Bent armature wires

[Henry's Lady's Man]

In servicing my generator, I found a group of armature wires that were bent and scored, as if someone drug a screwdriver across them while spinning. They left their bent impression in the insulation behind them, as if this were done in the factory. The wires were almost touching (or touching), so I gently pried them apart and thus out of their impressions. Now, they are not "stuck" to the backing.

Can I use epoxy to stick 'em back to the armature windings more securely? Will epoxy cause an imbalance? Or just leave them alone? -Chuck
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[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by 1930 coupe

Use insulating varnish, it is made just for that purpose. You can find several brands and colors on Ebay.

Thanx, 1930 Coup; sounds like a fix!

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by 1930 coupe

It soaks into the windings to prevent vibration, you will need to apply 3 or 4 coats to make it thick on the surface.

Again, great advice. -Chuck

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by 1930 coupe

I have seen some armatures that are wrapped with cotton string, then the varnish is applied on top of the string, the varnish soaks through the string and makes a very strong bond.
Before applying string you need to make sure that you have enough clearance so that it does not rub when you put it back together.

Now THAT'S a new one for me! You gotta love all the home-grown repairs; I've read about using Pepsodent toothpaste for gas shutoff valve lapping, tin foil for heat-sink, duct tape for radiator hose, and now, string on the armature. I THINK I JUST MIGHT TRY IT.

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by Henry's Lady's Man

Now THAT'S a new one for me! You gotta love all the home-grown repairs; I've read about using Pepsodent toothpaste for gas shutoff valve lapping, tin foil for heat-sink, duct tape for radiator hose, and now, string on the armature. I THINK I JUST MIGHT TRY IT.

Maybe cotton thread (quilting thread) instead of string.

[Henry's Lady's Man]

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Originally Posted by Mike V. Florida

Maybe cotton thread (quilting thread) instead of string.

Are you saying the thread because it's thinner? Less chance of hitting?

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by Henry's Lady's Man

Are you saying the thread because it's thinner? Less chance of hitting?

Yes.

[Henry's Lady's Man]

I appreciate the good info, guys. I'm gonna give the cotton thread a go... Just gott wait for my ebay order of red GLPT insulating varnish to get here later next week. I'll give you both some feedback once it's reinstalled, and generator works.

The whole reason I serviced it was, it quit generating about 50 miles from home, and I drove 50 miles on battery only. The cutout is fine, but generator was 1 volt (from residual magnetism, I suppose). I FOUND THE BRUSHES TO BE LESS THAN HALF THE LENGTH OF NEW ONES.
So I'm taking care of this other issue while I'm in there. I'm hoping it will work with the new brushes, and I don't mess anything else up.

[RUNNERBUN]

All good advice given above. The only other thing I would check before applying the varnish is check the connection of the top wire in your photo that appears might be loose or about to break at the commutator connection for lack of solder, bit hard to tell if the connection is good. Easier to apply a little solder before applying the varnish.

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by RUNNERBUN

All good advice given above. The only other thing I would check before applying the varnish is check the connection of the top wire in your photo that appears might be loose or about to break at the commutator connection for lack of solder, bit hard to tell if the connection is good. Easier to apply a little solder before applying the varnish.

An ounce of prevention... Thanx

[Brentwood Bob]

Any thoughts about what caused the damage other than a screw driver in the wrong place?
Any damage to the fields? Anything loose lodged in a nook, or in a cranney?
Bob

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by Brentwood Bob

Any thoughts about what caused the damage other than a screw driver in the wrong place?
Any damage to the fields?
Bob

Bob,
I can't see ANY other damage or chunks of debris. The field coils look great, with just a tiny 1/4" flap of cloth that I have already used liquid tape on. It could have happened at the factory, or some clumsy person who "serviced" it in the past 85 years. This car has lots of original stuff on it.

[Fullraceflathead]

I would double check it on a Growler if you have access to one.

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by Fullraceflathead

I would double check it on a Growler if you have access to one.

Dang, those are expensive for a one-time use; does Auto Zone test for a small fee?

[Lawrie]

I had a bent wire on the armature on my 33,the generator always charged Ok ,but when stripping the gen to fix a squeak I saw one black segment on the comutator,This had the bent wire broken off,it was only charging the battery about 5.3 volts.
It always charged,BUT was hard to start,the starter always had trouble turning the motor, fitted a new armature ,and hey presto great starting now.

Lawrie

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by Lawrie

I had a bent wire on the armature on my 33,the generator always charged Ok ,but when stripping the gen to fix a squeak I saw one black segment on the comutator,This had the bent wire broken off,it was only charging the battery about 5.3 volts.
It always charged,BUT was hard to start,the starter always had trouble turning the motor, fitted a new armature ,and hey presto great starting now.

Lawrie

Interesting... my starter works real hard and slow. I just figured "that's 6V for ya!". Battery cables look fine. It should turn faster, you would think.

[kevinmac/toledo]

glyptal electric motor paint...find on web.....several coats like varnish,but better...they paint inside of race car motors to speed up oil return and seals block...good stuff...kev

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by kevinmac/toledo

glyptal electric motor paint...find on web.....several coats like varnish,but better...they paint inside of race car motors to speed up oil return and seals block...good stuff...kev

Kev,
I already ordered the red insulating varnish, but thanx, for future reference.

[Tom Wesenberg]

There should be someone or a generator shop in your town that has a growler. Also connect a 6 volt battery charger to the field windings. Connect the positive to ground and negative to the other end of the windings that goes to the movable brush. The charger should show about 4 to 5 amps draw across the field windings. Sometimes the connection between the field coils should be twisted and soldered. I've had to repair a few bad solder joints here.

The string was wound around the ends of the wires to hold them in place by the factory. The string is often dry rotted and needs to be replaced.

[Henry's Lady's Man]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

There should be someone or a generator shop in your town that has a growler. Also connect a 6 volt battery charger to the field windings. Connect the positive to ground and negative to the other end of the windings that goes to the movable brush. The charger should show about 4 to 5 amps draw across the field windings. Sometimes the connection between the field coils should be twisted and soldered. I've had to repair a few bad solder joints here.

The string was wound around the ends of the wires to hold them in place by the factory. The string is often dry rotted and needs to be replaced.

Thanx Tom,
So I should hunt down a growler. I DID use an ohm meter to check for consistent readings between adjacent commutator bars, and also on these bars 180 degrees apart, all the way around. I also found no commutator shorts to ground. I figure that only a growler will test it under load. I checked out a couple or three videos on "YouTube University"where a growler was used; while the armature was rotated, and an infra-red gun checked the temp of the armature. There was almost NO HEAT produced with a good one. The bad one had a steady rise in temp, due to a short. Also saw the hacksaw blade test.
I really do think it was just my brushes finally giving out. Two of them were worn MORE than half way down, compared to the new ones.
I won't put it back together till my varnish comes in tomorrow or Fri. Then, I could get it together this weekend. My full time job interferes with my progress.