Ford Script Badge On Radiator Shell

[Fred]

How many & who were the makers of this Blue Enamel piece ?/.. Also what are all the different types of attaching backs were there ??..

[Franchise_24]

The 2 types I know of that are sold now is the one you hammer in which I believe was the original, and there are ones with a screw to go in behind it. When I put mine on we put a cloth over it and gently pounded it in with a rubber malet and it looks great!!

[d.j. moordigian]

Originally Posted by Fred

Also what are all the different types of attaching backs were there ??..

I know of just 2, the standard looking ones with the round disc and
the VE style for the 2 "slots"........one on either side of the hole in
the shell. I wonder if the prototype shells just had the slots....
something to think about?

[dean from bozeman]

Howdy d.j.,

I have seen two ve28 radiator shells with that were NOS. Both had the slots but neither script badge (Is that the real name of those things?) had tabs. They both were the hammer in type.

When talking with other e28 guys about them I found out that no one has ever seen a two tab one. I wonder if the two tab one never made it out of the prototype stage. I would imagine that they could have vibrated quite a bit with just two tabs holding them in place.

[Midwest Tin]

Hi Dean,
I found some rad shell emblems and this one was the odd ball. Is this the ve emblem. On the back side it's marked ( AD-SEAL, Indpls ) Jim

[Tudortomnz]

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I have one made by D.Laud Co., Columbus Ohio. It actually came off a 1930 Canadian car, so there is no enamel as they were dull nickel or chrome plated.
The 1928's/ early '29's in Canada came with a dark blue/blk enamelled badge.
My Tudor has a dull nickeled badge made in Toronto, but I am not taking it off to find the maker!
All the ones I have seen have the brazed on circular pressed 'foot' which wedged into the hole in the 'shell.

[Charles Reese]

one of mine is stamped robbins/attleboro, cant make out the other

[d.j. moordigian]

Originally Posted by dean from bozeman

Howdy d.j.,

I have seen two ve28 radiator shells with that were NOS. Both had the slots but neither script badge (Is that the real name of those things?) had tabs. They both were the hammer in type.

When talking with other e28 guys about them I found out that no one has ever seen a two tab one. I wonder if the two tab one never made it out of the prototype stage. I would imagine that they could have vibrated quite a bit with just two tabs holding them in place.

Hi Dean,

I believe Doc K has one.....I thought it was in one of the magazines.
You know...all the "good stuff"is back East....lol
btw....my lace up shell is as you describe.

[Charles Reese]

I don't recall where i copied this from ... most likely a Doc K article. On closer inspection, could this be a top/down view of the style Midwest Tin posted earlier. I don't know the size of the 'slots' in the shell or of his tabs.

on the other hand, the 'slots' seem to be small rectangles (at least in this one shell i have a pix of-not mine), while the tabs seem rather large in comparison and have a convexity to them ... which would imply another style to fit into the single hole mount in the shell

MT: hope you don't mind, i took the liberty of 'fiddling' with your pix to lighten them so we can see the details. cr

[dean from bozeman]

The photos shown by Charles Reese and Jim Sinclair are of early emblems but were not made to fit in the tabs. The slots for tabs were wider spaced and smaller. From the top view you can see that they have the same diameter for fitting into the center hole on the radiator shell.

I would think that these were Ford's first attempt at an attachment device. I would imagine that they saw that these tabs could bend independently and make it difficult to put on. Therefore they went to the round device that we are all familiar with.

[Gary Karr]

Here is what the early shell looks like with the two tab slots in addition to the round center hole.

[plind]

I have Early Shell, and to tap Ford Badge, but i did not have a pic here on my PC.. When i am home in DK Again, i will try to locate the Shell and send some Pictures..

Per,

[Charles Reese]

Originally Posted by Gary Karr

Here is what the early shell looks like with the two tab slots in addition to the round center hole.

fascinating!!! is the piece in the large circle an original part of the shell or a residual piece of an old emblem?

btw: i love this forum site!!

[dlshady]

I'd actually never looked that close until this thread came up, but I've had a few of these and they all had the slug in the hole. Closer inspection reveals that the "slug" you see in the hole was originally the retaining part of the emblem and the solder broke loose when the emblem was removed. The rectangular holes look to have been there to keep the emblem level and if you'll notice, the hole on the driver side is smaller than the passenger side so the emblem can't be installed upside down.

Editing to add:

I wasn't paying attention to the photos posted above. The slug shown in Gary's shell and the one below is what you see on the back of the two emblems in post #7 above. Like Dean said, I've never seen an emblem with the two tabs either which makes me think that maybe it was originally designed to have them and then was revised either before production started or very soon thereafter. Probably one of those deals where the dies for the shell were already made and there wasn't any reason to go back and change them. Just my guess...

[Fred]

Ok, Here are four more pictures of the item in question. This one and two more I have show nothing in the way of ever being soldered to another piece & pulled apart.. The picture Gary shows, I think, does show that the one we see most with the button type, push in back, has pulled off is base.. I also have a shell just like it.. All of the ones like this one were made by the same company..

[dlshady]

As you said, Gary's shell and mine both have the backs of the emblem (as pictured in post #7) stuck in the hole. You can see what's left of the solder in my photo. The four pictures you posted above are another snap-in type (which looks like it would be MUCH easier to remove intact). So that makes two variations of attachment. Is that all there were?

[Fred]

It also means two different types of shells... The side slots are not the same ??.. So do we have a Very early type of shell that this style fits ??.. Or was this the first type made & did not hold up & was changed to the one with center piece & tabs ??..

[Charles Reese]

after studying Midwest Tin's and Fred's latest pix, I'm inclined to think the emblem in Doc K's article is the same style as theirs and NOT one that would have fit into the 'slots' as suggested in the article. Suspect the idea of a design change is the most logical explanation ... likely they thought the prong/slot attachment would not hold up under use. .. the 'full cup' design would provide more surface contact to the shell ... is there any evidence that the 'cup' was ever soldered from the back side to keep it in place?

[dlshady]

If you look at the pictures Gary and I posted of the VE28 shells, you'll see that the slots on either side of the center hole are different sizes. This would indicate (in my mind, at least) that these slots were for the purpose of alignment rather than attachment. The different size slots would eliminate the possibility of the emblem being installed upside down, just like the terminals on modern electrical plugs. I don't believe these slots were ever intended or used for retaining the emblem.

Having said that, I have never seen or heard of an emblem that had both the center retention "cup" (for lack of a better description) AND tabs on either side. If I understood Dean's post correctly, he's discussed this with some other VE28 guys and they haven't ever seen one either. That would indicate that either such an emblem was never made or was phased out extremely early. If it was never made, it might be a case where the emblem was originally designed to have them but was changed (for whatever reason) before any were produced, but after the tooling was completed for the shell. Hard to say but I suspect that the engineering releases might shed a little light on the subject.

In regards to the photos that Fred and Midwest Tin posted of the oddball emblem with the two larger tabs, unless my monitor is really out of whack it sure looks like those tabs are large enough and have the proper radius to snap into the large center hole. Have either of you measured the spacing on those tabs, or possibly tried to snap it into a standard shell? If they were designed to snap into slots in the shell, wouldn't you think they would be straight instead of curved? Looks to me like they are just a different design possibly from a different supplier. Or it could have been a short-lived design change that didn't work as well as intended, resulting in a change back to the old full round retainer. Again, I would think the engineering releases would shed some light on this.

Originally Posted by Charles Reese

after studying Midwest Tin's and Fred's latest pix, I'm inclined to think the emblem in Doc K's article is the same style as theirs and NOT one that would have fit into the 'slots' as suggested in the article. Suspect the idea of a design change is the most logical explanation ... likely they thought the prong/slot attachment would not hold up under use. .. the 'full cup' design would provide more surface contact to the shell ... is there any evidence that the 'cup' was ever soldered from the back side to keep it in place?

The solder that I was referencing is where the cup was soldered to the emblem itself. Soldering an emblem into place after everything is nickel plated wouldn't make any sense because it would discolor the plating.

[Tom Wesenberg]

I agree with everything dishady just said.
Looking at the retainer in Fred's pictures in #15, I wonder if this is a repro badge?
It just doesn't seem to have the retainer quality Ford would have used.