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Old 04-12-2017, 07:20 PM   #1
Eskildsm
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Default Model A quit while driving -- won't start

So took model A out for drive -- started down my lane and going downhill and car lurches then dies. I have plenty fuel that's not issue. I put new condenser in-- no help-- I find the fuse blown ( yes should check that first) I put new fuse in and turn it over still won't start- look and fuse is blown -- get another one it blows while I'm trying to put it in. So disconnect battery and put fuse in then hook battery back up and before I can get to fuse its fried. So I bypass the fuse and have hot where battery hooks to starter but no where else. Earlier I had also put new amp meter in and no help!!! Any ideas???
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:22 PM   #2
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

If you are blowing fuses you have a short.....if you bypass the fuse you are asking for that short to become something serious...like a fire...

How many amps were the fuses you used rated for?
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:23 PM   #3
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Pull the dash and check for grounding at the back of the new amp meter. I would tape the terminals as well as the switch.

If you pull the dash and insert a new fuse, that will also tell you if that is where the short might be.
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:25 PM   #4
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

No more fuses. You have a short that you must find. Don't change any more parts. Disconnect the light harness at the generator and scratch across the fuse block. If it sparks, the short is still there. If not, it's in the light circuit. Could be the brake light switch. Should be easy to find and fix.
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:27 PM   #5
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

A recent thread worth reading

http://fordbarn.com/forum/showthread...=Blowing+fuses
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:27 PM   #6
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

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Did you touch any of the connections in the terminal box on the firewall? Some replacement terminal boxes will short to ground on the back side if the studs rotate while tightening.
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:29 PM   #7
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

STOP Dive bombing....Do a logical trouble shooting program, start at the battery and continue from that point and follow the MODEL A Wire diagram.. No reason to change this and that....start from 1 point and go forward and you WILL find it....
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:36 PM   #8
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Time to try the 5th fuse?

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Old 04-12-2017, 07:43 PM   #9
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Put a testlight inline between the wire and the starter lug. With the short there the light will be lit. Once the short is found the light will go off. This saves fuses, wiring and a fire
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:55 PM   #10
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Per last response put test lite between wire and starter lug I assume u mean where the battery connects to starter but what wire are you talking about hooking to??
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Old 04-12-2017, 07:57 PM   #11
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Just put the 2 ends of the test light on the fuse holder clamps, like in place of the fuse.
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Old 04-12-2017, 08:19 PM   #12
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Watch out on those fuse holders to. They come loose and sometimes cause a short. Yes the battery stud at the starter and the harness wire that connected to the fuse holder. Thats the only wire there
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Old 04-12-2017, 08:23 PM   #13
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Also when I put the second fuse in before it blew it sparked at the cut out on top of the generator. Does that part go bad frequently??
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Old 04-12-2017, 08:26 PM   #14
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Mitch -- understand now where to connect. Question -- when I bypassed the fuse and holder if the fuse holder is shorting than the car should have started correct.
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Old 04-12-2017, 08:31 PM   #15
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

With the test light installed it will not start
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Old 04-12-2017, 08:34 PM   #16
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Eskildsm,
ALWAYS listen to Mitch//pa, he knows his SH*T & will never steer you wrong!----I "taught" him.
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Old 04-12-2017, 08:53 PM   #17
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

The test lite wasn't in-- I pulled wire going from starter to fuse ( thus bypassing the fuse) but car still wouldn't start so leads me to believe the fuse holder isn't shorted out!! Am I thinking this correctly.
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Old 04-12-2017, 09:06 PM   #18
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Remove the two wire terminals on the cutout, then see if the test light still stays lit. If not, then install the fuse and start the car. Since you saw a spark at the cutout, you know something isn't right up there. Someone might have used the wrong length screws, which can short to ground. The cutout has a thick and thin insulating washers. The thick one is for the output side.
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Old 04-13-2017, 12:39 PM   #19
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Ok so I did the light deal between fuse holder end. Light came on the wentout when I disconnected the single black wire at back of generator. Tried to start car nothing. The hooked black wire back up and put light back on fuses it stayed off so then disconnected 2 wires at other end generator and installed fuse and tried to start and nothing. Hooked both back up and fuse still good-- tried to start and nothing but fuse is blown now -- guessing something intermittent going on shorting out fuse. Ideas??
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Old 04-13-2017, 01:00 PM   #20
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

From what you just wrote, it sounds like you have one wire on one side of the cutout, and two wires on the other side. The cutout should have only two terminals on the output side of the cutout, and one of those terminals may have two wires, one for the lights and one for the horn.

The input side of the cutout should only have a metal strap to the generator stud. If you have a post Model A production generator, then it might have two wires coming out of the case, so one will feed power to the cutout, and the other wire is the field ground wire and gets mounted under the cutout mounting screw.
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Old 04-13-2017, 01:14 PM   #21
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

When I first got my truck the generator was wired like this picture...the stud had been removed and replaced by a wire...

Does your generator look like this??

This is not original but it worked....

There are two wires on the front where the cutout is marked batt...but you can only see one...

And here is a wiring diagram....
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File Type: jpg 2015_0814modelajeep1168.jpg (66.5 KB, 35 views)
File Type: jpg wiring-diagramcolor2sm.jpg (92.7 KB, 18 views)
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Old 04-13-2017, 01:17 PM   #22
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

I cant seem to attach picture of it! Single black wire at back and 2 wires at front.
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Old 04-13-2017, 01:20 PM   #23
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

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Originally Posted by Eskildsm View Post
I cant seem to attach picture of it! Single black wire at back and 2 wires at front.

After you "choose file" be sure to click "upload".....
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Old 04-13-2017, 01:27 PM   #24
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

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Old 04-13-2017, 01:32 PM   #25
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

I have another 1930 model A so thinking taking generator and cutout switch off it and putting on this one. However just got notified daughter in law in Spokane having pregnancy problems and they have to take baby so packing up to head that way will be back on model A issue first part next week. Keep info coming though and I will compile when get back.
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Old 04-13-2017, 04:01 PM   #26
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Your wiring looks pretty beat up. The generator definitely isn't wired correctly. If the wire coming out is the output wire, then it's grounding the output and keeping the generator at 0 volts. The other two wires on the output side look like they could be touching the case and shorting to ground, and this could be your short that is blowing the fuse.
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Old 04-13-2017, 05:06 PM   #27
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Ive been driving this car for 6 months with no electrical issues and ammeter always showed positive charge. Would seem strange it ran so good if wiring is that screwed up to the generator. Will start workin on it next week.
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Old 04-13-2017, 05:19 PM   #28
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

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Originally Posted by Eskildsm View Post
Ive been driving this car for 6 months with no electrical issues and ammeter always showed positive charge. Would seem strange it ran so good if wiring is that screwed up to the generator. Will start workin on it next week.
The wiring is beat up looking, but it can still be usable as long as it doesn't have bare spots that short to ground. My 28 also has beat up looking wiring, but it works fine, and I'll install my new harness when I restore the car.

The fuse may have worked for 6 months, but it's good to have it installed correctly so the copper strap hits the contact better, and to make sure the fuse mounting metal doesn't slip in far enough to short something.
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Old 04-13-2017, 05:29 PM   #29
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

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Ive been driving this car for 6 months with no electrical issues and ammeter always showed positive charge. Would seem strange it ran so good if wiring is that screwed up to the generator. Will start workin on it next week.
I don't see how it could be charging with wires only hooked to one side of
the cutout and the wire coming out of the generator going to ground.

Bob
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Old 04-13-2017, 05:57 PM   #30
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start



If you're not getting spark this should help. If when your engine warms up might be a condenser or coil... When the car dies check for 6v around the system.
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Old 04-13-2017, 06:31 PM   #31
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

OK, this may be way out there, but it happened to me. Someone opened the generator cut out, and just set the cover back on. Driving one day, it just quit as you mentioned and also blew the fuse.
Bottom line, in checking for the short I finally found the cover had settled and was shorting to the base thus blowing the fuse. Replaced the cujt out with a new diode type. all has been good since. Thought of this when you saw a spark at the cut out.
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Old 04-13-2017, 10:44 PM   #32
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Funny you say that as the top on mine is loose as well I can pick it up and take it on and off. Thanks
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Old 04-13-2017, 11:06 PM   #33
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

Look at your brake light switch...Ill bet the plunger has dislodged and shorted out
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Old 04-14-2017, 12:43 AM   #34
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

I only use original cutouts, which have the covers spot welded to the base. The spot welds can be broken loose so the cutout can be restored. The cover will be a snug fit, so it won't need to be spot welded again. The screws and insulating washers also hold the cover in the proper position, so it can't short out unless someone uses screws that are too long, or the insulating fiberboard is missing between the inside of the cover and the terminals.
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Old 04-14-2017, 03:12 PM   #35
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

If I remember correctly I had just hit the brakes shortly before it died so will need to check the brake lite switch -- where exactly is that located??
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Old 04-14-2017, 03:30 PM   #36
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

The hardest place to get to on the road. Right under the center of the car. Just behind your brake pedal rod. That's why I recommend a fuse in that circuit.
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Old 04-14-2017, 04:44 PM   #37
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

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If I remember correctly I had just hit the brakes shortly before it died so will need to check the brake lite switch -- where exactly is that located??
Eskildsm, you may have found it. I had same problem when I pushed my brake down hard one time. The switch has a rod through it and if you hit the brakes hard, it can pull the rod clear through the brake switch and short (at least that is what mine did-the switch was not adjusted correctly).

The switch , at least on my rigs, is under the floor boards just under the drivers feet. The switch is bolted to the tranny (at least on my two rigs).

The way to fixed it was to adjust the brake switch at the tranny. The bolts holes on the switch have a slot so that you can move the switch. You want to make sure that if you put a lot of pressure on the brake, it will not pull the rod through the switch.

This situation could be why you were able to run for 6 months and then this happen. Caused by your brake wear and the peddle going down more.
Good luck.
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Old 04-14-2017, 05:47 PM   #38
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Default Re: Model A quit while driving -- won't start

I actually just completed a complete brake job adjustment on it -- adjusting all the rods one by one and adjusting brake shoes to match rod adjustments -- the brakes actually would almost go to the floor before the adjustment and now only goes down about 2 inches before solid brakes but possibly the rod came out after the adjustment!
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Old 04-14-2017, 06:35 PM   #39
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I actually just completed a complete brake job adjustment on it -- adjusting all the rods one by one and adjusting brake shoes to match rod adjustments -- the brakes actually would almost go to the floor before the adjustment and now only goes down about 2 inches before solid brakes but possibly the rod came out after the adjustment!
I hope you adjusted the brake shoes FIRST, then adjusted the rods to fit.
Rod adjustment is the last step.
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