1932 The Deuce, Dually, Dump Truck

[sugarmaker]

Folks,
The mystery of the large nut fizzled to a reality, thanks to freinds at local machine shop.
The thread is a 3/8-24 straight thread.



So I went to NAPA and bought two brass nuts that were for brass fittings. Center hole for the ferrel was just a little bigger but should function fine. I used a .020 thick blade on a dremel tool to cut the small tubing to 80 inches and sanded the ends to allow the ferrels to be inserted. Then soldered the ferrels on the ends of the capilary line, after the nuts were in place on the line. Not much solder required.


Also ran a tap in the 1/4-28 threads of the tank for the King Sealy unit to be bolted in place. I found that the seal washers were not used because the tank threads are blind. Never allowing any gas to enter the threads.



I cut a gasket from a roll of rubber impregnated cork gasket material good for gas contact. Traced the hole pattern from the original gasket. Punched the holes out.





Torqued these to about 10 ft lbs:


Just need to get the seal for the tank to floor, and think about raising the cab??

I did get my service book for 32's today. David, thanks for the suggestion!

Regards,
Chris

[DavidG]

I'd forgotten about the screw holes being dead ends in the commercial/truck cab fuel tank. Obviously whoever designed the tank, given that all this is at the bottom, deserved a gold star for good design. It's the passenger car tank with the counterpart tank unit inserted from the top that has the special washers as a good seal is required on top as there will be gasoline sloshing back and forth going around corners, for example. Those screw holes aren't dead ended.

[Model51]

Chris, for all the detective work. Can't wait to be back on my feet and in the garage to see the parts of my tank like yours. Now, thanks to David, I will certainly re-use my original copper washers and not worry that the asbestos is long gone from them. Perhaps Ford used copper washers on these bolts since the washers come in contact with the bronze(?) tank sending unit?
I'm interested in the gasket material too. I was considering re-using my original, but I'd rather have a one make from new material as it would likely seal better. I'll post pictures and dimensions of the tank gasket material soon (I hope). I'll also search for a source of the correct material.

[sugarmaker]

Dave,
I get impatient a lot. I am pretty sure with enough research the correct thick flat webbing may be out there. Will be watching your research for something better than I am going to try. Dont laugh too much here is my plan for the gas tank to body seal. Sorry this is side ways:




The concept is to have a center support of wood, 1/4 square stock from hardware. Then two beads of the glass setting material, one each side of the wood to provide the sealing portion. Like a lot of things in design, it looks good on paper! Will try to get started on this in the truck this afternoon. If it happens to work ok we should be one step closer to getting the truck moving again. And maybe with some improvements too!

Regards,
Chris

[DavidG]

Chris,


Since you have two objectives, your design makes sense, as almost any sealing material would compress with age given the weight of the tank. At the four corners you could add a third bead of glass setting between the gaps in the wood.

[sugarmaker]

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David, folks,
The concept is valid, getting it to function in the real world, may be different. Yes at the corners the sealing beads are very flexible so I as should be able to set it in the original foot print of the tank
Regards,
Chris

[Model51]

Your gas tank seal solution might work. I'm still going to get my original down and study it closely and let you know what I find out.

Meanwhile, on the wood blocks used to mount the body to the frame, I've attached the two pdf pages from my draft book which show the way it was done for 1935 and 1936 (maybe 1937 too??) truck (not pickup) cabs. Maybe DavidG has better information as both the cab sheet metal and the frame changed from the 1932-1934 BB style. Maybe this won't help you directly, but it might help somehow.

[sugarmaker]

Dave,
Thank you for the cab mount information. I see some similar items on the 32 cab frame for sure. Not sure I am going to lift the cab and remount it on new blocks. Will think on this one for a little while.
Regards,
Chris

[Model51]

My eldest son arrived home from Hawaii early this morning after an overnight flight from Honolulu for a three week visit. Before he took a nap, he got up on the ladder and brought down the gas tank gasket (maybe that's his first Christmas gift to me?).
I've had time to inspect and think about the gasket material. What I have is a woven material formed into a 3/4" wide and 1/4" tall cross-section. It appears to be impregnated with a tar or resin of some kind. I did a bit of math and determined that a 1/2" diameter circle provides the same volume as the gasket. Searching around on the web I discovered 1/2" diameter solid woven (not stranded) rope. The company was out of stock but the very nice sales person went to the back room and found a 24" scrap peice and then, even better, decided to ship it to me for no cost. One guess who my rope supplier will be if I can make this work. Now I need to figure out a good material for impregnating the rope, a mold to form it into the correct cross section and a way to cure it so it maintains the shape. My gasket has two notches cut at each corner to allow it to make a 90 degree bend and it's obvious these were cut with the gasket flat (not in a rope form). I've attached a bunch of pictures and await comments.

[sugarmaker]

Dave,
That looks just like my gasket. Yours appears to be in a tad better shape. It may have been round when installed? I have similar notches in the corners. Like me if you cant find something you begin to figure out how to make something that will work!
Thanks to your son for helping me too! Awesome he is home for the holidays with you.
You might check McMaster-Carr for some of there webbing materials. What did the tar do? Act as a glue to hold it in place like glue??
Well i dint get much done on my prototype tank to floor seal today. But I did exchange the 5/16 windshield bedding material for 3/8 inch. It is very soft and I want to get a little more squish, if I am going to try this method.
Hear is a mock up with the 5/16 seals and the wood sandwich:


Another product that might have merrit is rope seal used as pan gasket for maple syrup exuipment or wood stove door gaskets. Very flexible for sure, maybe could be soaked in a tar like substance and then flatened to near shape? The original material must have bee fairly stiff or the corners would not have been notched. Also this mut have been placed on the truck frame and some how stayed in position durring tank assembly. You wouldn't have wanted to play around with it while setting the tank. What about gluing it down with something tar like and it then provided the seal feature once set up??
Regards,
Chris

[Model51]

I'm thinking the tar or resin helped keep the rope flat when it cured or cooled. My gasket was stuck on the floor pan and remains slightly tacky even now, so that's how I bet it was installed on the assembly line.
I think the corner notches and three mounting holes were all punched or cut with the gasket in a flattened form. There's no way to make those corner notches with the gasket being round. I'm thinking the woven rope will be flexible enough to conform to a mold and if I can find the right resin, it will set up and hold the fibers in the desired shape. One can hope.

[sugarmaker]

Dave,
As I play with the parts I think your pretty close on this piece of the fuel tank puzzle!

Folks,
I did get the fuel gage ready to go in the dash using a couple snippets of the Butyl material to hold the glass, gasket, and the gauge text plackard.


Then installed the small air line in the truck through the same grommet at the speedometer cable. The 80 inch length looks about right, from the gauge to the tank sending unit.


FYI the materials I am going to try:


The larger sticky butyl may work ok?




Regards,
Chris

[Bob C]

How about hood lace? https://www.restorationspecialties.c...ace_c_235.html

[sugarmaker]

Bob,
I think that is pretty close match for material, size may be off a little but it might work just fine. My brain gets way in the weeds thinking about how and when these were installed in the trucks? Visions of the men on the line, throwing the seal in the truck and then setting the tank on it. Or was the seal on the tank held in place with some glue and set in place? I think Ford would have used gravity and good workman ship to place it in the truck first. the back would but up to the stiffner across the truck the front would match along the inside of the floor edge. The sides had to match up with the bolt holes, two on the drivers side, one on the passengers side. Tank set, bolts in, and on down the line!
Sorry I way over think things! You folks probably figured that out allready!
Regards,
Chris

[Model51]

The hood lace is a good idea. Same material but is dimensionally smaller and doesn't have the tackiness of the gas tank gasket. The hood lace also has a depression in the center giving it an "M" profile (at least the material I have is like that). I'm sure back in the day there was a complete line of widths, thicknesses, etc., but I think those suppliers have long gone away.
Don't forget that you want to have more height, not less, to keep the gas tank from rubbing on those bolt heads. So, for your application, a thicker gasket is better.
Give me a few weeks and I'll see if I can develop something that satisfies my overly perfectionist attitude. Honestly, I'd rather just buy the right stuff, cut it and be done, but sometimes I can't let go and I'm also curious how they did it back in the day.

[DavidG]

Hood lacing of the vintage kind, which had a hard core, would eventually succumb somewhat to gravity. That which is available these days with the soft white core would compress over night in that application.

[KDL]

Chris,
How would Brown Oakum work? Should seal well. Not sure how well it would support the weight or if it's right for the application. One example I found:
https://www.jamestowndistributors.co...yABEgJ_S_D_BwE
I've only seen it used in sealing cast iron plumbing but it looks like it has many uses.

[Model51]

I saw Oakum as a possibility but if you read several web sites, eventually the way it works becomes clearer and it's really not the correct material. Oakum is fiber and water-reactive resin. Stuff some oakum into a leaking pipe fitting and the resin reacts and locks the fibers in place sealing the leak. It's a great material, but not quite right for a gas tank to cab seal.

[sugarmaker]

Folks,
John helped me with the gas gauge. Stood on my head and added the red fluid from Straight-Eight. Moved right up to zero with about 1/2 of the fluid I got from them. I used a small eye dropper. Which fit right into the vial. Then just a drop at a time.
I may pull the speedometer again and get the light working. I think it would look pretty good for a night ride.
Will think about that and setting the tank tomorrow.
Thanks for checking in on me and the ragged ol truck!
Regards,
Chris

[DavidG]

Chris,


Unlike the '32s with V8 engines and the late four-cylinder vehicles, early and mid-year fours like yours originally did not have a separate switch for the instrument panel light. They were wired so that light came on when the head lamps were turned on, like it or not. I hope that that part of your original wiring harness is still intact and functional and that only the bulb needs replacing.