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05-30-2020, 10:53 AM | #1 |
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A question about colors
I've attached a couple of pictures and I'm wondering about the colors.
First is the dust jacket from Henry's Lady showing what I assume to be a '29 Phaeton. I like the color, sort of a khaki and orange wheels. Second is a page from the MAFCA Paint and finish guide showing that a '29 Phaeton with orange wheels would be painted Rose Beige body color with Seal Brown belt moulding color. Third, from the same book, is the color sample page showing "Rose Beige" but this Rose Beige looks nothing like the car in the first photo. So, is the book cover car painted an "inappropriate" color? Or, is the page showing the color combination wrong? Or, is the color sample wrong? I had bought this book several years ago and remarked that most of the "dark" colors looked way too dark. I managed to lose that copy and recently bought this new copy and it still appears that those dark colors are still way too dark. Thanks for any explanation you can offer!!
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Don't never get rid of nuthin! Last edited by PeteVS; 05-30-2020 at 11:11 AM. Reason: Forgot images! |
05-30-2020, 11:18 AM | #2 | |
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Re: A question about colors
Quote:
Which edition of the P&FG do you have? Does it have a date or an Edition number? The color chips in that book are probably correct. If the color chips look dark to you, compared to printed images you see online or in books, it is because the printed materials are not accurate. It is very difficult to get those images to reproduce correctly. Many people lighten up the images because the look better in print (but they are not correct). You also need to take the color chips in the book outside, not in direct sun, but in outdoor indirect light, to see the correct color. You can't trust what you see on a computer monitor. There were some color charts printed in the 60's and 70's by major paint suppliers that had some colors done incorrectly. These errors have propagated through the hobby for years. This is often why people think the P&FG chips are too dark. I hope this helps.
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05-30-2020, 11:49 AM | #3 | |
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Re: A question about colors
Quote:
So, is there a better source for color chips?
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05-30-2020, 12:14 PM | #4 | |
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Re: A question about colors
Quote:
As Brent said, many people in the past have used an existing paint color, chosen from a book, intended to be for another later model car, that they felt was "close enough" and used it because they liked it. Maybe they had no original sample to go by. Maybe they just liked what they chose more than the authentic color. I don't know. You are not the first person to conclude that the paint chips in the P&FG are "wrong", "too dark", "can't be right". I've heard it before. They have been verified several times and are correct. Sorry that you don't like them. This is why my Dad painted his '29 phaeton in a 1931 color scheme. He liked it better, even though it was incorrect for his year. He thought the '29 colors were not bright enough, not vibrant enough.
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05-30-2020, 11:20 AM | #5 |
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Re: A question about colors
The closest authentic color combination for the jacket color is the Rose Beige and Seal Brown. Too often, restorers choose a 'close' color from a generic paint store chip book, and then tell onlookers that is is an authentic color.
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05-30-2020, 12:53 PM | #6 |
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Re: A question about colors
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Side question for my own education. The color guide has chips but no codes. How does a paint shop make up the paint to the correct color? Do they have a database somewhere or do they scan the color chip? Mike
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05-30-2020, 01:56 PM | #7 | |
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Re: A question about colors
Quote:
You take it home and spray a test panel. Prime the test panel with the same primer you plan to use on the vehicle. Color sand it out the same. Compare test panel to the chip in the book out in indirect daylight. Bring it back to them to tweak if you do not like the match.
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05-30-2020, 02:39 PM | #8 | |
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Re: A question about colors
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"MeasureColor Mobile, available in the United States and Canada, combines cloud technology with a handheld, Bluetooth-enabled scanning device to read a color, interpret the data and quickly send the closest PPG color match to the app on a customer’s tablet or smartphone."
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05-30-2020, 02:09 PM | #9 |
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Re: A question about colors
I don't know but that car on the dust jacket looks like the 1928 Arabian Sand color combination. This combination wasn't available in 1929. Rose Beige is not as light a color and Seal Brown is a dark brown color.
Last edited by rotorwrench; 05-31-2020 at 09:52 AM. |
05-30-2020, 02:19 PM | #10 |
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Re: A question about colors
Does anyone have a good color picture of a Model A in "authentic" Rose Beige that they'd be willing to post here? Thanks! If it's actually a good match for the MAFCA color chip, I'll have to look elsewhere for a color I like.
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05-30-2020, 09:37 PM | #11 |
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Re: A question about colors
Pete... here is my Rose Beige/Seal Brown phaeton ….. BUT it is a '28 and should not have been painted this scheme. But I hope it will help you.
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1928 "A" Phaeton (mid year with many early features) 1933 "V8" Closed-Cab Pickup Truck (originally a Model B, 4 Cylinder dating to May, 1933)
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05-31-2020, 06:37 AM | #12 |
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Re: A question about colors
Thanks Al!
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05-31-2020, 03:56 AM | #13 |
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Re: A question about colors
A good tip I read, probably in this forum, is to get a sheet of black paper, and cut out a square the same size as the paint chip. Then pop it over the colour you are after and have a look. You will be surprised at the difference it makes.
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1928 Roadster (CA67) 1931 Deluxe Coupe RHD 1931 Victoria RHD Model A's don't leak oil they just mark their territory. |
05-31-2020, 06:06 AM | #14 |
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Re: A question about colors
I think my 29 Tudor may be Rose Beige/Seal Brown but not sure.
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05-31-2020, 09:07 AM | #15 |
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Re: A question about colors
Speaking of paint, where can i get lacquer paint? I know that it is prohibited in many states but if i can get a source i'll work out that problem. Jack
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05-31-2020, 10:47 AM | #16 |
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Re: A question about colors
If they are very good like my friend at my workplace, they can scan it, locate the code, and adjust it to the chip. His mixings have always been spot on with no need for going back and test spraying.
Btw, laquer paint is not worth it. Almost everybody has moved to single stage at this point because of its durability, superiority, and ease of obtaining compared to laquer.
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05-31-2020, 10:18 PM | #17 |
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Re: A question about colors
1931 coupe rose beige seal brown taken from a 1972 Model A paint pamphlet in existent at the time.
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05-31-2020, 11:34 PM | #18 |
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Re: A question about colors
I have a roadster, Sierra blue and Washington blue. Many people look at it and see the car as two tone, one being a light blue with the mold lines being a darker blue with a pin stripe centered on it. I see three shades of the light blue, the front, hood and cowl is almost blue/green to me and it changes going toward the back, doors are a bit darker and the rear is darker yet, with no green to it that I see. Others see it as just the same light blue from front to back, so I'm guessing that I see colors differently than others. I have noticed the same thing on modern cars at car shows, where perhaps a tan fender will appear considerable more brown to me. If it is just one fender I often find that the fender has been resprayed the factory color and most people cannot detect a difference.
One of the firemen I worked with had a brand new Mustang and we were all admiring it. I told one of the guys I thought the front end was darker red and the guy really examined it closely and told me it was all the same. A week or two later he called me and said the dealer had taken the car back and repainted the whole thing as it had gone through a wall of their showroom, and when the buyer was getting a service some kid that worked there told him he had wrecked it and wondered how much off the dealer had allowed for that little error. They repainted the entire car and the paint all matched the next time I saw it.(Buyer sold the car shortly after as he couldn't drive a "wreck.") |
06-01-2020, 08:07 AM | #19 |
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Re: A question about colors
Here are two pictures of the same car under different lighting conditions. This car was painted with Ditzler lacquer paint 50 years ago. The painter had access to older Ditzler formula books to mix the paint. The painter was considered one of the best painters at that time and had several of his paint jobs on cars that won Best of Show awards at Dearborn. That is not to say that this is necessarily an exact representation of the actual Seal Brown/Rose Beige from the factory. I am guessing it is very close to factory colors. After 50 years the paint still looks good and is still waiting for the pin striper.
Last edited by Gary/IA; 06-01-2020 at 08:13 AM. |
06-01-2020, 08:09 AM | #20 |
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Re: A question about colors
Second picture
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