Violent shake.

[Terry Wilkerson]

So to start with I have a 1950 Ford Custom. I have replaced the clutch, pressure plate, throw out bearing and hub. I had the flywheel resurfaced. It also has new u joints.
From a dead stop the car shakes hard. It smoothes out after the car gets moving. It's only on a start. I do hear a mechinacal sound some times when at speed. Any ideas?

[Seth Swoboda]

Have you checked all of your steering coponents for wear or anything that is loose? Drag link, tie rod ends, king pins?

[Terry Wilkerson]

King pins have been changed. No loose steering parts either.

[tubman]

Check the motor mounts (and the transmission mount while you're at it).

[Don T]

Are you talking about clutch chatter or is it after the clutch is fully released?

[Terry Wilkerson]

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I will check the motor mounts.

[Terry Wilkerson]

It happens just as the clutch engages the flywheel.

[Terry Wilkerson]

I was just thinking us it possible pinion angle could cause this?

[OhioRick]

Here’s an option.
Engine steady rods.

[19Fordy]

Those steady rods won't fit a 1950 Ford.

[Ggmac]

Broken rear leaf on spring pack , loose or broken shackles, loose u bolts to axle housing .
Of course youve already checked the obvious clutch possibles . Trans mount and motor mounts or oil on the disc or a bad pressure plate .

[Tony, NY]

Did you have the shake prior to doing all this work?

[1939mars]

Is there any play in the clutch pedal when it is all the way up? If not the clutch may not be fully engaging.

[Terry Wilkerson]

Originally Posted by Tony, NY

Did you have the shake prior to doing all this work?

Yes the problem was the reason for changing the clutch parts. Turns out the clutch was not the problem.

[Terry Wilkerson]

Originally Posted by 1939mars

Is there any play in the clutch pedal when it is all the way up? If not the clutch may not be fully engaging.

The free play is set to 1 1/4.

[Lanny]

Terry, I read where you installed most all the New clutch parts,
but curious, did you install a New Pilot bearing/bushing too ?
A wore out pilot bearing/bushing will cause one heck of a shake.




.

[cmbrucew]

I had the same issues in 1960 on my 50 Ford. I had the flywheel resurfaced. Should have had it balanced at the same time.
Bruce

[Terry Wilkerson]

Originally Posted by Lanny

Terry, I read where you installed most all the New clutch parts,
but curious, did you install a New Pilot bearing/bushing too ?
A wore out pilot bearing/bushing will cause one heck of a shake.




.

Yes I had a new pilot bearing installed by the machine shop.

[Seth Swoboda]

Tell us about the engine. Is it newly rebuilt or an older engine? Someone mentioned an oil soaked clutch and yes, that will cause a violent chatter when you let the clutch out. What is the surface of the flywheel like? Does it have hot spots?

[Terry Wilkerson]

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

Tell us about the engine. Is it newly rebuilt or an older engine? Someone mentioned an oil soaked clutch and yes, that will cause a violent chatter when you let the clutch out. What is the surface of the flywheel like? Does it have hot spots?

I don't know the history of the engine. It does run pretty good. Starts with no hesitation. The clutch wasn't oil soaked. I had the flywheel resurfaced.
Earlier in this thread I mentioned pinion angle. Do you think that could cause a shake?

[joe 1950]

i can relate to the problem had the same thing with my 50 cpe. to make a long story short my flywheel was also surfaced but the first shop that did it put it on a surface grinder after another take down i took it to a well known machine shop that machined in on a milling machine the fellow who did it told me that it was shaped like dinner plate it was concaved in the middle anyway put it all to together and problem solved work’s great good luck

[Dick]

My '49 had this same thing happening when I got it.
I had 2 NEW miss aligned hub/bearing assemblies.

Final solution was NOS hub and NOS bearing that I assembled making sure the bearing was seated correctly to the hub.

It's been smooth as glass for 3k miles now.

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by Dick

My '49 had this same thing happening when I got it.
I had 2 NEW miss aligned hub/bearing assemblies.

Final solution was NOS hub and NOS bearing that I assembled making sure the bearing was seated correctly to the hub.

It's been smooth as glass for 3k miles now.

[Seth Swoboda]

Originally Posted by Terry Wilkerson

I don't know the history of the engine. It does run pretty good. Starts with no hesitation. The clutch wasn't oil soaked. I had the flywheel resurfaced.
Earlier in this thread I mentioned pinion angle. Do you think that could cause a shake?

What would cause the pinion angle to change from a stock set up? Have you changed the rear end components?

[Terry Wilkerson]

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

What would cause the pinion angle to change from a stock set up? Have you changed the rear end components?

I haven't changed the rear end. A guy just doesn't know what has been done by others in the past.

[Flathead Fever]

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If everything was done right on the clutch replacement, I'd be looking at the motor and trans mounts.

[1948F-1Pickup]

I went through this chatter deal on the truck. Turned out to be a bunch of small things... all adding up.
-several items in the pedal linkage were worn out or ovalized
-engine mounts needed replacement
-that dinner plate style flywheel wear scenario in post #21..... or something very similar was going on with mine. When I took everything apart for getting the engine rebuilt, I was surprised at how wonky that flywheel/disc/pressure plate interface had become under the previous owner's care or lack thereof.

[Terry Wilkerson]

A lot of good info here. I'm planning on taking things back apart and check things.
Please keep giving your thoughts and I appreciate it all.

[Don T]

If you are going to inspect or check pinion angles just be aware the stock 50 uses what is known as a "broken back" system of alignment. If the front u joint angles down the back will also angle down and the angles should match each other. This minimizes driveshaft hump in these cars but stresses the joints as everything moves up and down.

[Terry Wilkerson]

Originally Posted by Don T

If you are going to inspect or check pinion angles just be aware the stock 50 uses what is known as a "broken back" system of alignment. If the front u joint angles down the back will also angle down and the angles should match each other. This minimizes driveshaft hump in these cars but stresses the joints as everything moves up and down.

Thanks for that info. I've never heard of that.

[T Scott]

Originally Posted by Terry Wilkerson

So to start with I have a 1950 Ford Custom. I have replaced the clutch, pressure plate, throw out bearing and hub. I had the flywheel resurfaced. It also has new u joints.
From a dead stop the car shakes hard. It smoothes out after the car gets moving. It's only on a start. I do hear a mechinacal sound some times when at speed. Any ideas?

"mechanical sound" does not sound good. I would inspect the u joints for play. Slack in the driveline can cause clutch chatter. I had a similar issue that was solved by replacing the u joints.

[alchemy]

Originally Posted by Don T

If you are going to inspect or check pinion angles just be aware the stock 50 uses what is known as a "broken back" system of alignment. If the front u joint angles down the back will also angle down and the angles should match each other. This minimizes driveshaft hump in these cars but stresses the joints as everything moves up and down.

The concept of two U-joints was only a couple years old for Ford, and they must not have understood how they worked. Maybe now is the time to fix the alignment properly.

[Don T]

Some mid 60,s Studebakers also used this system. It is not a "wrong" system just a different system to prevent driveline vibration. If the cars suspension heights were messed with; front and or back, it could cause a problem but I am guessing vibration at speed would be more likely.

[Terry Wilkerson]

So I sent my clutch parts to Fort Wayne Clutch today. A gentleman named Lou is going to check them out. Lou ask me to send the new parts I bought from Shoebox Central. I'll but anything he says is not useable or rebuildable.

[Terry Wilkerson]

Originally Posted by alchemy

The concept of two U-joints was only a couple years old for Ford, and they must not have understood how they worked. Maybe now is the time to fix the alignment properly.

I am in agreement with alchemy. Seem like correcting the brokeback pinion angle could not hurt.

[Terry Wilkerson]

Update on Violent Shake. It's fixed. I'd like to thank Dick Mortieay. He helped me figure out that I had a Mis matched group of parts. The car is a 1950 ford custom. Turns out it has a later modle Merc cast bell housing. It did have the 50 ford throughout bearing. The bearing did not fit correctly on the Merc arm. Ultimately I sent the new parts I bought from shoebox central to Fort Wayne Clutch. They did there magic on them and also sent me the correct throughout bearing for the Merc bellhousing. Put it all back together and it's good. Thanks to all for the responses also.