Largest collection of pre-war Fords- auction details and video

[abill]

Mecum, Dallas, TX 7-10th Sept., 2022
The Butler Estate Collection, 50 plus lots - all at NO RESERVE
Largest collection of pre-war Fords, Lincoln Zephyrs etc etc
Mind blowing collection -projects, hot rods to restored A's,1932;1933,1934 onwards
pick your color, body style, RHD or LHD, 4 or 8 cyl

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsxKMVaxrJk&t=9s

https://www.mecum.com/auctions/dalla...tion/page/all/

Will this be too much at once for this market?

[petehoovie]

The Butler Estate Collection-See the Lots here > https://www.mecum.com/auctions/dalla...tion/page/all/

Awesome video here > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsxKMVaxrJk&t=9s

Mecum Dallas 2022 Sept 7-10

[mercman from oz]

Great Videos of this fantastic Ford Collection.
Hope a Restorer buys them.
Thanks for posting.

[drfromnc]

Amazing collection. May have to add this to my calendar…..to watch the auction.

[rockfla]

For any of the 34 Guru's, any of you notice quite the difference in bodies between the two 34 Victoria's? The right hand drive Vicky (first one in the line-up) has quite a "different" body from back of the doors....QUITE different!!! Wonder IF that is a Dagenham version???

[DavidG]

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Robert,

There was no Dagenham version, but you're right, there's quite a difference in those two bodies and it isn't just the angles of the photos. Judging from the size and shape of the quarter windows and slope of the back panel, the first one, lot W11, is in fact a Tudor sedan modified to permit access to the area behind the rear seat from outside of the car. The color of the interior and all of the add-ons in the engine compartment are consistent with many of the survivors in Argentina.

Many of the sedans and some of the other body types are RHD, but since they likely also came from Argentina (they have that 'look'), they are of U.S. manufacturing origin. Some are simply junk and you have to wonder why he bothered. After all, I like '33-'34s as much as the next guy, maybe even more, but 12 roadsters, 7 cabriolets, 13 phaetons, and 38 coupes plus 45 sedans is overkill.


I suspect that among the more-sought-after body types some bargains will be realized, just as they were at Mecum's auction of the Gene Hetland collection.

[rockfla]

As usual, David....makes perfect sense!! I guess I should have spent more time studying the lines!!!! Purely out of "humoring" myself..... I have my list of "purchases" IF my proverbial "ship" comes in before September (AND "IF" it does - permission to call on you for advice LOL).......Otherwise its a list of my effort in futility!!!

[DavidG]

Robert,

You have done the potential bidders on the second '34 Victoria, Lot T37, a huge favor by drawing our attention to it. Notice that the gas filler cap is on the right side of the car and notice that it is the left side car door that has the lock in it, not the right. Then consider those items on the car in the photo below from Ford's U.S. Archives (unusual in its own right because of the informality of the setting).

Some bidders might not care, but if I were interested, I sure would want to know that the available evidence strongly suggests that this is another RHD car from Argentina that has been restored as a LHD version.

There is nothing inherently wrong with having made the switch (partially) in a restoration as long it is made known to potential bidders, which it is not in the online catalog of the auction.

[rockfla]

Originally Posted by DavidG

Robert,

You have done the potential bidders on the second '34 Victoria, Lot T37, a huge favor by drawing our attention to it. Notice that the gas filler cap is on the right side of the car and notice that it is the left side car door that has the lock in it, not the right. Then consider those items on the car in the photo below from Ford's U.S. Archives (unusual in its own right because of the informality of the setting).

Some bidders might not care, but if I were interested, I sure would want to know that the available evidence strongly suggests that this is another RHD car from Argentina that has been restored as a LHD version.

There is nothing inherently wrong with having made the switch (partially) in a restoration as long it is made known to potential bidders, which it is not in the online catalog of the auction.

ALSO note the missing "V8" in the grill....when you add that to the other features you have pointed out....I would wonder "IF" maybe it were a 4cyl car??


ALSO, back on the suspect "converted" 34 Victoria.....WHOMEVER did the work to the body below the belt line in the rear did a fantastic job (though not pleasing lines and flow) I would love to see the work from the inside of the "trunk lid". IT is completely NOT 2 door sedan shape or look!!!!

[Tim Ayers]

That is an incredible collection. My first thought is where would someone keep that many cars? The storage needed for all those cars has to be as impressive as the collection.

Good luck on anyone who is bidding on these beauties.

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by DavidG

Robert,

You have done the potential bidders on the second '34 Victoria, Lot T37, a huge favor by drawing our attention to it. Notice that the gas filler cap is on the right side of the car and notice that it is the left side car door that has the lock in it, not the right. Then consider those items on the car in the photo below from Ford's U.S. Archives (unusual in its own right because of the informality of the setting).

[rs]

The T37 I believe to be US version. Yes I could be wrong. Many (or all) of the South American bound cars had solid roof inserts like Lot W11. I have seen South American coupes with the factory filled non insert. I read they were converted in the states before they were shipped out. I forgot what book that was in. I became curious when I was looking at a 33 coupe a guy picked up in Argentina and brought back to the states. It was factory done and not a home job for certain.

[Digger]

I miss Rhett so much. We lost him in 2020., he was a very good friend of mine, a true Texas gentleman through and through. A very accomplished man, and had many great adventures throughout his life, including a solo flight over the Andes. He also gave to communities of the less fortunate in other countries, built schools, roads, infrastructures, to help as much as he could.

the first time I sold him a 34 Ford was in 2004, and we became fast friends after that. Of his 140 33-34 Fords, I sold him 45 of them, many in the video that you see. There are definitely some standouts of those cars, a few I did ground up restorations on, some cars that were chased down, and a few that were frame on restorations, but overall just a spectacular collection. I attended several of his “Car-B-Ques”, and I’m even in the photo at the end of the video which is a real thrill for me. He was such a great guy and true enthusiast. I have a lot of insight into the cars so if you’re thinking of bidding on some of them let me know and if they are from me I can share my knowledge.

For example, one I wish I could get back would be the primer gray 33 three window. It is the only car I have ever seen that actually has real paperwork, and history trail, from the very first day it was bought from the Ford dealer. That interior is 100% original, it was amazing.

The 1934 tan sedan delivery, I actually owned it twice, and then sold it to Rhett. I’m pretty certain that Richard from the Early V8 garage had owned it, and then a couple back east bought it, and they won a Dearborn with it, and it was a feature article in Hemmings.

Bittersweet to see the collection broken up, but then again, thinking of all the fellow enthusiasts that will enjoy the heck out of these cars. Even one at a time.

[JayChicago]

Digger said: "Bittersweet to see the collection broken up, but then again, thinking of all the fellow enthusiasts that will enjoy the heck out of these cars. Even one at a time."

That's where I come down on this: Now 200+ people will get the pleasure of a V8 Ford.

Good to learn that Rhett Butler used his wealth to do great things to help humanity. But it seems a little unnatural for one man to possess all those cars. As David G said in #6 above, owning that many is overkill.

But who knows what dumb things I would do, or buy, if I had that kind of wealth.

[rockfla]

Originally Posted by JayChicago

Digger said: "Bittersweet to see the collection broken up, but then again, thinking of all the fellow enthusiasts that will enjoy the heck out of these cars. Even one at a time."

That's where I come down on this: Now 200+ people will get the pleasure of a V8 Ford.

Good to learn that Rhett Butler used his wealth to do great things to help humanity. But it seems a little unnatural for one man to possess all those cars. As David G said in #6 above, owning that many is overkill.

But who knows what dumb things I would do, or buy, if I had that kind of wealth.

Jay
I don’t have my list in front of me BUT just thinking through what I remember, IF my “ship” came in I’m a player for at least 10 ( I think)
Maybe a couple more I’m not thinking about.

[DavidG]

Having spent a good number of years in South America on duty with Ford and exported dozens of '32-'36 Fords back to where they were manufactured in Michigan, understandably I encountered many closed cars with all steel roofs and if any of them was made that way it was not at a Ford factory. What utter nonsense! If Ford had the stamping capability to stamp one-piece roofs prior to 1937, they would have made all of their cars with one-piece roofs if for no other reason than the cost savings of a one-piece roof.



If not one-piece, but rather a welded-in insert as encountered on some South American surviving closed cars of the era, what would be the purpose of offering that "factory" option there and nowhere else? It certainly would not be a fundamentally different climate. Further, if they could do it then, why did they only do it on some, not all, closed cars bound for South America? Better yet, try and document that nonsense by coming up with a part number and engineering drawing for a roof insert stamping for any '32-'36 closed body type in Ford's archives; I've looked and there's no such animal.


Some of the inserts are very crude and others very well done, just like any welding jobs done by a large number welders of various skills, experience, and equipment. Just because some were done well does not equal "factory filled".

[fordv8]

What an amazing collection of cars, thank you for sharing. Hopefully I can put one in my garage! Thanks again.

[38 coupe]

A couple of my friends were called in (along with many others) to help get the cars in this huge collection of cars to start. Their understanding is every 33-34 Ford available in Uruguay was sent to south Texas.

[DavidG]

Timing is everything as Argentina, Brazil, and Uruguay each prohibited the export of automobiles at one time or another during the last fifty years.

[rs]

David G you should do some research in the Ford books. If I can relocate it I will, but they did the roofs before they were shipped out in Michigan according to the records.