Steam Train Photo Op

[Special Coupe Frank]

Originally Posted by fordcoupe

Thank you for sharing my dad worked for the O&W brings back lots of memories

Hey Fordcoupe,

I think I recognize a lot of those cars in your avatar - do you belong to Steamtown A's ?


Both my grandads worked for the B&0, in downtown Baltimore, at the Mt. Clare Terminus and Shops. Dad's father was a foreman in the Erecting Shops, and Mom's father was a blacksmith, making leaf springs for the locomotives... he worked there from 1926 until they closed the facility in 1969.

Regards,

SC Frank

[40grit]

Originally Posted by Special Coupe Frank

Hey Fordcoupe,

I think I recognize a lot of those cars in your avatar - do you belong to Steamtown A's ?


Both my grandads worked for the B&0, in downtown Baltimore, at the Mt. Clare Terminus and Shops. Dad's father was a foreman in the Erecting Shops, and Mom's father was a blacksmith, making leaf springs for the locomotives... he worked there from 1926 until they closed the facility in 1969.

Regards,

SC Frank

My Grandfather worked for the B & O in Washington, Indiana at the roundhouse in the 50’s. I can remember going to sleep as a kid hearing the steem hammer that swedged the wheels booming in the distance.

[Pete]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

The weight was on the kickstand and the vacuum pulled the bike over on the other side. The same way a person walking too close to the tracks gets pulled into the train. The roadbed is excellent and only a year old.

It is a proven fact there is NO vacuum. If you set up a water manometer as close to the train as possible, there will be no flucuation in level at any legal train speed.

I was a track inspector for several years and I can see the ballast on that road bed needs regulating.

[Pete]

I might add this for your perusal.

From Mythbusters show #66.
The vortex from a passing train can suck a person onto the tracks.

BUSTED
Although small scale testing with model trains in a wind tunnel showed a vortex, the more dominant force when running the full size train was the air turbulence running alongside and away from the train. The force caused Ted, a dummy made of ballistics gel, to simply fall down where he stood rather than be drawn into the train’s wake, and also violently pushed around an empty stroller tethered onto the platform alongside. Despite the lack of suction, the MythBusters agreed that the turbulence was powerful enough in its own right to make standing that close to the train as it passes very dangerous.

[ctlikon0712]

I had never heard of the theory of trains suckin one in. So to try and learn more... albiet via the internet where anything can be touted as truth I did some searches and found some interesting stories.
On a website about the mythbusters episode 66, I found these accounts...
http://mythbustersresults.com/episode66
As a young child (10-12) I stood very close to the tracks and hung on to the pole of the crossing arms. I felt the pull of the train and had to hold on for all I was worth. Never tried that again! I don’t believe they proved it a myth!

I don’t know how Adam and Jamie could reproduce the exact set of circumstances, but an acquaintance of mine and his colleague were sucked into a passing high-speed train whilst bird watching in a railway cutting somewhere, I believe, in eastern Europe. My acquaintance was severely injured and spent many months in hospital. His colleague was killed.

There was an incident in Flagstaff AZ where a brother and sister named Sult were pulled towards a passing freight train and the girl received MAJOR head trauma from the contact. I believe that it was in about 2000 and was reported in the local newspaper.

Try telling that to my finace’s friend. He lost his 9 year old boy from a train. They thought it was cool to sit next to the train tracks when it past by and the child got sucked under the tracks and died. The family got devastated broke up and he hold regreats for just sitting there or taking the time to have his arm around his son instead of sitting next to him. Things he thinks about what he could of done different and wishes never happened.
And on another science web page I found this ..... I don't know what to believe but it is interesting none the less.
Can a moving train "suck you in"?
yes, it can if it is moving at high speed, never stand close to a TGV which has been tested at 574 kmph, it can suck from a distance of may be more than 1 m. As per bernoulli's theorem, aerodynamics cause this as higher velocity of air in contact with train creates a low pressure region around the train and this can be enough to pull in the weight of a human body.
It is a similar phenomenon of drag due to differential pressure as happens in an aircraft lift. The velocity is too high on the upper side of wing and too low on lower side which causes a lift. similarly the velocity of air adjacent to the train shall cause lower pressure compared to atmospheric pressure.

[dr.j]

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Tom, what is the motor bike?

[springerpete]

The pilot or cowcatcher on some of the last steam locomotives built in the US were streamlined for both protection and air flow reasons. You'll note on 261 the front coupler is hidden behind a "door" and that the air hoses for the brake system connections are also not visible. On the pilot deck you can also see a shroud covering a unit on each side as the RR tried to cut down on air resistance where they could. The lesson with the motorcycle being pulled over is a good example of the forces involved when one of these units goes by at speed.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by dr.j

Tom, what is the motor bike?

A 1939 B.F. Goodrich bike (built by Schwinn) with a 1939 Lauson 1.1 H.P. motor. It's homebuilt and similar to the Whizzer, but weaker.

[Rowdy]

844 or 3985 should be rolling through town in the next couple of weeks. Hoping to make it to North Platte to get close up pic's this year instead of pic's as it passes through town doing 50 mph plus. I am hoping it is 3985 tis year, but I am not sure it is operational again yet. Last time it came through in 2007 it develpoed problems just outside of town and the rest of its return journey to Cheyene was tedious for the RR as one of the drove rods was badly damaged (ie. worn out). Rod

[whirnot]

Thanks for the above posts, we are planning on trying a photo shoot as the 844 crosses the plains headed for Cheyenne.

Rowdy, According to their website it is supposed to be the 844 going through there..

[Pete]

"never stand close to a TGV which has been tested at 574 kmph, "

If you are stupid enough to get over the security fence, past the security cameras and the special agents, you deserve to be deleted from the gene pool by a TGV.

The majority of mainline track in the US is class 4 track with a speed limit of 80 mph. Some class 5, 6,7 and 8 track is in the NE corridor. There is no class 9 track in commercial service at the present time in the US.

[Rowdy]

Thanks, I have not had the time to check the site. Dissapointed its not 3985. 844 is neat to see once in awhile, but I am a bigger fan of the Challangers as it is really neat to see the articulation work hard on the curves and all of the fast moving drive wheel parts when moving at a good rate of speed. 844 is likely cheaper to run and maintain as there simply is not as much to work with. Rod

[Pete]

"As per bernoulli's theorem, aerodynamics cause this as higher velocity of air in contact with train creates a low pressure region around the train and this can be enough to pull in the weight of a human body."

Bernoulli's theorem applies mostly to non-compressible fluid dynamics up to around mach .3 (approx 225 mph)
Laminar airflow would be a better analogy.
However, there is not going to be much "lift" (negative pressure)
created from a flat sided train car. Turbulence, yes. Vacuum, no.

[ctlikon0712]

Interesting Pete, thanks for taking the time to reply. Upon looking it up I saw that much of Bernoulli's theorem applied more to Hydro studies.

[Tom Wesenberg]

I've been to the railroad museum in Duluth, Minnesota and the National Railroad Museum in Green Bay, Wisconsin. Both museums were well worth the drive and I made the special drive to Green Bay just so I could see the BIG BOY. About 7 years ago I drove to St. Paul to see the Challenger when it came to town. For those not familure with these engines, the BIG BOY is generally considered the world's largest steam locomotive, and the Challenger is currently the world's largest operating steam locomotive. I only saw the Challenger when it was parked, but some day I'd like to see it at speed.

[fordcoupe]

Wonderful photos as a kid i grew up near the D&H rail yard i remember two people that were killed by trains crossing the rails takeing short cuts true the yard coal was king in PA when i was a kid and the D&H was the way to ship it all over the country yes special coupe frank i do belong to the steamtown A's

[Richard/Ca]

ctlikon0712 That reminds me of a joke about the two young boys standing to close to tracks. Also the colored picture in the middle of the above photo is what I use for my screen saver. Richard/Ca 34 yeas of railroading.

[Pete]

Speaking of screen savers etc., here is some of the equipment I used for track inspection at various RR's.
The speeder had a model A engine in it.
The Bronco2 was mine and I used it for joy riding. I had a company hyrail for work besides the speeder.

[Special Coupe Frank]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

I've been to the railroad museum in Duluth, Minnesota and the National Railroad Museum in Green Bay, Wisconsin. Both museums were well worth the drive and I made the special drive to Green Bay just so I could see the BIG BOY. About 7 years ago I drove to St. Paul to see the Challenger when it came to town. For those not familure with these engines, the BIG BOY is generally considered the world's largest steam locomotive, and the Challenger is currently the world's largest operating steam locomotive. I only saw the Challenger when it was parked, but some day I'd like to see it at speed.

Tom,

I don't think there's any debate that the "Big-Boy" ( 4-8-8-4 ) was the largest steam locomotive ever produced... although the Erie's Triplexes might be a contender...

We have a Big-Boy here in Scranton, at Steamtown, although it's a bit out of place, as they never ran East of the Rockies...

I don't know how many Big Boys survive, and if any of them are "Stored-serviceable", or even "restorable"... there are no plans to restore Steamtown unit to operable condition, for two main reasons: the restoration expense, and the operating expense.

Heck, it's taken ST over 10 years to get Baldwin 0-6-0 switcher #26 through a simple 5-year overhaul... , and the two Canadian steamers, 3254 Mikado and 2317 Pacific are running out of time...


I would love to see a Big-Boy or Challenger at work...

Too bad I was born too late to witness any of the big Mallets that used to run on the B&O and C&O on the coal-drags out of WV...

"Steam is Supreme!"

[Bob C]

According to this video big boy 4014 may be restored by UP.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50sXRl9M9AQ

Bob