Hard Steering 34 pick up

[34farmtruck]

Hey I have a 1934 Ford pick up, it has radial tires on it and the steering is very hard to turn. I have removed the gear box and disassembled it and all is good inside. Are there any alternatives so that it is easier to steer? I checked out the Mavel rack option but it will not work on this truck. I have seen where someone suggested an F-1 box but it doesn't have the same mount, will it help if I can make it fit? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

If I should not be asking this question here please tell me so I can do it else ware. This truck is all original except for an electric fan and 12v negative ground and radial tires and rims to go with them. I apologize if it needs to be done.

[TStiles]

I had bias ply on my '53 F-100. Drove like a dream. Tried radials on my '51 F-1. Tracked well, but impossible at slow speeds. Went to bias ply on it. Problem solved. A compromise.

[34farmtruck]

Thank you for your information. I do like the look of the radials but it would be nice to be able to steer it also.

[Al K.]

I have heard that if you put the Stainless bearings under the king pins it will improve. Stainless is in the name of the company, and others here will chime in with their correct name. Al K.

[Walt Dupont--Me.]

I have a 53-56 Fi00 steering box in my Model A. Two finger steering with radials. Don't seems it would big a job to install in a 34 truck. Walt

[GeoMaher]

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I have a 1934 Ford pickup and it steers very, very well - no problems. It pays to keep everything absolutely stock on these old vehicles - including the tires. Mine are on 17 inch rims, just as the originals. I would not experiment with anything else - ol' Henry Ford knew just what he was doing.
George Maher
Fargo, North Dakota

[DICK SPADARO]

What is steering hard, like at slow speed or driving speed or are you grunting when you parallel park? Questions, do you have stock or after market wheels? What is the air pressure you are running? Have you greased the king pins. Have you adjusted the steering box correctly and is there lube in the steering box? Just steers hard can have a number of reasons so just saying steers hard could be do to anything even too much + or- toe alignment. Changing to bearing king pins is a waste of money.
What are the answers to the questions and see if you can diagnose your issue.

[34farmtruck]

Well to answer the questions, it steers hard moving slow, like do not even consider parallel parking, the gear box is full and adjusted right according to a local business that works on them, the tires are P205/70R15 (on steel wheels) pretty much straight tread, the air pressure has been tried at 40psi but doesn't help so now at 35psi, the front end is all in good condition and very well greased. Thank you for your help.

[Seth Swoboda]

Originally Posted by DICK SPADARO

What is steering hard, like at slow speed or driving speed or are you grunting when you parallel park? Questions, do you have stock or after market wheels? What is the air pressure you are running? Have you greased the king pins. Have you adjusted the steering box correctly and is there lube in the steering box? Just steers hard can have a number of reasons so just saying steers hard could be do to anything even too much + or- toe alignment. Changing to bearing king pins is a waste of money.
What are the answers to the questions and see if you can diagnose your issue.

I think Dick is right on here. I would make a list based on what Dick has talked about and check out everyone one of them before just dumping money into this. My 39 pickup steers very well, it has all stock ford parts except I have Coker radial 6.00x16 tires. At low speeds or when trying to park it does turn a little "harder" as would be expected. Hard steering sure can be though to diagnose as people's perception of hard steering may very.

[DICK SPADARO]

Thanks for your reply. First 35-40 lbs of air in the tire will help it turn easily but is way too much air pressure for a vehicle of that weight, somewhere in the area of 24-26 would be a better choice as well as give you a slightly better ride.

The issue of hard steer centers around your selection of tire and wheel combination. This axle is designed for a 4" wide tire and has a positive camber built in the axle design this tips the top of the tire out to aid in tracking and steering. When you change the tire width and wheel offset you change a series of design elements that create a hard steer condition at slow speed because the present axle design causes the inner spindle to lower as the tire turns thus lifting or placing more load on the tire as it turns. This is what you are experiencing and calling hard steer. The only way you are able to alleviate this issue with the choice of tires and rims is to take out some of the camber, this is not an easy job and should be done by an experienced person. Changing the steering box is a major project. Time to eat your Wheaties.

[Seth Swoboda]

Dick, that is a great point about tire size. I see a lot of people try and run a more modern wider tire on their early fords using a stock front axle. I often wondered how the car would steer and drive like that.

[Pete]

You are running a steering setup that was designed to run 4 inch wide tires.
If you put on 6 or 8 inch tires you are going to have hard steering. It has to do with the laws of physics and none of those have been repealed yet.
There are many ways to get modern low effort steering with wide tires and most have been covered here or on the HAMB. The 2 most popular are, change to a F1 or F100 box or add a power assist cylinder to the pitman arm. Both of these mods involve welding and machine work.

[FlatheadTed]

My 34s steering was surprisingly light the other day ,then I realized that i was on a metal /gravel road which 90% of the roads were in the day . Heres a shot of a Chrysler box thats going in another 34 this will vastly improve steering, it should be as good as Seth's 39 box In 37 Gemmer improved there patented box's and supplied them to to all to the car manufactures so steering improved all round about then .I have driven a stock 34 with near perfect steering with bias ply tires , there was no detail missed on the build, new sector etc ,There are posts on here that out line how you can improve you steering with a stock box . all the steering balls must be in top shape its a common thing to cut them of and reweld new ones on ,some add needle rollers and a bearing in the upper column ,to name a few .check the model A site.

[34farmtruck]

Thank you for the great info. Based on the responses would you recommend going with some Coker radials or bias plys. The F100 box looks like some modifications are required to mount it. Again I really appreciate all the responses.

[Seth Swoboda]

Originally Posted by FlatheadTed

My 34s steering was surprisingly light the other day ,then I realized that i was on a metal /gravel road which 90% of the roads were in the day . Heres a shot of a Chrysler box thats going in another 34 this will vastly improve steering, it should be as good as Seth's 39 box In 37 Gemmer improved there patented box's and supplied them to to all to the car manufactures so steering improved all round about then .I have driven a stock 34 with near perfect steering with bias ply tires , there was no detail missed on the build, new sector etc ,There are posts on here that out line how you can improve you steering with a stock box . all the steering balls must be in top shape its a common thing to cut them of and reweld new ones on ,some add needle rollers and a bearing in the upper column ,to name a few .check the model A site.

Ted, that looks like a pretty neat conversion. What's the scoop on that Chrylser box? Is it similar to the 39 ford box?

[Motorhead6]

Thanks to whoever deleted my earlier post.

Reduce the amount of caster that you may have. Also, increasing the PSI to about 35 to 40 pounds won't hurt a thing except the ride quality. It will still be better than the original bias ply tires. Grease with a good brand of synthetic grease. This should help. As stated above, bias ply tires will help a bunch, but hard to justify the cost.

[Seth Swoboda]

Originally Posted by 34farmtruck

Thank you for the great info. Based on the responses would you recommend going with some Coker radials or bias plys. The F100 box looks like some modifications are required to mount it. Again I really appreciate all the responses.

Diamond Back also makes a nice radial, they both have the look of the old bias ply tire. Although they are expensive.

[Straightpipes]

Why not simply swap wheels with someone and see what you've got. I run biased ply on both of my Fords. Thats what they were designed to have. If I want a better ride I take my Lexus.......

[jimTN]

Dick is absolutely correct. I have a 34pu with a stock 15-1 steering and correct 17" wheels that steers good. I have a 32 that came with 16" rubber when I bought it and I put the correct 18s back on it and it steers very good.
The truck gears add a lot of wind to the wheel that I do not like.

[FlatheadTed]

Seth its a 37 box with bracketing cut of, it would be the equivalent of F 100 but is a little smaller takes a roller and worm a nice unit you weld the triangle on the outer ,also need to shorten the column as well .

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

Ted, that looks like a pretty neat conversion. What's the scoop on that Chrylser box? Is it similar to the 39 ford box?

[jimTN]

Hello Ted, would you please post more pics of your later gear set up from start to finish and installed. That is a great way to go and I have often wondered about how it could be done.

[FlatheadTed]

Heres some more. I made up a jig to weld the angle of the triangle plate ,thats a F100 sitting in it ,I also pressed of the worm to shorten the column ,This is not bolted to the car yet ,I think the worm and sector are the same as a Ford 38 to 48

[FlatheadTed]

More shots .You can see the greasy box and how it started out and were I cut of the lugs ,

[FlatheadTed]

Greasy box ,The chassis Nazi's here wont let you weld on the box so I am still working on that ,Its cast iron to steel so care must be exercised

[jimTN]

I was with you till the last pic, never seen anything like that, was that a pic in error? I am trying to figure how a left hand dr gear could be done but maybe thats not possible.

[FlatheadTed]

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Thats a right hand drive one Jim ,But the same would apply on the USA ones

[FlatheadTed]

In other words its the same box as the one I cut

[columbiA]

I had a 33 coupe & I added needle brgs to the sector shaft,shortened the pitman arm 1-1/2".new steering balls with teflon ball seats & changed from 35 wheels to original 550-17 bias plys and it steers very easily.No need for F-100 or other steering box.

[FlatheadTed]

Thanks for the post CO.

[true blue 32 man]

Hello I have just completed an upgrade to my 32 box. The needle sector kit from Snyders is PN A-3674 for $19.00 Sector seal is A3549-A for $4.oo Have yet to purchase an upper bearing for the upper tube.(aprox $7.oo at my local bearing supply house. I disasembled my 32 bos and took it to a local machine shop. They bored the sector housinf for the needle bearings and counter bored.180 X 1.375 for the seal. also machined an adapter ring for the upper tube roller bearing and pressed in the adapter and the needle bearings in the sector housing all for $50.oo Total investment part & labor $80.oo I also purchased from Snyders the EZ steer kit for the drag link and tie rod ends which have teflon inserts that fit around the ball studs instead of the original hardened steel ones PN A-3305-SE for $36.95 Once installed none of this can be seen, So, if your a trophy hound no points lost. The improvment in reduced steering effort is worth every pennny. All Model A and 32-35 cars and pickups will use these same parts. If you din't have a machine shop in your area, you can contact Falcon Machine Parts LLC 3671 E. Mallory Ave. Cudahy, Wi 53110 PH# (414)489-0201 Ask for Thomas Reindl Why go to all the trouble of steering bow swaps When this will accomplish the same result and retain the stock appearance? Cheap Too Hope this helps. Pete the true blue 32 man

[tub1]

hey there Ted if you dont want to weld on a bracket have a look at a chev 4 steering box clamp it fits inside of the chassis ,and if you find a 1937 -1938 hudson steering box you can do the same job as the chrysler one ,i know all this works we did the conversion on 2 model a fords over 20 years ago and there both still going fine

[keith oh]

Changing to STP fluid made a notacable difference in my 35 tudor steering. I guess that is just too simple a fix though.

[FlatheadTed]

Thanks for the tip Tub ,Yes I believe the Plymouth ones also the same . I was thinking of machining a ridge then make the triangle bit compress like a clamp .The welding would be OK but we have the Govt inspectors here who will go over it before it can be registered ,But I will look into the chev one ,

Originally Posted by tub

hey there Ted if you don't want to weld on a bracket have a look at a chev 4 steering box clamp it fits inside of the chassis ,and if you find a 1937 -1938 hudson steering box you can do the same job as the chrysler one ,i know all this works we did the conversion on 2 model a fords over 20 years ago and there both still going fine

[gearhead1952]

Originally Posted by true blue 32 man

Hello I have just completed an upgrade to my 32 box. The needle sector kit from Snyders is PN A-3674 for $19.00 Sector seal is A3549-A for $4.oo Have yet to purchase an upper bearing for the upper tube.(aprox $7.oo at my local bearing supply house. I disasembled my 32 bos and took it to a local machine shop. They bored the sector housinf for the needle bearings and counter bored.180 X 1.375 for the seal. also machined an adapter ring for the upper tube roller bearing and pressed in the adapter and the needle bearings in the sector housing all for $50.oo Total investment part & labor $80.oo I also purchased from Snyders the EZ steer kit for the drag link and tie rod ends which have teflon inserts that fit around the ball studs instead of the original hardened steel ones PN A-3305-SE for $36.95 Once installed none of this can be seen, So, if your a trophy hound no points lost. The improvment in reduced steering effort is worth every pennny. All Model A and 32-35 cars and pickups will use these same parts. If you din't have a machine shop in your area, you can contact Falcon Machine Parts LLC 3671 E. Mallory Ave. Cudahy, Wi 53110 PH# (414)489-0201 Ask for Thomas Reindl Why go to all the trouble of steering bow swaps When this will accomplish the same result and retain the stock appearance? Cheap Too Hope this helps. Pete the true blue 32 man

Thank you for this info.

[tub1]

yes ted we have those people over here ,but black paint sometimes gets past them lol