The Ford Barn

RalphM · 03-20-2018, 02:56 PM

I just got my 1962 car craft with the article in there of the hopped up flat head with a four a half inch stroke. I’ve read a lot about welding up journals seen plenty of pictures of this being done and my question is; how hard is it to do this?
Do you think a competent welder could accomplish the welding portion? And could one go to modern machine shop to turn the journals down, or is this a lost art?

skidmarks · 03-20-2018, 03:32 PM

Instead of stick welding the journals, what about spray welding them. I got a spindle repaired on a case 4x4 backhoe and the shop spray welded the damaged area and turned it back to spec.

That shop here is now out of business but im sure the process is still done

With stick welding a crank, your going to have to find someone to first straighten it then grind it to spec

A SCAT crank is probably cheaper

flatheadmurre · 03-20-2018, 03:51 PM

Crankwelding is usually powderwelding.
And if you weld up just one side of the crank pins they warp so it´s a lots of welding and even more grinding...
Cold spray welding has a bad habit of flaking and fusion spray welding is as much heat as any method.

RalphM · 03-20-2018, 08:38 PM

Never heard of powder welding, but back in the day it was all done with stick right? I wonder if any of the machine shops are even capable of straightening a crank anymore.

flatrod · 03-20-2018, 11:23 PM

Ralph,
I don't think anyone up here has a crank welder anymore. We used to have one back in the 70's. It was a wire welder machine and built up the whole journal. Did a really good job, most times you could not tell it was welded. But then its a lot of time to do the grinding. I have seen some just weld the side for stroking, but that did pull the crank in all kinds of bends! The crank grinder boys across town will do offset grinding and straightening.

flatheadmurre · 03-21-2018, 12:50 AM

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Google gleason crankshaft welder and you see how they look like.
Its a wire feed with a tube pooring powder instead of shielding gas.
You used to have two wires one for the radius and one for surface...used one for rebuilding the bigger diesel cranks but the demand isn´t around any more to justify keeping it.

skidmarks · 03-21-2018, 07:20 AM

The powder process is called submerged arc welding. The powder is the flux and its usually used for very hi amps and thick material.

Place i worked at when i was in highschool rebuilt caterpillar under carriages and the bottom rollers were done that way. You could see the ripple in the weld that was the full width of the roller that was about 5" wide

The idlers were either stick or mig welded

outlaw · 03-21-2018, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flatrod

Ralph,
I don't think anyone up here has a crank welder anymore. We used to have one back in the 70's. It was a wire welder machine and built up the whole journal. Did a really good job, most times you could not tell it was welded. But then its a lot of time to do the grinding. I have seen some just weld the side for stroking, but that did pull the crank in all kinds of bends! The crank grinder boys across town will do offset grinding and straightening.

Dennis, I wonder what happened to Jack Marsh's crank welder. He welded up one of my Merc cranks & offset ground it to 4 1/8" before he closed up shop. Bill

flatrod · 03-21-2018, 10:17 AM

Bill,
Jack welded up a lot of cranks! His machine was sold to someone outside, so its gone, just like the one we had at Crankshaft Services.

RalphM · 03-21-2018, 09:09 PM

Dennis,
That’s too bad, I was hoping to build the dream flathead! And four and a half inch stroke sounds awesome!
I know there are places that sell cranks, but I was hoping to do this the old school way.
How are your projects coming?
I haven’t talked to Jim recently, hows his Roadster coming along?
PS: I you tubed the powder welding, that was neat! I may end up having to ship a crank to Alaska if there’s still some places outside that do this.

03-20-2018, 02:56 PM	#1
RalphM Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 2,651	Welding rod journals/Stroker I just got my 1962 car craft with the article in there of the hopped up flat head with a four a half inch stroke. I’ve read a lot about welding up journals seen plenty of pictures of this being done and my question is; how hard is it to do this? Do you think a competent welder could accomplish the welding portion? And could one go to modern machine shop to turn the journals down, or is this a lost art?

03-20-2018, 03:32 PM	#2
skidmarks Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: newark, delaware Posts: 3,735	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker Instead of stick welding the journals, what about spray welding them. I got a spindle repaired on a case 4x4 backhoe and the shop spray welded the damaged area and turned it back to spec. That shop here is now out of business but im sure the process is still done With stick welding a crank, your going to have to find someone to first straighten it then grind it to spec A SCAT crank is probably cheaper

03-20-2018, 03:51 PM	#3
flatheadmurre Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Sweden Posts: 3,045	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker Crankwelding is usually powderwelding. And if you weld up just one side of the crank pins they warp so it´s a lots of welding and even more grinding... Cold spray welding has a bad habit of flaking and fusion spray welding is as much heat as any method.

03-20-2018, 08:38 PM	#4
RalphM Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 2,651	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker Never heard of powder welding, but back in the day it was all done with stick right? I wonder if any of the machine shops are even capable of straightening a crank anymore.

03-20-2018, 11:23 PM	#5
flatrod Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Anchorage Alaska Posts: 291	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker Ralph, I don't think anyone up here has a crank welder anymore. We used to have one back in the 70's. It was a wire welder machine and built up the whole journal. Did a really good job, most times you could not tell it was welded. But then its a lot of time to do the grinding. I have seen some just weld the side for stroking, but that did pull the crank in all kinds of bends! The crank grinder boys across town will do offset grinding and straightening.

03-21-2018, 12:50 AM	#6
flatheadmurre Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Sweden Posts: 3,045	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Google gleason crankshaft welder and you see how they look like. Its a wire feed with a tube pooring powder instead of shielding gas. You used to have two wires one for the radius and one for surface...used one for rebuilding the bigger diesel cranks but the demand isn´t around any more to justify keeping it.

03-21-2018, 07:20 AM	#7
skidmarks Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: newark, delaware Posts: 3,735	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker The powder process is called submerged arc welding. The powder is the flux and its usually used for very hi amps and thick material. Place i worked at when i was in highschool rebuilt caterpillar under carriages and the bottom rollers were done that way. You could see the ripple in the weld that was the full width of the roller that was about 5" wide The idlers were either stick or mig welded

03-21-2018, 10:17 AM	#9
flatrod Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Anchorage Alaska Posts: 291	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker Bill, Jack welded up a lot of cranks! His machine was sold to someone outside, so its gone, just like the one we had at Crankshaft Services.

03-21-2018, 09:09 PM	#10
RalphM Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 2,651	Re: Welding rod journals/Stroker Dennis, That’s too bad, I was hoping to build the dream flathead! And four and a half inch stroke sounds awesome! I know there are places that sell cranks, but I was hoping to do this the old school way. How are your projects coming? I haven’t talked to Jim recently, hows his Roadster coming along? PS: I you tubed the powder welding, that was neat! I may end up having to ship a crank to Alaska if there’s still some places outside that do this.