7 Tooth Steering Rebuild

[tyler]

Looks like it's time to rebuild the steering box and was wondering if I should get the kit that Macs offers or are there better parts out there? Also, are there any good instructions out there on doing this or anything in particular I should be aware of ? The only manual I have only talks about rebuilding the two tooth box. Any help appreciated.

Tyler

[2manycars]

As there is not much to adjust, the 7 tooth box is pretty simple to rebuild. Personally I do not trust the quality of stuff from Macs due to past experience, so I would buy the stuff from Bratton or Snyder.

[wrndln]

I would agree with 2manycars about Mac's parts. Not the best supplier for model A parts. Maybe they are getting better, but they used to have a bad attitude when you called them about a part - like you were bothering them and maybe still do. I haven't bought any parts for them in years. Bratton's or Bert's I believe a better suppliers of parts.

I rebuilt a 7 tooth column about a year ago. I was a little apprehensive about doing it, but it turned out very well. I would just buy the parts you need individually. The most difficult operations are removing the worm gear and installing a new one. The worm is pressed on and has a snap ring retainer. A machine shop should be able to do the work. Maybe you don't need a new worm gear, but if it is worn, it should probably be replaced along with the sector. I bought a new steering shaft with a new worm gear already installed, so I didn't have to remove and replace the worm. I had a bad experience with a crook in LA that I was going to have rebuild 2 steering columns. He kept all my parts and did a terrible job of rebuilding the columns. I had to start over as I had no parts to work with as the crap he used was terrible. End of rant about the crook. The other thing that is hard to do by yourself is install the oil shaft retainer tube. This was not an original part on the 7 tooth column, but it is very useful to keep the lub oil from leaking out into the light switch. You can see what the tube looks like at Bratton's - PN 5030. I found that the tube wouldn't fit inside the hole in the steering shaft, so I had to have a machine shop ream the shaft for it to fit. One other thing to make sure you do is use sealer on the end plate and shims to prevent leaks. Even after using Permatex, I still had a leak from one of the 4 bolts that hold the end plate to the column (even after using a lot of Permatex on the bolts). What I did, after trying a couple other things that didn't work, was take some sowing thread and wrap it around the bolts 12 or 15 times and then tighten the bolts tight. I have had no leaks since it did that 6 or 8 months ago. If you have problems when you starting rebuilding your column, you can sure get advice form Fordbarn members or me.
Rusty Nelson

[tyler]

Thank you both for the replies.

I get most of my stuff from Macs because my wife drives right past the place about once a week so it saves on shipping. I also wonder if, for most of these parts, there is only one manufacturer and that Snyders, Bert's, Mac's all offer the same thing from the same source.

I'm going to have a friend handle this for me, he's very gifted with mechanics and I, not so much. I also have a machine shop that owes me a few favors so removing and installing the worm will be done by pros. I was glad you mentioned the oil shaft tube, Rusty, as that sounds like a good idea.
Are there any articles out there on this?

Thank you both again.

Tyler

[2manycars]

If the cost is what is important to you, then Macs seems to be a good choice. I dont care for substandard parts, so I prefer Brattons and Snyders. There are some parts that only one place manufactures, but there are some that several make, and the quality varies. Your call.

[wrndln]

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Tyler,
Do you have Les Andrew's Mechanics Handbook vol 1? It is available at all model A suppliers for around $35. It has a lot of good information in it. It has a section, along with many more, on how to rebuilt a 7 tooth steering column. There are some errors in the manual, but it is probably the best reference manual for working on model A's. I would certainly recommend to anyone doing work on A's.
Rusty Nelson

[RichPA]

When I did mine, Les was spot on, I followed his procedure and the play went from over 4 inches down to less than one.Here's what I found and corrected:The housing was bent and cracked where the rods exit, this caused misalignment from the top bushing to the bottom, the shaft was hard to turn. I straightened and welded it. The worm and sector gears looked fine but the bearings and bushings were all worn. The bottom of the steering shaft was badly scored. As Les suggested, I turned the shaft down on a lathe and installed an undersize bushing. The replacement sector bushings fit perfect and did not require fitting to the shaft. I used the oring and washer that the vendors sell on the sector which gets squashed between the box and the frame, no leaks. I used the extention tube in the bottom, fit ok with no modification, no leak. It's important to get the right combination of shims and gaskets on the bottom housing so you have no end play. I used a good flat file on the gasket surfaces, and a thin coat of RTV, no leak. I got all the pieces from Bratton's, all fit with no problem. I think this is better than converting to two tooth, JMO. She steers like new. There are many posts on this if you search and I an sure others will chime in, good luck.

[tyler]

Thanks Rich. I couldn't seem to find much technical stuff doing a search. Thanks for the tips and if anyone else has any personal experiences they'd care to share on this, I'd be greatfull. Thanks again.

Tyler

[Kevin in NJ]

The sector and bushings will be a problem.

The dimensions found in some books is just wrong. The bushings supplied by the houses are the wrong size, too large. No wonder so many have loose steering and leaks.

The bushings must be small enough that you have to align hone the bushings to size and you want it tight.

Here are some comments on the sectors I put online:

Steering sectors

[stainless steve]

Love this site ...going to do the same thing to my 7 tooth and here are the answers I needed without asking. Hopefully by first of the month be tearing into mine

[RichPA]

Kevin, the ones I got from Bratton were fine, no honing or loosness..

[Kevin in NJ]

I do not wish to sound mean or nasty in this reply, but I must correct the above statement.

No the ones you got from Brattons are NOT FINE!!!!!!!

They will be very snug. BUT look down the hole after spinning the sector and you will find small areas that are polished. This is the only contact area. I know I installed them and thought great they are nice and snug but realized I had not made them round. So I looked down the hole and sure enough there were small polish areas.

Please understand that tight tolerance bushings MUST be custom fit!!!

There should be only .001" difference in size at most. When you are done align honing the sector bushings the shaft should be very snug in the hole with no discernible play.

When you insert the bushings they deform and will not be parallel. The ones being sold are so large that if they did not deform they would not be tight on a new sector. The bushings will very rapidly wear and you will get much looser and it will leak. If you try to make those bushings the correct size they will be beyond worn out for a NOS sector.

Please understand that the bushings must be far enough undersize when installed that there is enough material that allows you to get the bushings inline and perfectly round. This is best done by align honing to size.

A reamer will work, but you will end up with a looser fit. A reamer will leave high spots which will wear quickly giving you a little bit of play.

As usual, Please DOT NOT trust what I tell you.
Please, take the time to learn about how you are supposed to properly fit bushings and how to use the tooling. It is not rocket science and 2 years ago I did not know better. I am fortunate to have some good tutors and the will to go look up stuff on the net. I have learned over the last few years to build the Model A you need to have a set of accurate measuring devices that can let you consistently measure to less than .001". (Ford was building the parts with .0001" accuracy)
I learned I have not been measuring accurate enough by using dial calipers, they only get you in the ball park.

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by Kevin in NJ

I
They will be very snug. BUT look down the hole after spinning the sector and you will find small areas that are polished. This is the only contact area. I know I installed them and thought great they are nice and snug but realized I had not made them round. So I looked down the hole and sure enough there were small polish areas.


I have learned over the last few years to build the Model A you need to have a set of accurate measuring devices that can let you consistently measure to less than .001". (Ford was building the parts with .0001" accuracy)
I learned I have not been measuring accurate enough by using dial calipers, they only get you in the ball park.

Good idea, I guess after fighting with parts, when they fit snug you don't want to look a gift horse in the mouth but here is a car when one should.

As for the tolerances, it has been said that if you were to bring the Ford drawings to a machine shop for the engine they would think you were building a race engine.

[RichPA]

Kurt, mean and nasty? Not at all, you are sharing great information which is the purpose of this forum. To clarify my experience, at the time I did not know how critical this is. I have a good grip on how bushings are fitted including reaming versus honing. I thought after installing these bushings I would have to bring the unit to a machinist to have them fit as I do not have the equipment. I did use the proper bushing driver to install them and I believe there was minimal deformation. The shaft fit very snug, I turned it in the bushings dry for a while and then checked for high spots. I did not see any problem. I think the biggest problem with these boxes is the fluid leaks out and everything wears. By changing a handful of small parts I took a car that was not driveable and now steers possibly as well as it did when new. For the amount of driving I will do, this thing will outlive me. If I was doing this for a customer, I would take every step to make it perfect. I did this 2 years ago and there is still no play in the sector, I think I lucked out. Anyone reading this forum can gather the information from the experiences of the contributors and make there own decision on how to procede. I think what I did suits my needs, but someone else may want to go further to suit theirs. Sometimes as in my case, budget is also an issue.

[tyler]

Wow, getting more than I had hoped for here. Looks like the machine shop will be definately getting involved since I only want to have to do this once.

Great info. Thanks all.

Tyler

[stainless steve]

took my 7 tooth apart ;had grease in it , so much it looked like a tape worm in there ;cleaned everything shows next to no wear ,even the brass bushings look great nothing bent nothing shiny from wear just put it all back together.need one seal at bottom (felt) and will put 600 back in it . so maybe tear it down and see what you need first.

[31 Victoria]

Originally Posted by tyler

Thank you both for the replies.

I get most of my stuff from Macs because my wife drives right past the place about once a week so it saves on shipping.

Tyler if you are close to Mac's, then you are not terribly far away from Snyder's; at least within a 2-3 hour drive - if you are buying heavy parts, it could be worth your drive to Snyder's, as well, to save the shipping cost.