up- but not going forward. Does this ring a bell with

anyone?

ken ct · 03-22-2013, 11:26 AM

Try tightening up on the chatter rods. ken ct.

Mark Slight · 03-22-2013, 12:33 PM

Anti-Chatter Rods. :-)

Mark

ford38v8 · 03-22-2013, 01:15 PM

Theodore, clutch chatter is a side effect of the Ford torque tube drive system.

Chatter is combatted, as said above, by the use of anti-chatter rods hodling the engine taught toward the rear, which many times are not tightened properly after an engine replacement.
The other main defense against chatter is the front engine mounts and the transmission mount(s). Half the old Fords on the road could use new motor mounts, as they get old and soft (like men)

and need to be replaced

or cleaned and tightened up. Easy to do with the Ford,

Not so easy for old men, as the tightening process only makes an old man think he's young and strong again.

PeteVS · 03-22-2013, 03:29 PM

The problem is that when you put it in reverse and start to let out the clutch, the rear wheels PULL the car backwards. That pulling action is transmitted through the torque tube which pulls back on the transmission and engine. The engine and transmission pull back on the frame and the rest of the car. So, it there's a bit of slop here, the engine and transmission will move back in the frame slightly. When they come back, they're also pushing back against the clutch release rod. That, tends to disengage the clutch which, allows the engine and transmission to move forward again, once again, causing the clutch to engage a bit more. Get the picture? Steady rods (or anti-chatter rods) are intended to keep the engine and transmission from this back and forth motion in the frame. If they're missing or loose or adjusted wrong- clutch chatter!

bmwillia · 03-22-2013, 04:17 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

What does this "chatter" sound like?

coolcoupe · 03-22-2013, 04:27 PM

Does any one have the length,diameter so that they could be made or where to get them? Thanks

Mark Slight · 03-22-2013, 04:31 PM

Kind of like when your teeth chatter in Northern Canada in the winter time. I've lived in Ontario Canada near Lake Erie so I know first hand.

You can feel it in the drive train and hear it.

Mark

ken ct · 03-22-2013, 04:34 PM

Very littlesound but you can feel it through out the car,it kind of shutters.ken ct.

ford38v8 · 03-22-2013, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ken ct

Very littlesound but you can feel it through out the car,it kind of shutters.ken ct.

Ken, apparently you've never experienced clutch chatter in a Ford. There's no mistaking it for anything else, you'll know it when you hear and feel it, and anyone within 50 ft of you will turn to see what's making all that noise.

Talkwrench · 03-22-2013, 06:12 PM

Are the rods available to buy anywhere?

Clem Clement · 03-22-2013, 06:17 PM

My chatter rods are tight and the'39 still chatters in reverse.

ford38v8 · 03-22-2013, 06:28 PM

Clem, anything that can allow your engine and differential to move in opposite directions will cause chatter. With good tight chatter rods, motor mounts, transmission mounts, and rear spring mount, the remaining causes are clutch related: Oil on the clutch, worn clutch, weak or broken clutch springs, incorrect pressure plate finger adjustments, all of those and more, plus the design of the system itself is prone to cause chatter.

gearhead1952 · 03-22-2013, 07:33 PM

I've found my 52 F1 chatters in reverse and sometimes going forward if I drive it like my daily driver ford ranger which is more gas than clutch. If I give the F1 more clutch less gas it is much smoother. My brain forgets this every time I get in my F1 until it chatters and I remember what I am driving and what I need to do.

Clem Clement · 03-22-2013, 08:54 PM

I have a howl which I interprete as a weak uni. When I got the truck I remove the buscuits and checked them. The 39 has a 35 tranny installed. When I find a 39 tranny and the pedals, I'll freshen the entire mess.

Mark Slight · 03-22-2013, 09:27 PM

Answer; 1935-1941 Stay Rods are 12 13/16" from center of the eye to the flange. Ford part number 48 6044.

Don't have diam.

Mark

columbiA · 03-22-2013, 10:15 PM

Any looseness anywhere in the driveline will cause chatter.Rear hubs loose on axles & aworn U joint.The Merc town sedans seem the worst because of the longer W B & increased weight.I had a 47 Monarch TS which was almost impossible to drive.I pulled the RE & the rear splines on DS & in the coupling were worn almost as thin as razor blades! The U J was totally worn out,as well as the front DS brg & brg surface on DS.There was not a hint of lube in the UJ or front brg.I replaced all the parts & it was fine.The37-48,s with the 6-spline DS seem to be quite prone to looseness in the splines.I have pulled many of those RE,s apart & found worn splines.If you are lucky the splines will only be worn on the front 1/2 of the coupling & will be good on the pinion.I have hardly ever found worn-out splines on the early 10-spline DS,s.

JM 35 Sedan · 03-22-2013, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talkwrench

Are the rods available to buy anywhere?

Believe it or not, sometimes they actually show up right here in the Fordbarn swap/for sale listings

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10508

theodore · 03-24-2013, 08:40 AM

where are the chatter rods on a 34 roadster? I don't see them on mine.

V8COOPMAN · 03-24-2013, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theodore

where are the chatter rods on a 34 roadster? I don't see them on mine.

Below is a picture of where they SHOULD be found. DD

03-22-2013, 11:20 AM	#1
theodore Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Longmont,CO Posts: 23	clutch chatter in reverse my 34 roadster has a lot of clutch chatter when backing up- but not going forward. Does this ring a bell with anyone?

03-22-2013, 11:26 AM	#2
ken ct BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: stratford,ct Posts: 5,971	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Try tightening up on the chatter rods. ken ct.

03-22-2013, 01:15 PM	#4
ford38v8 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: SF Bay Area Posts: 6,646	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Theodore, clutch chatter is a side effect of the Ford torque tube drive system. Chatter is combatted, as said above, by the use of anti-chatter rods hodling the engine taught toward the rear, which many times are not tightened properly after an engine replacement. The other main defense against chatter is the front engine mounts and the transmission mount(s). Half the old Fords on the road could use new motor mounts, as they get old and soft (like men) and need to be replaced or cleaned and tightened up. Easy to do with the Ford, Not so easy for old men, as the tightening process only makes an old man think he's young and strong again. __________________ Alan

03-22-2013, 03:29 PM	#5
PeteVS Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: FP, NJ Posts: 2,770	Re: clutch chatter in reverse The problem is that when you put it in reverse and start to let out the clutch, the rear wheels PULL the car backwards. That pulling action is transmitted through the torque tube which pulls back on the transmission and engine. The engine and transmission pull back on the frame and the rest of the car. So, it there's a bit of slop here, the engine and transmission will move back in the frame slightly. When they come back, they're also pushing back against the clutch release rod. That, tends to disengage the clutch which, allows the engine and transmission to move forward again, once again, causing the clutch to engage a bit more. Get the picture? Steady rods (or anti-chatter rods) are intended to keep the engine and transmission from this back and forth motion in the frame. If they're missing or loose or adjusted wrong- clutch chatter! __________________ Don't never get rid of nuthin!

03-22-2013, 04:17 PM	#6
bmwillia Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Gonzales, LA Posts: 457	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) What does this "chatter" sound like? __________________ Brad Williamson

03-22-2013, 04:27 PM	#7
coolcoupe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: ontario,Canada Posts: 451	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Does any one have the length,diameter so that they could be made or where to get them? Thanks

03-22-2013, 04:31 PM	#8
Mark Slight Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Dixon, CA Posts: 473	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Kind of like when your teeth chatter in Northern Canada in the winter time. I've lived in Ontario Canada near Lake Erie so I know first hand. You can feel it in the drive train and hear it. Mark

03-22-2013, 04:34 PM	#9
ken ct BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: stratford,ct Posts: 5,971	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Very littlesound but you can feel it through out the car,it kind of shutters.ken ct.

03-22-2013, 06:12 PM	#11
Talkwrench Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 2,687	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Are the rods available to buy anywhere? __________________ *"Came too close to dying to stop living now!"*

03-22-2013, 06:17 PM	#12
Clem Clement Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Fairfax, VA Posts: 3,393	Re: clutch chatter in reverse My chatter rods are tight and the'39 still chatters in reverse.

03-22-2013, 06:28 PM	#13
ford38v8 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: SF Bay Area Posts: 6,646	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Clem, anything that can allow your engine and differential to move in opposite directions will cause chatter. With good tight chatter rods, motor mounts, transmission mounts, and rear spring mount, the remaining causes are clutch related: Oil on the clutch, worn clutch, weak or broken clutch springs, incorrect pressure plate finger adjustments, all of those and more, plus the design of the system itself is prone to cause chatter. __________________ Alan

03-22-2013, 07:33 PM	#14
gearhead1952 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Julesburg, Colorado Posts: 714	Re: clutch chatter in reverse I've found my 52 F1 chatters in reverse and sometimes going forward if I drive it like my daily driver ford ranger which is more gas than clutch. If I give the F1 more clutch less gas it is much smoother. My brain forgets this every time I get in my F1 until it chatters and I remember what I am driving and what I need to do.

03-22-2013, 08:54 PM	#15
Clem Clement Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Fairfax, VA Posts: 3,393	Re: clutch chatter in reverse I have a howl which I interprete as a weak uni. When I got the truck I remove the buscuits and checked them. The 39 has a 35 tranny installed. When I find a 39 tranny and the pedals, I'll freshen the entire mess.

03-22-2013, 09:27 PM	#16
Mark Slight Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Dixon, CA Posts: 473	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Answer; 1935-1941 Stay Rods are 12 13/16" from center of the eye to the flange. Ford part number 48 6044. Don't have diam. Mark

03-22-2013, 10:15 PM	#17
columbiA Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 1,746	Re: clutch chatter in reverse Any looseness anywhere in the driveline will cause chatter.Rear hubs loose on axles & aworn U joint.The Merc town sedans seem the worst because of the longer W B & increased weight.I had a 47 Monarch TS which was almost impossible to drive.I pulled the RE & the rear splines on DS & in the coupling were worn almost as thin as razor blades! The U J was totally worn out,as well as the front DS brg & brg surface on DS.There was not a hint of lube in the UJ or front brg.I replaced all the parts & it was fine.The37-48,s with the 6-spline DS seem to be quite prone to looseness in the splines.I have pulled many of those RE,s apart & found worn splines.If you are lucky the splines will only be worn on the front 1/2 of the coupling & will be good on the pinion.I have hardly ever found worn-out splines on the early 10-spline DS,s.

03-24-2013, 08:40 AM	#19
theodore Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Longmont,CO Posts: 23	Re: clutch chatter in reverse where are the chatter rods on a 34 roadster? I don't see them on mine.