The Ford Barn

Gold Digger · 01-01-2023, 09:54 PM

Some people don't use gland rings anymore. I have always tried to use them if I could make them work on a used manifold. I was wondering if anyone could tell me what the right depth of counter bore is for the gland ring to fit in on the engine block. Do the rings fit loose in between the manifold and the engine block when tightened or do they crimp, or do they exactly fit? I'm building a new Burtz engine and they're not machined for gland rings. I'm putting a new manifold on and what is everyone's thoughts on machining this into the block to keep from warping it.

Richard Knight · 01-02-2023, 01:15 AM

They don't crimp unless the groove in the block still has carbon in it. But I know you are wondering about the burtz block. I always try to use the rings. I was a little disappointed that the burtz block was not counter bored for the rings. I seriously considered doing it but in the end let it slide. I also am using a new exhaust manifold with no leaks at this time. As to the rings I just purchased I think they are crap. Too loose because the strip of metal was cut too short before making it round.

Big hammer · 01-02-2023, 08:15 AM

Spread the rings at the gap, squeeze the ring when installing, thusly holding in place. If your rings aren’t springy buy new ones ! As for your new block’s not having bores for rings………call Terry at Burtz

BillCNC · 01-02-2023, 03:58 PM

In always use them and keep a few sets on hand. They keep the exhaust manifold from sagging from heat over time.

Regards
Bill

1crosscut · 01-02-2023, 05:32 PM

I don't use the gland rings. If my manifold ends up warping because of it, it means I've had many, many miles of fun to make that happen.

aermotor · 01-02-2023, 07:18 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by BillCNC

In always use them and keep a few sets on hand. They keep the exhaust manifold from sagging from heat over time.

Regards
Bill

I don't see how a thin (apparently) mild steel gland ring could possibly keep a heavy cast iron manifold from sagging if everything else is at it should be. IMO after a few heat cycles the gland ring would be useless and like others have stated that they would end in the muffler.

Richard Knight · 01-02-2023, 09:56 PM

The gland rings I got are dead soft and too short leave an 1/8" gap, useless. They do help with less than perfect manifold. I don't know about keeping a manifold from sagging but If i can only get the rear one in that is what I would do. I bought an otwell health heater for my 29 Briggs and it fits on the block perfect with all four rings.

alexiskai · 01-03-2023, 01:25 AM

Whether you think the original purpose of the gland rings was purely to seal the gasket away from the exhaust gases, or also to assist with indexing the manifold on installation, or also to prevent manifold warping, in any of those three cases the rings must be snug to the counterbore, with almost no gap in the ring, in order to be any help.

old31 · 01-03-2023, 04:23 AM

I found my gland rings in side my exhaust pipe.

Bob Bidonde · 01-03-2023, 08:49 AM

In operation, the gland rings expand diametrically to fill the counter-bores, so make sure you have a gap when fitting them at room temperature. It has been my experience that the gland ring at the back manifold port has little to no ability to prevent the exhaust manifold from eventually sagging.

alexiskai · 01-03-2023, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Bidonde

It has been my experience that the gland ring at the back manifold port has little to no ability to prevent the exhaust manifold from eventually sagging.

Yeah, there’s a reason that, when Ford discovered the manifold warp problem in ‘31, they didn’t say “make sure you use those gland rings,” they changed the manifold design.

rotorwrench · 01-04-2023, 02:46 PM

The manifold support bolts are only one of the support system holding features. The other is the exhaust pipe clamp in the rear of the system. Ford really should have used another support closer to the manifold. All that pipe & muffler weight has a forward CG moment that hangs a good portion of the total weight off the manifold. It doesn't seem like lot but it's enough to have an affect after many heat up and cool down cycles.

If a person installs the stainless pipe & muffler assembly then it has even more weight hanging on there.

01-01-2023, 09:54 PM	#1
Gold Digger Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Arkansas & Alaska Posts: 645	Gland rings Some people don't use gland rings anymore. I have always tried to use them if I could make them work on a used manifold. I was wondering if anyone could tell me what the right depth of counter bore is for the gland ring to fit in on the engine block. Do the rings fit loose in between the manifold and the engine block when tightened or do they crimp, or do they exactly fit? I'm building a new Burtz engine and they're not machined for gland rings. I'm putting a new manifold on and what is everyone's thoughts on machining this into the block to keep from warping it.

01-02-2023, 01:15 AM	#2
Richard Knight Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 130	Re: Gland rings They don't crimp unless the groove in the block still has carbon in it. But I know you are wondering about the burtz block. I always try to use the rings. I was a little disappointed that the burtz block was not counter bored for the rings. I seriously considered doing it but in the end let it slide. I also am using a new exhaust manifold with no leaks at this time. As to the rings I just purchased I think they are crap. Too loose because the strip of metal was cut too short before making it round.

01-02-2023, 08:15 AM	#3
Big hammer Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Land of Lincoln Posts: 3,131	Re: Gland rings Spread the rings at the gap, squeeze the ring when installing, thusly holding in place. If your rings aren’t springy buy new ones ! As for your new block’s not having bores for rings………call Terry at Burtz __________________ Don't force it with a little hammer tap, tap, tap get a bigger hammer tap done

01-02-2023, 03:58 PM	#4
BillCNC Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: SoCal Desert Posts: 826	Re: Gland rings In always use them and keep a few sets on hand. They keep the exhaust manifold from sagging from heat over time. Regards Bill

01-02-2023, 05:32 PM	#5
1crosscut Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Lincoln, Nebraska Posts: 1,910	Re: Gland rings I don't use the gland rings. If my manifold ends up warping because of it, it means I've had many, many miles of fun to make that happen. __________________ Dave / Lincoln Nebraska

01-02-2023, 09:56 PM	#7
Richard Knight Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 130	Re: Gland rings The gland rings I got are dead soft and too short leave an 1/8" gap, useless. They do help with less than perfect manifold. I don't know about keeping a manifold from sagging but If i can only get the rear one in that is what I would do. I bought an otwell health heater for my 29 Briggs and it fits on the block perfect with all four rings.

01-03-2023, 01:25 AM	#8
alexiskai Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Mebane NC Posts: 2,356	Re: Gland rings Whether you think the original purpose of the gland rings was purely to seal the gasket away from the exhaust gases, or also to assist with indexing the manifold on installation, or also to prevent manifold warping, in any of those three cases the rings must be snug to the counterbore, with almost no gap in the ring, in order to be any help.

01-03-2023, 04:23 AM	#9
old31 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 2,103	Re: Gland rings I found my gland rings in side my exhaust pipe.

01-04-2023, 02:46 PM	#12
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,440	Re: Gland rings The manifold support bolts are only one of the support system holding features. The other is the exhaust pipe clamp in the rear of the system. Ford really should have used another support closer to the manifold. All that pipe & muffler weight has a forward CG moment that hangs a good portion of the total weight off the manifold. It doesn't seem like lot but it's enough to have an affect after many heat up and cool down cycles. If a person installs the stainless pipe & muffler assembly then it has even more weight hanging on there.