The Ford Barn

Roadster62 · 03-02-2013, 12:44 PM

Nobody ever noticed before, now we'll look at every 30-31 in a different light. Bob

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig Lewis

BINGO....thanks woody.
That indented area (left of the silver screw) has a raised dimple in the centre. Does everyone see it??
The dimple seems to appear on 31 cowls...yet not on 30 cowls.

I knocked out the my dimples

and could sure use more closeup pix like this one so I can put em back.
Thanks again for anyone that can help.

lajones · 03-02-2013, 12:55 PM

I have a 31 SW and 31 CCPU, I will see if I can help.

Tom Wesenberg · 03-02-2013, 01:16 PM

Now look what you started Craig! Now we'll all have to start taking pills for OCD.

Craig Lewis · 03-02-2013, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

Now look what you started Craig! Now we'll all have to start taking pills for OCD.

Prozac pills won't help...especially once we start finding details that aren't noted in the Judging standards (yet)

I'm now working on a clamping device to put my dimples back in.
Still need more pictures of that spot if you guys can help.

Roadster62 · 03-02-2013, 02:19 PM

How will we know it is a factory dimple and not a gob of Bondo you forgot to sand smooth?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig Lewis

Prozac pills won't help...especially once we start finding details that aren't noted in the Judging standards (yet)

I'm now working on a clamping device to put my dimples back in.
Still need more pictures of that spot if you guys can help.

Craig Lewis · 03-02-2013, 03:04 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadster62

How will we know it is a factory dimple and not a gob of Bondo you forgot to sand smooth?

Reading glasses can help.
...you're on your own with the comedy.

BILL WILLIAMSON · 03-02-2013, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A31Woody

PHEW! Only took on camera flash and a flashlight to get the shadows filled in!

Woody, is PHEW! one step above or below WHEW!??
Maybe Otto Klingendorfer was puttin' in the gas tank valves on the assembly line, and he put the ding on with his ball pein hammer, as his trademark! Where was the car assembled? My S.F. car didn't have the ding, or the dong, or whatever you call one that goes OUT instead of IN!
Now I WORRY about that DING that I fixed on the lower front of my R/R fender WAS supposed to be there, or if I should have made a matching one on th L/R fender??????? Bill W.

Craig Lewis · 03-02-2013, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON

Woody, is PHEW! one step above or below WHEW!??
Maybe Otto Klingendorfer was puttin' in the gas tank valves on the assembly line, and he put the ding on with his ball pein hammer, as his trademark! Where was the car assembled? My S.F. car didn't have the ding, or the dong, or whatever you call one that goes OUT instead of IN!
Now I WORRY about that DING that I fixed on the lower front of my R/R fender WAS supposed to be there, or if I should have made a matching one on th L/R fender??????? Bill W.

Ha ha, maybe this was Otto.
Speakin of glasses...wonder why it was perfectly safe to spray molten lead in the good ol days

A31Woody · 03-02-2013, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadster62

How will we know it is a factory dimple and not a gob of Bondo you forgot to sand smooth?

ha! I'm pretty sure my car was restored pre-bondo.

Now get this... I don't have one on the driver's side. Not sure if I'll be able to sleep tonight... What OCD?

Craig Lewis · 03-02-2013, 09:46 PM

Well here's what I ended up with. Not sure what that clamp was designed for, but the Model A lug nut makes it all legit (at least in my little world)

Thanks again to the handfull of guys who took time to help out.

Roadster62 · 03-02-2013, 10:01 PM

Craig, How do you plan on replicating the original spot welds on the cowl sides to firewall? I'm sort of in the same spot, new Brookville sides to attack to an original assembled firewall/sub rail. Bob

Craig Lewis · 03-03-2013, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadster62

Craig, How do you plan on replicating the original spot welds on the cowl sides to firewall? I'm sort of in the same spot, new Brookville sides to attack to an original assembled firewall/sub rail. Bob

The welding steps aren't quite finalized. I only had tig & mig on hand till quite recently when a fine gentleman lent me his Lenco 3000 spot welder.
It packs a punch of 2600 amps through 2 hand held electrodes with 1/8 copper tips....first time I tried it felt like russian roulette!
This should do it except I have a problem ...that nobody wants to stand inside my cowl and hold the other electrode

Option 2 (the strongest weld) would be mig through 1/4" holes, grind smooth and add cosmetic spots just to the front with the big spot welder.

My spot weld area was originally broken loose by some big ape with an air chisel or prybar it looked like. The firewall was unrepairable. It's taken dozens of hours to metal work this area straight and still a bit to go cuz you don't bondo over spot welds...nor spot weld over bondo.

Roadster62 · 03-03-2013, 08:41 AM

New spot welds or Rosette welds through inside holes may be the way to go, that way you'd have the original spots on the outside. With all the Roadster lower patch work being done on several projects i trust you checked your cowl,door and quarter panel lowere beads. Turns out many differ. If you need any dimentions my cowl is on the work table. Bob .... PS, If we lived closed I'd help with the inside spot welding.

Craig Lewis · 03-03-2013, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadster62

New spot welds or Rosette welds through inside holes may be the way to go, that way you'd have the original spots on the outside. With all the Roadster lower patch work being done on several projects i trust you checked your cowl,door and quarter panel lowere beads. Turns out many differ. If you need any dimentions my cowl is on the work table. Bob .... PS, If we lived closed I'd help with the inside spot welding.

What were you doing 9 days ago?
see post 1, 6, 7, 10, 12, 17, 19 & 24.

Roadster62 · 03-03-2013, 03:05 PM

I've been here since day one, checked my original cowl sides and didn't see any dimples. Bob

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig Lewis

What were you doing 9 days ago?
see post 1, 6, 7, 10, 12, 17, 19 & 24.

Craig Lewis · 03-03-2013, 03:29 PM

OK thanks for looking. I'll try and share my findings and some pictures when the welding is complete.

Roadster62 · 03-03-2013, 05:31 PM

I hope you use that spot welder and post photos of the results. With some practice I would think you could respot the original welds and things would look as new. Bob

Roadster62 · 03-03-2013, 07:24 PM

Back to page one and the original question: could the dimple be there because someone put the rivet in backwards? This photo shows my firewall and the detached original side panel. Head is on the inside waffel pattern rivet set is on the outside. If the head was on the outside it would be higher and require a dimple. Bob

Craig Lewis · 03-04-2013, 02:16 AM

My car originally had the dimpled indents but didn't come with any inside cowl lamp braces. Also the dimple has a relatively large, soft rounded shape ....much bigger than a rivet head.

My own theorys so far are...
1) since the indent was a fairy deep draw in the stamping process, maybe that part of the die gradually wore down at it's point and changed the shape.
This could explain why I'm only finding the dimpled indents on some 1931 cowls and not 1930 when the dies were still sharp??
2) another theory is they made the indents shallower to allow for a bucking bar to be inserted so that the cowl arm brace could be riveted in at a later date?
Nothing to base this on...just guessing.

03-02-2013, 12:55 PM	#22
lajones Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Zachary, LA Posts: 112	Re: 31 Cowl differences I have a 31 SW and 31 CCPU, I will see if I can help.

03-02-2013, 01:16 PM	#23
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: 31 Cowl differences Now look what you started Craig! Now we'll all have to start taking pills for OCD.

03-02-2013, 10:01 PM	#31
Roadster62 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Ridgefield, Ct Posts: 3,441	Re: 31 Cowl differences Craig, How do you plan on replicating the original spot welds on the cowl sides to firewall? I'm sort of in the same spot, new Brookville sides to attack to an original assembled firewall/sub rail. Bob __________________ They don't have to run to be enjoyed. I'm here to enjoy the hobby, and enjoy the cars no matter what they look like. Most of the worlds problems are electrical.

03-03-2013, 08:41 AM	#33
Roadster62 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Ridgefield, Ct Posts: 3,441	Re: 31 Cowl differences New spot welds or Rosette welds through inside holes may be the way to go, that way you'd have the original spots on the outside. With all the Roadster lower patch work being done on several projects i trust you checked your cowl,door and quarter panel lowere beads. Turns out many differ. If you need any dimentions my cowl is on the work table. Bob .... PS, If we lived closed I'd help with the inside spot welding. __________________ They don't have to run to be enjoyed. I'm here to enjoy the hobby, and enjoy the cars no matter what they look like. Most of the worlds problems are electrical.

03-03-2013, 03:29 PM	#36
Craig Lewis Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Parksville B.C. Canada Posts: 880	Re: 31 Cowl differences OK thanks for looking. I'll try and share my findings and some pictures when the welding is complete.

03-03-2013, 05:31 PM	#37
Roadster62 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Ridgefield, Ct Posts: 3,441	Re: 31 Cowl differences I hope you use that spot welder and post photos of the results. With some practice I would think you could respot the original welds and things would look as new. Bob __________________ They don't have to run to be enjoyed. I'm here to enjoy the hobby, and enjoy the cars no matter what they look like. Most of the worlds problems are electrical.

03-04-2013, 02:16 AM	#39
Craig Lewis Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Parksville B.C. Canada Posts: 880	Re: 31 Cowl differences My car originally had the dimpled indents but didn't come with any inside cowl lamp braces. Also the dimple has a relatively large, soft rounded shape ....much bigger than a rivet head. My own theorys so far are... 1) since the indent was a fairy deep draw in the stamping process, maybe that part of the die gradually wore down at it's point and changed the shape. This could explain why I'm only finding the dimpled indents on some 1931 cowls and not 1930 when the dies were still sharp?? 2) another theory is they made the indents shallower to allow for a bucking bar to be inserted so that the cowl arm brace could be riveted in at a later date? Nothing to base this on...just guessing.