10-04-2021, 11:20 AM | #1 |
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Fender patch
Does anyone make a patch for the rear of the front fender where it attaches to the running board ? I can fab the right angles, but cannot form the bead shape which grasps the wire and extends up about 3/4".
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10-04-2021, 07:15 PM | #2 |
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Re: Fender patch
find a junk fender and cut it for your patch
CL is a good source. |
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10-05-2021, 06:43 AM | #3 |
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Re: Fender patch
Junk fenders are the best patch.
What fender do you have? It matters a lot. For 30-31 there are several styles and they are different enough the patches are not likely to work. There is the early 30 eye brow fender. The regular 30, for 31 there are the long crease and short crease. The 31 type is tought to see until you look for it and see them side by side. The one type the crease in the middle the runs front to back goes fairly far down to the 'flat' part of the fender. These will be more rounded in cross section. While the short crease will be flatter. Oh, and yes you can find factory cars with a mix of the long and short crease. Ya, too much information I know. |
10-05-2021, 07:01 AM | #4 |
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Re: Fender patch
Based on what I saw at Gilmore, even a 'junk' fender brings strong enough money where it is questionable if it is the right decision to cut it up. Most fenders all crack, or deteriorate in the same places, so this typically makes them useless as a donor.
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10-05-2021, 08:00 AM | #5 |
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Re: Fender patch
I haven't been in the hobby long enough to accumulate spare parts, so have no junk fender available. If it weren't for the bead above the wire, I could easily fab a patch myself. Part of my limitation is that I have no milling machine or lathe. My fabrications are all done with welder, grinder, and hammer.
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10-05-2021, 08:32 AM | #6 | |
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Re: Fender patch
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10-05-2021, 09:51 AM | #7 |
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Re: Fender patch
My condolences on the passing of your wife. I appreciate the comment about confidence. I have plenty of confidence in my abilities, but I am no good at faking it. Attached is a photo of my situation, and I have a sheet of 16 ga just for the purpose of making patches.. I would very much appreciate a phone call with you, but take all time time needed for your personal needs.
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10-05-2021, 11:03 AM | #8 |
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Re: Fender patch
I've made forms from thin plywood that fit the inside of a bead shape like that. I have a heavy steel plate on my forming table and all sorts of old chisels that are reformed into forming chasers and swages. Clamp the proper thickness of sheet steel stock over the form piece of plywood and start chasing the edge into that shape. That patch is so short that it wouldn't take long to do that and then leave the part that rolls over the wire long so it can be formed with enough length to match the original wire bead. The bend of the fender for the top and bottom edges are not complicated bends and that part of the fender is pretty flat so there wouldn't be a lot more forming to do there.
I purchased a DVD on metal shaping from David Gardiner a long time ago that covers a multitude of different forming techniques. https://www.classicmetalshaping.co.uk/ He has U-tube videos but the DVD goes in depth. Metal Meet is another site I followed for a while. I use cold rolled 1008 AKDQ sheet metal in the proper American Standard Gauge for forming but "old" car body steel can sometimes be used. Draw quality is the easiest to form for complex panels. I still weld with oxy-acetylene and hammer with basic hammers and dollies. Folks repaired stuff this way back in to the early days of coach building. It's sort of a lost art now but it's not as hard as a person might think. |
10-06-2021, 06:16 PM | #9 |
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Re: Fender patch
Hi Russell. I can help you to make that piece up. Give me a call 705-715-7628. JP
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10-06-2021, 08:20 PM | #10 |
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Re: Fender patch
Just about any section of bead from a front or rear fender could be used to make the patch. Of course welding the patch is significantly easier with a TIG welder.
Not sure if it was just the light, but it looks like there is some brazing. If there is then you need to go back to good metal. Also the layer of bondo is too thick for my likeing. I would strip the fender to bare metal to see what shape it is in from front to rear. I would not do any work to the fender off the frame. All work MUST be done on the frame with a fender bracket first fit to the headlamp bar and the running board brackets straightened. You need a splash apron and a running board on the frame too. You align the engine side edge of the fender to the inside edge of the frame and work it from there. The reason for needing to be mounted is because a slight change in the bead line can have significant affects to the final fender shape. Think drooping fender fronts and the like. Also the crease line running front to rear can be made better with a dull chisle, but it take 4 hands to do the job. Someone has to hold the dolly while you do the hits. You will find that line is lost on many fenders at car shows. Probably too much information, but they are based on lessons learned the hard way. |
10-07-2021, 07:49 AM | #11 | |
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Re: Fender patch
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10-07-2021, 07:56 AM | #12 |
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Re: Fender patch
“Just about any section of bead from a front or rear fender could be used to make the patch.”
Kevin is pretty much spot on. You seem to be patching the front of the fender where it attached to the RB. Some piece of bead likely can be cannibalized for a small piece. However, if one were patching the usuall splitting areas on fronts or rears, the exact curvature is almost impossible to find except for that exact area. So making it is virtually necessary. Kevin used to/has a detail of making such on his website Last edited by Oldbluoval; 10-07-2021 at 08:17 AM. |
10-07-2021, 08:25 AM | #13 |
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Re: Fender patch
Here is a link to my experiences in getting fenders to work on my car:
https://www.cabriolet.piklefactory.com/front_fender.htm The thing the got me in the end was most of it was not the need of lots of tools, but thinking it all through with a proper understanding of metal movememt. What really changed my view of metal work was when I understand what it ment to shrink metal and when metal is shrunk. From there I was able to start making huge progress in what amount to advanced metal work. But in reality it is not so advanced, just applying correct knowledge. The real issue is the amount if incorrect knowledge out there that really screws you up. If you have a lot of metal work you want to do I cant tell you how much better life is with a decent TIG welder. They can be pricey but there are some decent lower cost units out there that will let you get the job done. If you are older and cant see close anymore get cheaters, magnifying glasses, for your helmet. Enjoy. |
10-07-2021, 08:55 AM | #14 | |
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Re: Fender patch
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10-08-2021, 04:15 PM | #15 |
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Re: Fender patch
I don't see where anyone commented, but Russell said 16 gage ! Way too heavy for this repair. Lots of luck forming that around the bead. Should be something about half as thick.
Joe B |
10-08-2021, 04:22 PM | #16 |
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Re: Fender patch
Had a good phone discussion with John Poole (Tinbasher) who introduced me to the dull cold chisel, and confirmed your view that 16 ga is too heavy. I picked up some small pieces of 18 ga from my steel dealer, and spent the day building my patch. Haven't rolled around the wire yet, but otherwise came out OK.
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10-08-2021, 04:36 PM | #17 |
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Re: Fender patch
19 is best but hard to find in small quantity
I’d use 20 |
10-08-2021, 04:58 PM | #18 |
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Re: Fender patch
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10-08-2021, 05:37 PM | #19 |
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Re: Fender patch
There’s a method often poo-poo’d by experienced welders…..
Slugging….back up a weld with either carbon or copper to prevent blow-thru Admittedly i do it occasionally particularly on thin or pitted metal that can’t be cut back to as solid as wanted |
10-08-2021, 08:20 PM | #20 |
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Re: Fender patch
While we are on the subject of steel gage thicknesses... just for info, US Standard gages, in the neighborhood of auto body work.
16 - .0625" 17 - .0563 18 - .0500 19 - .0438 20 - .0375 21 - .0344 22 - .0313 |
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