Please help, any advice?

[ctvpa]

Friends,
Here's the story:
The car is a new restoration with less than 200 miles.

I can be driving along, it can be running fine, then suddenly no power, sputtering, awful bucking. The person who rebuilt the carb stated to open the GOV more, I have tried every point from closed to 1 full turn, no change. At first it worked for a few hours, but often self corrects, so I don't think that fixed anything.

It is very intermittent. I can drive the car several times (at 1/4 gav) with no problem. Then you can be driving down the road, and it's just like you clicked a switch, you have nothing.

It has been happening at all speeds and difference position of the GOV did nothing.

Some days it is fine all day. Sometimes it self corrects. Sometimes when it happens, I closed the fuel valve, let the bowel to empty , tap the carb (someone was sure the float was stuck), and once in awhile it will work. You never know when , it happens at any speed, any time.

When it happens, you can see gas coming from the carb. Slow drip.

Today was the worst. I almost had to be towed. It ran fine for 20 miles, then loss of power suddenly. If I pull the choke a bit I can smooth it out. Usually after a mile or so, that sometimes works, and I can slowly reduce the choke and it works. Today I even pulled the carb bowl and the float is fine, not leaking or sinking, no gas into the float so it's not a hole in the float , and it still barley runs. I had to use full choke, all the way home, bucking so bad in some areas I was at 5 mph. It's not air locked, I had the cap almost off.

The only way to keep driving, is at full choke , then it runs smooth, but so rich I overheat. I could not get it to work correct. It took about 10 gallons to go about 15 miles.

Here is what I have done:
Cleaned all the filters
New gaskets
Cleaned the gas line
checked the fuel shout off
cleaned the jets with compressed air
set the GOV from 0 to 360 degrees (no change at all)
Checked the float and no correction needed, not sinking.
I have NOT changed any settings. Since it happens intermittently, I don't think it the settings.

The car has less than 200 miles, and I cannot drive it like this. It happened on a highway and I nearly got hit.

Tomorrow l will swap the carb from my roadster to see it changes anything.

Your thoughts? I am very, very discouraged.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Bad ground issues (common with new restorations) where the fuel line becomes the chassis ground?? In doing so, the fuel is preheated and is trying to vaporize.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Bad ground issues (common with new restorations) where the fuel line becomes the chassis ground?? In doing so, the fuel is preheated and is trying to vaporize.

Thank you for your input.

However since I put in a 'Float a motor" I had been warned of this, so a second ground is run from the battery to the transmission, to ground the engine.

The ground from the battery to the frame is metal to metal.

[verdirick]

Checked your coil or the ballast resister????? Problem sounds electrical... Bad coil would be my first thought......Inspect the distributor also, Make sure everything is tight and together and that you don't have a wire from the bottom plate intermittently gounding out....

[ctvpa]

I have tried a different coil, and changed the cutout. If it was electrical why would choke smooth it out, and why would raw gas be dripping out of the carb, only when it happens ? No gas come from the carb when it is running fine.

Thank you for your input, I will check my wiring and distributor.

[Joe K]

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Check your terminal box on the firewall. Repop boxes have studs that are uncovered and liable to contact with the firewall - and can short out the ignition side of the box.

You can unscrew the box from the firewall, put a piece of electrical tape across the near miss points (both of them) and put the box back in place without removing any wires if you're good with a screwdriver.

Hope this helps. The other carb seems a good test too.

Joe K

[mass A man]

This must be driving you crazy. You said you blew the carb jets out with air, did you "remove" the jets? It may be a small burr or something bouncing around in carb passages or the jet, whereas burr is trapped unless it is removed the way it got in. I had this happen to me.

[ericr]

do the members feel that float level can do this?

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Joe K

Check your terminal box on the firewall. Repop boxes have studs that are uncovered and liable to contact with the firewall - and can short out the ignition side of the box.

You can unscrew the box from the firewall, put a piece of electrical tape across the near miss points (both of them) and put the box back in place without removing any wires if you're good with a screwdriver.

Hope this helps. The other carb seems a good test too.

Joe K

It is an original box, with no other electrical issues. Many people are stating a short, and I will check, but why would choking the intake smooth out the engine, and why would it spill gas only when it happens?

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by mass A man

This must be driving you crazy. You said you blew the carb jets out with air, did you "remove" the jets? It may be a small burr or something bouncing around in carb passages or the jet, whereas burr is trapped unless it is removed the way it got in. I had this happen to me.

I am trying not to open too much of the carb for now, I am going to put the carb from my other car on.
The carb was a professional rebuild, so I don't want to change anything. If it proves to be the carb, I don't want him to come back to me with "Well you changed this". So I am reserving that.
I did open the carb, examined the jets, all are clear. A burr would happen all the time, and I have not found any debris.
But thank you for your input.

[ronn]

bet you change the carb and it runs fine....

of course I could lose the bet, but betting is fun!

[johnbuckley]

"90% of carb faults are ign"
here's a couple of additional long shots.
1) just to make sure it's not an ign fault rig up a wire feeding direct from the battery and temporarily disconnect the old one.
2) vaccuum forming in gas tank because of a non -( or poorly) venting gas cap? - it's caught me out a couple of times.

[Tom Wesenberg]

If you are half way serious about 10 gallons to drive 15 miles, you must have washed all the oil from the cylinders, or you are leaving quite a trail of raw gas on the road.

It kind of sounds like intermittent ignition, but when you mention the amount of gas used, it must be fuel related. How sensitive is the ignition switch? Do you have to barely turn it to kill the spark? Many repro switches don't have a good conection with a solid click to the on position. Do you notice any difference when you move the spark lever? Sometimes the short lower plate wire will touch the spring or case as the spark lever is moved, if it isn't bent correctly for clearance.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by ericr

do the members feel that float level can do this?

The float is exact at 1 inch, there are no holes in the float, and a bad float would be a problem all the time, this is intermittent, and starts suddenly, and sometimes ends just as sudden. Or like yesterday I could not get it to correct. I dropped the bowl, cleaned it out, checked the float, checked the float valve, all worked fine. Put it back together and the car started great, but had no power. If I choke it, I can drive at 35 mph. reduce the choke, and bucking and sputtering, and barely 5 mph

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by johnbuckley

"90% of carb faults are ign"
here's a couple of additional long shots.
1) just to make sure it's not an ign fault rig up a wire feeding direct from the battery and temporarily disconnect the old one.
2) vaccuum forming in gas tank because of a non -( or poorly) venting gas cap? - it's caught me out a couple of times.

The windshield was open, so to see if it was vapor lock I reached out and opened the gas cap, nothing changed.

I will check the wiring, as many others have suggested.

Thank you for your help

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

If you are half way serious about 10 gallons to drive 15 miles, you must have washed all the oil from the cylinders, or you are leaving quite a trail of raw gas on the road.

It kind of sounds like intermittent ignition, but when you mention the amount of gas used, it must be fuel related. How sensitive is the ignition switch? Do you have to barely turn it to kill the spark? Many repro switches don't have a good conection with a solid click to the on position. Do you notice any difference when you move the spark lever? Sometimes the short lower plate wire will touch the spring or case as the spark lever is moved, if it isn't bent correctly for clearance.

It is a recently pro rebuilt Pop Out that works fine, The spark does change the engine, but not improved enough. The only thing the made a difference is choke.
Thank you for your input.

[ericr]

crud in the gas tank?

[Tiny]

Do you have a known to be good carb you could borrow? That coul eliminate one question with two bolts.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Do you have the small filter screen in the gas tank valve?
I would always use one, even in a spotless tank.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

Do you have the small filter screen in the gas tank valve?
I would always use one, even in a spotless tank.

Yes, I recoated the tank, and did put the new filter there, in the fuel line and a new one in the carb. I can find no debris.

Thank you for the input

[spdway1]

I know a good toe guy!

[Dune Country]

Had a diesel dump truck that would just intermittently die, some times 6 months apart, finally after a couple of years we found somebody had filled a baggie with diesel and put it in the tank, it would just float around until it plugged the fuel intake, die, and let go
just saying ;/

[ericr]

is the fuel line installed correctly into the carb and not plunged into the screen?

[Bill in SoCal]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

I am going to put the carb from my other car on.

So - let us know what happened?

Bill

[Duffy1]

I know you said you removed the gas cap for a short period . Might want to loosen cap and run for longer period . My car did the same as yours. Had a gas cap that would vent and then would not vent depending how the hole in the gasket lined up with the hole in the cap when you tightened up the cap .

[ctvpa]

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Originally Posted by spdway1

I know a good toe guy!

I am aware of him, I friend of mine got towed by him very recently. He comes very highly recommended. On the way home my wife suggested we call him.

[TinCup]

Wow what a mess. I would try a loaner carb from some one else and if you could borrow a distributor I would try that too. I think it's electrical myself.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by ericr

is the fuel line installed correctly into the carb and not plunged into the screen?

I have removed the fuel cutoff valve and tested it, I have cleaned all the gas lines, I have disconnected the fuel line and using the valve turned the fuel on and off, and it runs full flow. I don't think Flomax could make it run better.
The screen in the carb is new, clean, and no debris in the bowl. I have a new screen in the tank, the tank is recently sealed, and examined with an explosive proof flexible fiber optic scope. No sand, no debris.
The fuel line is correctly attached to the carb, and with the lower section removed the float is free, and the float valve provides full flow when the float is down, and no flow when the float is up.

[spdway1]

Seems to me, "Two Nuts" and "Baby" is a carb doner for a few hours!
Is Baby a M or FM? Just Wondering?
Beware bad weather is on its way.

[Bill in Al]

Could be a condenser problem exasperated by adjusting with the GAV.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Duffy1

I know you said you removed the gas cap for a short period . Might want to loosen cap and run for longer period . My car did the same as yours. Had a gas cap that would vent and then would not vent depending how the hole in the gasket lined up with the hole in the cap when you tightened up the cap .

The cap was on by one thread the whole ride home, fuel was able to spill out, so I am quite sure there is no vapor lock.

I feel that a vapor lock would not allow gas to drip out of the carb when I am having this issue. A vapor lock would prevent gas from coming out. When this happens and I pull over it idles fine and smooth, and you can watch gas drip out the air intake. Once you try to move it, you have the fight of your life with no power. If you choke it, it smooths out 80%. enough to try to get home but you have to run so rich the engine overheat.

[Jim/GA]

If the distributor is using points and condenser, I recommend you check the point gap. New cam followers wear as they rub on the cam and burnish in, even with cam grease used. I go in and adjust new points back out to spec a few times in the first few hundred miles. Eventually the follower stops wearing down so fast.

Yes, as odd as it sounds, points that are not open enough can be compensated for with a richer mixture, to a point.

You might also try a new condenser. They are cheap and easy to swap out. Normally I don't support throwing new parts at a problem, but there is no easier way to test for a bad condenser than to put in a new one.

We have also had reports of bad connections inside the distributor where a "new and improved" breaker plate eliminates the little wire between the two plates. See if you are using one of them in there. The poor connection makes the ignition cut in and out.

I also know that screwing the pop-out cable into the distributor housing too far will cause intermittent ignition cut out conditions. Count the turns and don't go more than about 3 or 4. Don't screw it in tight.

Does your ammeter needle jump around when the engine starts acting up?

Good luck with this. I know how frustrating this sort of thing can be.

[johnbuckley]

Have we got this right?!?!?... fuel is dripping out of the carb but the running improves when you enrich the mix with the GAV/choke?!?!? .

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by spdway1

Seems to me, "Two Nuts" and "Baby" is a carb doner for a few hours!
Is Baby a M or FM? Just Wondering?
Beware bad weather is on its way.

That's my plan, taking the carb off the roadster, but I have a very long 2 weeks ahead of me. It's going to have to wait.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Jim/TX

If the distributor is using points and condenser, I recommend you check the point gap. New cam followers wear as they rub on the cam and burnish in, even with cam grease used. I go in and adjust new points back out to spec a few times in the first few hundred miles. Eventually the follower stops wearing down so fast.

Yes, as odd as it sounds, points that are not open enough can be compensated for with a richer mixture, to a point.

You might also try a new condenser. They are cheap and easy to swap out. Normally I don't support throwing new parts at a problem, but there is no easier way to test for a bad condenser than to put in a new one.

We have also had reports of bad connections inside the distributor where a "new and improved" breaker plate eliminates the little wire between the two plates. See if you are using one of them in there. The poor connection makes the ignition cut in and out.

I also know that screwing the pop-out cable into the distributor housing too far will cause intermittent ignition cut out conditions. Count the turns and don't go more than about 3 or 4. Don't screw it in tight.

Does your ammeter needle jump around when the engine starts acting up?

Good luck with this. I know how frustrating this sort of thing can be.

Yes, when this happens and I pull over, gas is dripping from the intake of the carb, if I choke, the car smooths out. It will idle fine, but once you try to give it any power, it bucks and you cannot move. At first a little choke would smooth it out and you have about 80% power. In the past you go a mile and push the choke it and you're fine. Now I could not get it to correct. The man who rebuilt the carb says to increase the GAV, but at first I thought it fixed it, but it is very intermittent. I have tried all GAV settings from 0 to 360 degrees. Some time it lasts for a moment, yesterday for 20 miles. This was the worst. Many are suggesting electrical, I have put my multimeter on every part and everything checks out. I don't know why something electrical would cause gas to come out of the carb, or how restricting air intake would correct an electrical problem. This car has less than 200 miles on it. I am going to swap out the carb, that should give me an answer, but work is going to prevent me from doing this for 2 weeks.
I will re-gap the points and see what changes. The problem I have is that the car runs great for 3 days, then this, then better, then bad. It might last a minute, now it lasted 45 minutes. So it is very hard to nail down, but I am getting some great input, this site is great.
Thank you for you assistance

[ctvpa]

[QUOTE=Jim/

Does your ammeter needle jump around when the engine starts acting up?

Good luck with this. I know how frustrating this sort of thing can be.[/QUOTE]

No, ammeter is unchanged

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by johnbuckley

Have we got this right?!?!?... fuel is dripping out of the carb but the running improves when you enrich the mix with the GAV/choke?!?!? .

Yes, the engine will be running fine. This happens all of a sudden you lose all power. When I pull over, I see gas dripping out of the intake. A friend was in the car the other day and we were going along fine, then no power. He pulled the choke and it smoothed out. He thought the float or the float valve was the issue. We would shut off the fuel, wait for the engine to start to sputter while taping the carb, when it would sputter I would turn on the gas, and we had some success.
That made us think of a stuck float or valve, but every time I check, it works fine.
At first just a little choke would smooth it out, yesterday I needed full choke, and ran so rich I overheated. Today it starts fine.
As I have said, I am trying all the things people are sending me, but I agree the test is to swap out the carb. My work schedule will prevent that for over 2 weeks.
Thank you for helping, I'm trying every thing. I'm going to try valium next, lots of it.

[Russ/40]

I can see that the responses are going back and forth, fuel - ignition. In my experiences, "bucking" is caused by intermittent ignition. I would direct my efforts in that direction, even though you see fuel dripping. You may have more than one problem.

[steve s]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

... I can be driving along, it can be running fine, then suddenly no power, sputtering, awful bucking. .... often self corrects, ...It is very intermittent. I can drive the car several times (at 1/4 gav) with no problem. Then you can be driving down the road, and it's just like you clicked a switch, you have nothing. .... happening at all speeds and difference position of the GOV did nothing. .... You never know when , it happens at any speed, any time.

When it happens, you can see gas coming from the carb. Slow drip.

Today was the worst. I almost had to be towed. It ran fine for 20 miles, then loss of power suddenly. If I pull the choke a bit I can smooth it out. Usually after a mile or so, that sometimes works, and I can slowly reduce the choke and it works. Today I even pulled the carb bowl and the float is fine, not leaking or sinking, no gas into the float so it's not a hole in the float , and it still barley runs. I had to use full choke, all the way home, bucking so bad in some areas I was at 5 mph. ....

"Intermittent", "sudden", and "any speeds" all scream electrical problem to me. Remember, you can turn the fuel shut-off valve off and still drive for a while without the engine stumbling. It would take a big floatie drifting in and out of the main jet to cause such a problem at highway speeds; most of the time, it's the finer idle jet that gets plugged, which isn't your problem.

I think the need for choking and the dripping carb are red herrings: have you always been choking it before you see the drips? It takes very little choking to make an A carb drip! A weak spark will have an easier time igniting a rich mixture, although it will be very inefficient--just like when you choke it for a cold start. Also, enriching the mixture is a common trick for making motor run cooler, not overheat (more heat is absorbed to vaporize the fuel).

I've seen this sort of thing five times. Three times it was an intermittently bad ignition switch. The fourth time it was loose battery terminals. Have you tried the jumper wire directly from battery to ignition, as someone suggested earlier. Also, if you can ever get it idling well in your driveway, try jiggling everything to see if you can bring it on--all connections, terminals, distributor, etc. The fifth time it was a bad distributor body being shorted to by a too-close spark plug strap. BUT, it could be anywhere in the primary or secondary ignition circuits--maybe something as simple as a loose nut on the ammeter connection.

Do not place any faith in the fact that some part is "new" or has been recently rebuilt, even if it's been done "professionally". Experience teaches that this is more of a red flag than a comfort--sad to say. It's not like going to a real dealership repair service. With a recent restoration, every single thing is in play.

Steve

[Kohnke Rebabbitting]

If you have gas running out the air intake, it is the carb.

That does not happen, unless there is to much gas, from chocking, or otherwise.

The float valve could have a defect, or a crack in the casting.

Anything Electrical, won't make the carb. overflow.

Switching carbs will do it.

[William Kelchner]

Wow I hope you find this problem. My 30 pulled the same stunt once, shut off, restarted, idled great -- gas pouring out of the carb - but don't even think about letting the clutch out and trying to move. Got rollbacked home. I vacuumed the fuel tank with air compressor suction method - put new gas in and no more problem--knock knock.

My car does not get that much mileage during the winter months and at the end of the year I suction the old ethonol out before the cruising season starts and refill the tank.

Don't know if questionable gas could even be related to your problem but you never know. Don't leave any stone unturned. Good luck

[Phil]

When it starts acting ugly pull over and stop. Turn the gas valve off. Remove the sediment bowl. If it is clean gas pour gas Back in tank if it has gunk dispose of it reinstall sediment bowl, leave loose so it will not air lock turn the gas valve on for a five count. Turn it off. If the bowl is fuel=good gas flow. If bowl in not full it is getting gunk in the tank filter or valve.

Guys are saying ignition, but pulling the choke is causing improvement it is fuel related.

[wensum]

Sometimes a very weak spark needs a rich mixture to fire
The erratic nature of your problem could be the condenser?
Keith

[Joe K]

I'm kind of leaning on a coil issue. I have a John Deere 110 lawn tractor that has a resisted ignition (unlike the Model A) and it started getting flaky for no reason about a month before it finally failed altogether.

I'd be mowing and then the engine would start missing and then bucking and then stop. But would start right up again and run for a couple more swaths of mowing - and then do the bucking thing again.

One day I was most exasperated and finally got the hand mower to finish the lawn.

On final failure JD wouldn't run at all and no spark. I couldn't even get a poke from the ignition wire by putting my tongue on it! (kidding) Aha says me - gotta be coil as everything was fine up to this point.

A new coil at NAPA (yes they still have 12v resistor internal coils) and off I went. I think it cost like $12.

But this sounding VERY similar.

Joe K

[supergnat]

Here is an easy thing to check.

Check to be sure that your fixed point in the distributor is tight after the locking screw is tightened. I had a problem with my fixed point block which allowed the fixed point to be turn and move around even thought the locking screw was tight. This may be a shot in the dark but it is easy to check. I replaced the fixed point block and the problem was fixed. I identified the problem by using a VOM meter to check the voltage across the points while I hand cranked the engine. The voltage level was very inconsistent. Good luck.
Supergnat

[ericr]

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is the iron sediment bowl on the firewall clean inside?

[Purdy Swoft]

What kind of carburetor are you using? I see that you stated that the float is set at one inch, this would be correct for a tillotson model X or XF. The model A type Zenith float should be set at 5/8. If you have the float set at one inch on a zenith carb, that is the problem. One inch float setting on a Zenith carb would be starving for fuel and would probably require full choke to run at any strain at all.

[Rex_A_Lott]

By any chance do you have a paper element inline fuel filter? If so, get rid of it, use the ones that are just a screen if you feel you need it. Try a tank of non-ethanol gas.It sounds like its running out of gas, that's why the choke helps.
I had one doing what you describe. No pattern to it, no rhyme or reason I could see. Some days it ran fine. This worked for me. Good Luck.

[satelite]

I had a similar situation on my Town Sedan. Ran for a while then suddenly would stop running without warning (like someone turned off the fuel). turned out to be a section of fuel tank coating would float over the gas tank hole to the fuel line chocking off the fuel to the carburetor. I would stop for a few minutes then try to restart, worked fine for a few minutes until the floating material got sucked over the gas tank hole, then it would suddenly stop again. It was hard to find because the material was almost transparent. At first I would fish out the material (approximately 1-1/2' in diameter and 1 mil thick). I ended up draining the gas tank then flushing it with lacquer thinner several times. That solved the problem. Fortunately I didn't have to remove the tank. Ethanol in the gas was the problem. Whoever restored the car before I got it had used coating material that eventually dissolved the gas tank coating.
Could be you have the same problem!
Hope this helps, Don in SC

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Phil

When it starts acting ugly pull over and stop. Turn the gas valve off. Remove the sediment bowl. If it is clean gas pour gas Back in tank if it has gunk dispose of it reinstall sediment bowl, leave loose so it will not air lock turn the gas valve on for a five count. Turn it off. If the bowl is fuel=good gas flow. If bowl in not full it is getting gunk in the tank filter or valve.

Guys are saying ignition, but pulling the choke is causing improvement it is fuel related.

I have dropped the bowl and cleaned it several times, never found any debris. I hand operated the float and the float valve works great. Plenty of flow.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by satelite

I had a similar situation on my Town Sedan. Ran for a while then suddenly would stop running without warning (like someone turned off the fuel). turned out to be a section of fuel tank coating would float over the gas tank hole to the fuel line chocking off the fuel to the carburetor. I would stop for a few minutes then try to restart, worked fine for a few minutes until the floating material got sucked over the gas tank hole, then it would suddenly stop again. It was hard to find because the material was almost transparent. At first I would fish out the material (approximately 1-1/2' in diameter and 1 mil thick). I ended up draining the gas tank then flushing it with lacquer thinner several times. That solved the problem. Fortunately I didn't have to remove the tank. Ethanol in the gas was the problem. Whoever restored the car before I got it had used coating material that eventually dissolved the gas tank coating.
Could be you have the same problem!
Hope this helps, Don in SC

Thank you for your reply. I used a flexible fiberoptic scope, no debris. Freshly coated, and clean as a whistle.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Rex_A_Lott

By any chance do you have a paper element inline fuel filter? If so, get rid of it, use the ones that are just a screen if you feel you need it. Try a tank of non-ethanol gas.It sounds like its running out of gas, that's why the choke helps.
I had one doing what you describe. No pattern to it, no rhyme or reason I could see. Some days it ran fine. This worked for me. Good Luck.

I have heard of so many problems with the paper filter. At this show, the car in front of me had their paper filter catch on fire after a backfire.
I am using non ethanol gas.
Thank you for your input.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Joe K

I'm kind of leaning on a coil issue. I have a John Deere 110 lawn tractor that has a resisted ignition (unlike the Model A) and it started getting flaky for no reason about a month before it finally failed altogether.

I'd be mowing and then the engine would start missing and then bucking and then stop. But would start right up again and run for a couple more swaths of mowing - and then do the bucking thing again.

One day I was most exasperated and finally got the hand mower to finish the lawn.

On final failure JD wouldn't run at all and no spark. I couldn't even get a poke from the ignition wire by putting my tongue on it! (kidding) Aha says me - gotta be coil as everything was fine up to this point.

A new coil at NAPA (yes they still have 12v resistor internal coils) and off I went. I think it cost like $12.

But this sounding VERY similar.

Joe K

Thank you for your advice, I touched a multi meter to the ignition wires, all function fine.

[Joe K]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

Thank you for your advice, I touched a multi meter to the ignition wires, all function fine.

Ah, that now. But in full stumble mode you might find different.

But maybe like the tractor the problem will er, "disappear?"

Of course operation disappeared at the same time.

I was fortunate with the tractor. Left it in mid swath, I went in and googled John Deere 110 burned out coil symptoms, inquired further on resistor versus non-resistor coils (got an education), and then read the guidance of someone who needed a coil for his John Deere 110 and had inquired on the Internet.

A respondent at that JD web board even indicated the proper NAPA stock number.

Went to NAPA, bought the coil off the shelf, back to the mower after stopping for tools and replaced the coil. Started on the second crank. And ran. And hasn't stumbled or stopped now two years since.

Wot a tool this Internet!

Hope you figure it out. Keep swapping off parts with your other, er, more successful running Model A until you find the offending component.

This is how car repairs are handled at the dealerships now for those items that the computer can't diagnose: they simply start having you buy and replace parts - one by one at the hourly rate of $120 per.

You're lucky - you own the parts and labor in this case.

Good luck,
Joe K

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Some of your symptoms don't "compute"???
I would suggest you mount a small low draw or LED bulb in the middle of a jumper test wire. Hook it to the + side (dist. side) of the coil, out under the back of the hood, & inside the open windshield & to some ground point inside the car. Watch it's NORMAL flashing & see if it changes when car runs bad. At the least, it will let you know IF it's ignition related. (Be sure to use a low current draw bulb!)Bill W.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

Thank you for your advice, I touched a multi meter to the ignition wires, all function fine.

I hope you mean the coil primary terminals.

When I read ignition wires, I think the spark plug wires, which of course would be bad for a multimeter.

[Jim/GA]

I would not rule out the coil either. Seriously. Easy to swap out for a quick test. Pick one up at NAPA (IC-12 for a 6 volt car).

Fuel dripping out of the carb when you shut the engine off could be a result of all the choking you were doing, trying to keep it running.

[Tom Wesenberg]

I thought the coil was mentioned as being replaced?

Maybe that was another thread with an engine miss.

[31 A4door]

Something nobody has mentioned and I hope it's not the issue but is there water in the gas tank? If you used a tank of fuel I would think any water in there is out by now....But this could do the same thing ?? Other than that I have to go with some sort of of ignition thing.
Recently I have run into missing and popping because of the faulty ignition switch. Could your ignition switch be failing once you were up and running for a while and then it starts to fail once the contacts get warm> ???

[MB30Roadster]

I had the same thing happen to me today. Took my Roadster out for a quick trip this afternoon and a couple miles into it and she started choking, bucking and backfiring. I pulled over and she idled just fine but, acceleration was out of the question. It sounded like the fuel was boiling in the carb when I got out and threw the hood open (she was dripping fuel also). After a few minutes of cooling off, I was able to limp her back home. Sounds like most of the advice is to check ignition first...and go from there. Let me know how it works out for you. Any other advice? I sure do learn alot from you guys out there...thanks a million!

Mitch

[Tom Wesenberg]

I was also thinking it sounds a lot like the problems I had when using 10% ethanol crap gas, but I believe the owner said he is using the good gas.

[Geo. H]

I think it's a fuel problem. Do I understand you have a filter in the fuel line seperate from the one in the carb and the one in the settling bowl? If you do, take it out. The A's gravity feed doesn't give enough pressure for a modern filter. I also do not trust coating the inside of the tank. What did you use? Are you sure it's alky proof? Are you finding any little bits of coating material when you clean screens and filters?

[1931 flamingo]

Are you using one of the "micro" filters in the glass bowl??
Paul in CT

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Geo. H

I think it's a fuel problem. Do I understand you have a filter in the fuel line seperate from the one in the carb and the one in the settling bowl? If you do, take it out. The A's gravity feed doesn't give enough pressure for a modern filter. I also do not trust coating the inside of the tank. What did you use? Are you sure it's alky proof? Are you finding any little bits of coating material when you clean screens and filters?

I have all three filters with fine brass mesh. I have checked all, with no debris. I used a commercial tank sealer from Mike's. I used a flexible fiberoptic scope to inspect the tank. nothing
But thanks for the input

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

Are you using one of the "micro" filters in the glass bowl??
Paul in CT

I have a cast bowl, with the new filter.
Thank you for your thought

[Bill in Al]

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Condensor

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Bill in Al

Condensor

Would a condenser problem be intermittent? And would it change with adjusting the choke?

[klawockvet]

I had a very similar problem. Had a brand new repop distributor so I knew that wasnt the problem. I rebuilt the carb again. Drained all the gas and replaced it. Then rebuilt the sediment bowl. Nothing worked. Even though I had a brand new distributor I pulled it out and put in the old worn out one with barely any point gap and a worn out shaft. Ran perfect. I replaced the condenser in the repop dist and it runs like a champ. Condensers are cheap and I would give it a try.

[Bill in SoCal]

Originally Posted by Bill in SoCal

So - let us know what happened?

Bill

What happened?

Bill

[Jim/GA]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

Would a condenser problem be intermittent? And would it change with adjusting the choke?

Yes, condenser can start acting up when it gets hot, work better when cools.

Yes, weak spark from bad condenser can be compensated for with richer mixture.

It is not impossible...

[Don/WI]

At one point you said that you were going to try the carb from your roadster. I don't recall reading that you did that. If you did, what were the results?
As others have said, try a new coil and then a new condenser (one at a time). Don't question how this could be the problem, just do it to prove that some of us may be wrong. You might surprise yourself. Good luck. Don/WI

[jerry tocci]

Remove gas cap!

[jerry tocci]

Remove gas cap

[jerry tocci]

gas cap?

[Del in NE Ohio]

Same thing happened to me two summers ago on a club tour in Michigan/Wisconsin.. I fought for DAYS, never knowing when it might occur. I nursed it home and drained the fuel tank.. It hasn't happened since. As near as I could tell, It started not long after a I bought gas in southern Michigan.

[ddweave]

Jerry - see page 2.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by jerry tocci

gas cap?

Thanks, if you read what I have tried so far, when it happened at speed, my windshield was open, and I removed the gas cap, so no vapor lock.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Del in NE Ohio

Same thing happened to me two summers ago on a club tour in Michigan/Wisconsin.. I fought for DAYS, never knowing when it might occur. I nursed it home and drained the fuel tank.. It hasn't happened since. As near as I could tell, It started not long after a I bought gas in southern Michigan.

Thank you for your help, I have drained the tank, cleaned the carb, checked the float, removed all the gas lines and ran a wire brush through it.
Please keep thinking

[ctvpa]

I work long hours during the week, I will change the carb this weekend and post an update. I did have time to put a multimeter on everything and it checks out. But remember I could not check things during the event, because I can't just catch it.

I thank you all for your input. I will keep you updated.

[steve s]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

I work long hours during the week, I will change the carb this weekend and post an update. I did have time to put a multimeter on everything and it checks out. But remember I could not check things during the event, because I can't just catch it.

I thank you all for your input. I will keep you updated.

Don't over interpret your multimeter data. Proper voltages mean you have a fully charged battery, no broken connections or fuses, and no shorts--RIGHT THEN. However, if the problem is an intermittent contact, a good reading just means you don't have the problem right at the moment. If the problem is a poor, weak connection, you will still see the full, proper voltage under no-load test conditions.

Steve

[Smurkey]

The fact it is intermittent makes this problem less, though not entirely, unlikely but it sure sounds like a vacuum leak to me.

Vacuum leak=lean mixture=need to enrich (via choke).

[Bruce_MO]

I'm with Tiny and Ron...find someone close by who'll loan you a carb from a car that runs well. That will sharpen your focus a lot. Good luck and remember that troubleshooting is FUN!

[snowbird06]

Just a thought. Be sure your gas cap is venting properly. Sometimes the cork gasket around the inner rim covers the vent holes as they compress. I trimmed mine back a fair bit to clear the holes. I check it regularly as it can rotate when tightening down the gas cap. These fuel systems work on gravity alone....

[Rex_A_Lott]

I'm thinking the test w/ the known good carb is going to tell the tale.At least it will cut the options down a little. Hope he has the day off to get it done tomorrow.

[snowbird06]

Also, check ground to from battery to frame to be sure it is a clean connection. Fuel and electrical issues can mimic each other. I have been there.....

[snowbird06]

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Don't give up. I'm sure you will find the issue....Process of elemination.

[Rex_A_Lott]

I know this is an old thread that died....just wondered if the car was ever fixed and what was the solution? It might help somebody else down the road.
Thanks

[Bill in Al]

I'm sure a lot of us want to know the solution if any. Condenser?

[Farrell In Vancouver]

I am going to side with the condenser crowd. We had the exact same symptoms on my Dad's Tudor. Bout drove us nuts. Then it would be fine. Then it would do it again. Finaly he blew his exhaust sytem up and called me for help. After cleaning the carb six times, going through the fuel system and all the usual suspects, I grabbed my spare distributor and headed out to where he was stranded. Popped it in and she ran like a top. Once home he swapped a new condenser in his original sparker and after six weeks of fooling around with everything,( ignition,points, coil, gas cap, etc) all was good. I had asked him to try another condenser and he said he had.........another old repop one with what must have been the same issues. Since then we are both packing brand new and tested units for an emergency. It can't hurt to try right?
Hope it helps, Cheers!

[Bill in SoCal]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

I work long hours during the week, I will change the carb this weekend and post an update. I did have time to put a multimeter on everything and it checks out. But remember I could not check things during the event, because I can't just catch it.

I thank you all for your input. I will keep you updated.

Three weeks ago you were going to switch out the carbonator from your working Model A to this problem car. It would take less than 30 minutes to switch out the carbonator and distributor from your working Model A to this one. Why not do that and let us know what happens. Bill

[Marshall57]

If it were me I would use a little pony tank fitted into the engine compartment and bypass the stock fuel system completely. Borrow a known working carburetor and do a little driving. It would be a big help to eliminate the fuel question from the electrical question. Sometimes finding out what it isn’t is a huge nudge in the right direction.