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Old 02-17-2020, 04:45 PM   #1
jrvariel48
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Default So I have a little problem...

When I got my engine back from the builder, I realized I forgot to tell him to drill 5 extra holes for the blower intake into the block!!
Is this something I can do myself? I'm pretty handy I just want to make sure I don't mess this up! The motor is an 8BA and is assemble except for the intake.
I know drilling and tapping cast iron is not that difficult, but I'm open to suggestions.
Thanks, Joe
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Old 02-17-2020, 04:49 PM   #2
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Maybe he did you a favor. The engine should last a lot longer
without the blower. G.M.
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Old 02-17-2020, 05:15 PM   #3
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

If it were me, I would bolt the blower intake on, mark where the holes go with a transfer punch, borrow or rent one of those drills with a magnetic base (essentially a portable drill press the size of a half inch drill motor) to make sure you are perfectly plumb and drill them and tap them. I don't know how deep they need to be, you need to investigate this carefully.
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Old 02-17-2020, 05:21 PM   #4
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Itīs not that itīs to difficult to do it...but if you have an engine with warranty i would talk to the builder before doing anything.
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Old 02-17-2020, 08:25 PM   #5
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

I thought about drilling holes in mine even though it’s a good running engine for the extra holes I need for the intake. It seems the best way to do this would be to do it with the engine mounted on the stand upside down so that no metal fragments get inside the engine. And yes a mag drill would be the perfect answer.
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Old 02-17-2020, 09:06 PM   #6
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

If you borrow or rent the mag base drill check for excessive wear in the ways. If there is any slop the bit may wander.
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Old 02-17-2020, 09:27 PM   #7
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

I think you screwed yourself. Read post #2 & #4 . If you take the engine back to the builder, he will happily void the warranty on the build and drill it for you.
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Old 02-18-2020, 04:18 AM   #8
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by G.M. View Post
Maybe he did you a favor. The engine should last a lot longer
without the blower. G.M.
This motor was specifically built to handle the added pressures of a blower!
No worries there.
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Old 02-18-2020, 04:20 AM   #9
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by deuce_roadster View Post
If it were me, I would bolt the blower intake on, mark where the holes go with a transfer punch, borrow or rent one of those drills with a magnetic base (essentially a portable drill press the size of a half inch drill motor) to make sure you are perfectly plumb and drill them and tap them. I don't know how deep they need to be, you need to investigate this carefully.
I'm thinking this is the best way also
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Old 02-18-2020, 04:29 AM   #10
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

You could use an older, fully populated, cast iron manifold as a guide. You could use a piece of tubing to guide the tapping drill and the manifold itself to guide the tap. Carefully measure the depth of the existing holes and make sure you do not go deeper than that.

If you do all the drilling and tapping with the manifold in place, no chips will go in the engine.

If you use the other methods make sure you tape off any possible openings that chips could enter by.

Mart.
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:24 AM   #11
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Sounds like more good advice from Mart.

jr, I really like that side view of your 5w coupe....Avatar pic! That's exactly how I ran my first FH powered coupe way back in the day, and very similar look of a coupe I just pulled out of a garage...see pics below if they attach....

Won't download pics right now, may need to resize....will try again later....

What a royar pita it is to load pictures here at times

Finally gotter' done.......
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20200115_161411261.jpg (86.7 KB, 48 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20200115_161337500.jpg (98.0 KB, 46 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20200115_162557716-2.jpg (83.7 KB, 45 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20200115_163434610-3.jpg (90.6 KB, 47 views)
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File Type: jpg IMG_20200115_163330217-4.jpg (87.0 KB, 48 views)
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Last edited by JM 35 Sedan; 02-19-2020 at 11:47 AM.
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Old 02-18-2020, 10:04 AM   #12
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

What I don't know is how deep can you go before you hit water?

Has anybody drilled an 8BA block to match the earlier 32-48 bolt holes - I have not. Do the castings have the necessary "boss" material around these bolt locations, or are you really drilling into thinner material that may not be thick enough for your planned tapping operations?

Once or if you hit water, then all the filing are going into the water jackets . . . just causing more rust/crap to sit in the bottom of them. If it was mine (and I hit water), then I would put short studs in these holes with good thread sealer on them.

If the casting does not have boss material, or is not thick enough to support a decent thread depth (and associated torque), then there may not be any value in doing this.
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Old 02-18-2020, 12:30 PM   #13
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

This may seem a bit anal and long but, I think it's worth reading.

I may not be fully understanding the problem but, wouldn't it be best to mark the location of the holes with a transfer punch, remove the intake and line the inside of the "valley" with paper or rags or a plastic bag laid flat. Then cover that same cloth or a plastic bag with masking tape (sticky side up) and place a bunch of those of those little round super duper high strength magnets on top of the tape and under the drilling location so catch the chips.

Also, if possible, mganetize the HSS pilot drill,intermediate size drills and tap drill AND tap ADD add a dab of wheel bearing grease to each to help catch chips. When hand drilling cast iron I always go one drill below the drill shown on the tap drill chart to help compensate for minor drill movement while drilling. Practice a couple of times on a scrap piece of cast iron if you have any. Cast iron drills quite accurately if you have a pilot hole.

When all done, I would VERY carefully roll up the rags, plastic bag and tape used in the "valley" to capture all the chips and remove it. Then I would go back with a flashlight and a mirror and another very strong magnet glued to a non magnetic stick and meticulously cover every bit of surface area, including under the bottom edge of the drilled holes to make sure no chips or potential chips from the newly tapped holes remain.

QUESTIONS: Do you think the fellow who built you engine would be as careful as the above procedure. Does he have a better procedure? Is he willing to take all the time to patiently do this as he know this will VOID warranty, anyway.

I always worry when such an important mission is taken on by someone else, unless they have a better method. Assume you are searching for land mines that will blow up you new engine. I am sure you will be successful.

Last edited by 19Fordy; 02-18-2020 at 12:36 PM.
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Old 02-18-2020, 12:55 PM   #14
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

I tend to agree with "Mart" about installing a fully populated stock manifold and using that as a guide. If it can keep the engine vacuum in, it surely can keep the metal chips out. Just seal up the openings on it. Just think of all the crap that has fallen on engines in service over the last 100 years. Just be careful and it should be easy and clean.
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Old 02-18-2020, 01:47 PM   #15
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ford38v8 View Post
I think you screwed yourself. Read post #2 & #4 . If you take the engine back to the builder, he will happily void the warranty on the build and drill it for you.
Hi Alan, that won't happen, at least not here, and it shouldn't happen anywhere else either!!


Hi Joe, what you want to do is fairly simple, 3/8" drill motor, 5/16" drill bit, and a 3/8-16 tap set. (starter, plug, and bottoming).

The key to getting it right is drilling/tapping as straight as possible, there's a bunch of ways to get this right, just takes some ingenuity!

There's a few shots below, one where we use the head machine here, the others, some of our in-house tooling we fabricated, simple for us, a bit harder for the at-home guys? Consists of asst'd bushings, a drill guide and a tap guide. These guides can be had most anywhere!

(Joe) I will contact you later!

Thanks, Gary in N.Y.

P.S. If you approach this correctly there isn't a chance of a single chip getting anywhere it doesn't belong. You start by using "duct" tape to close of the lifter valley, tape the block front to rear, leaving the intake bolt holes exposed! Second, using the same tape, you tape the 4 pair of intake ports, again, leaving the bolt holes exposed! This takes care of chips!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Flathead Ford Drill-Tap 5 Int Bolts.jpg (84.1 KB, 58 views)
File Type: jpg Hole Drilling-Tapping Tools.JPG (81.4 KB, 60 views)
File Type: jpg Assorted Drilling-Tapping Guides Hole Repairs.jpg (47.2 KB, 60 views)

Last edited by GOSFAST; 02-18-2020 at 01:49 PM. Reason: C
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Old 02-18-2020, 02:12 PM   #16
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrvariel48 View Post
When I got my engine back from the builder, I realized I forgot to tell him to drill 5 extra holes for the blower intake into the block!!
Is this something I can do myself? I'm pretty handy I just want to make sure I don't mess this up! The motor is an 8BA and is assemble except for the intake.
I know drilling and tapping cast iron is not that difficult, but I'm open to suggestions.
Thanks, Joe


Joe sadly the builder should have had a clue on what to do since this is a common improvement to do when using the 8BA block especially when adding a blower or even any early multi carb intake. Drilling and tapping the holes is easy just take the time to tape up everything so no drilling and taping metal gets inside the valley intake ports or cylinders. The intake is your fixture to guide you on the hole center location you can also use a stock 1948 or earlier stock intake for the location points. Theres no issues with hitting water since no water passages are located in the areas you will be working on. Take your time keep the drill and tap straight and you will be fine.
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Old 02-18-2020, 02:30 PM   #17
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

I drilled and tapped my assembled 8ba to add additional manifold bolts for a S.Co.T., no problem. Like others have said center punch the holes and rent a mag drill. I used a bottom end tap to finish the threads. First I taped everything off and filled in with rags to catch the fillings. Vacuumed the hell out of it to make sure I didn't leave any metal.
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Old 02-19-2020, 05:15 AM   #18
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart View Post
You could use an older, fully populated, cast iron manifold as a guide. You could use a piece of tubing to guide the tapping drill and the manifold itself to guide the tap. Carefully measure the depth of the existing holes and make sure you do not go deeper than that.

If you do all the drilling and tapping with the manifold in place, no chips will go in the engine.

If you use the other methods make sure you tape off any possible openings that chips could enter by.

Mart.
My thoughts exactly Mart!
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Old 02-19-2020, 05:16 AM   #19
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JM 35 Sedan View Post
Sounds like more good advice from Mart.

jr, I really like that side view of your 5w coupe....Avatar pic! That's exactly how I ran my first FH powered coupe way back in the day, and very similar look of a coupe I just pulled out of a garage...see pics below if they attach....

Won't download pics right now, may need to resize....will try again later....
Thanks JM! Looking forward to your pictures!!
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Old 02-19-2020, 05:18 AM   #20
jrvariel48
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Default Re: So I have a little problem...

Quote:
Originally Posted by GOSFAST View Post
Hi Alan, that won't happen, at least not here, and it shouldn't happen anywhere else either!!


Hi Joe, what you want to do is fairly simple, 3/8" drill motor, 5/16" drill bit, and a 3/8-16 tap set. (starter, plug, and bottoming).

The key to getting it right is drilling/tapping as straight as possible, there's a bunch of ways to get this right, just takes some ingenuity!

There's a few shots below, one where we use the head machine here, the others, some of our in-house tooling we fabricated, simple for us, a bit harder for the at-home guys? Consists of asst'd bushings, a drill guide and a tap guide. These guides can be had most anywhere!

(Joe) I will contact you later!

Thanks, Gary in N.Y.

P.S. If you approach this correctly there isn't a chance of a single chip getting anywhere it doesn't belong. You start by using "duct" tape to close of the lifter valley, tape the block front to rear, leaving the intake bolt holes exposed! Second, using the same tape, you tape the 4 pair of intake ports, again, leaving the bolt holes exposed! This takes care of chips!
Thanks Gary! Seems simple enough. I'm concerned with the straightness of the hole mostly.
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