Flathead engine to crossmember rod support

[PGBuick]

My 36 has a set of rods, threaded on the front, with a special eye fitting on the rear. These go from the bell housing area to the top of frame near the center X. One on the driver's side, one on the pass side. Are these required pieces and what is their function? Wondering if I need them with the 59A-B and T5 trans. Thanks. Pat

[Kurt in NJ]

they anchor the rear to the frame, and prevent the engine from moving when pushing on the clutch ( prevent chatter)

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by PGBuick

My 36 has a set of rods, threaded on the front, with a special eye fitting on the rear. These go from the bell housing area to the top of frame near the center X. One on the driver's side, one on the pass side. Are these required pieces and what is their function? Wondering if I need them with the 59A-B and T5 trans. Thanks. Pat

Pat.... Here are the rods you speak of on Jim Pullen's (19FORDY) black 1940 coupe.




As a stock '36 or '40 Ford accelerates (or applies the brakes), that coupling where the torque tube attaches to the transmission case actually pushes (or pulls) on the transmission to move the car down the road, via the torque tube. Since the engine is mounted on relatively soft rubber mounts, if these rods were not in place, the engine/trans assembly would be able to move fore and aft if these two rods did not tie it solidly to the frame X-member.

Since you are going to run the T5 transmission with your 59A-B, I'll assume you are going to use an open drive shaft rather than adapting to the torque tube. If that's your plan, you WILL NOT need to run the two "steady rods".

Now, if you have somehow managed to adapt your T5 to the torque tube like Heard & I have on his '35 pick-up truck (see BELOW), you WOULD NEED the two steady rods in place to control engine/trans movement fore & aft. Hope this helps you.

Coop

[Chris L]

Is the slip in an open drive setup what makes the steady rods not needed?

[Zeke3]

Originally Posted by Chris L

Is the slip in an open drive setup what makes the steady rods not needed?

Yes.

[69a]

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Originally Posted by Chris L

Is the slip in an open drive setup what makes the steady rods not needed?

No.
An open tail shaft does not use the drive shat to push the car down the road! Read post #3. All the information is there.

[Angledrive]

One yes, one no. Very confusing

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by Angledrive

One yes, one no. Very confusing

Yup, a little confusing! Let's try this again. In MOST open drive(shaft) vehicles, the rear end is mounted on two parallel rear springs. The rear springs are mounted essentially on, or under each of the two frame rails. The springs become the unit that transfers the driving force to the chassis, moving the car forward or in reverse. The rear end itself is mounted on the parallel springs such that the rear end does NO PUSHING on the engine/transmission, thus.... NO RODS necessary to steady the engine/trans. Howzat? Izat a little mo-better?

Coop

.

[Pete]

To simplify things even more, there is a large lug on the bottom of the T5 case. If you connect this lug by a link with rod ends to the frame or cross member, you don't need the stock chatter rods.

[Chris L]

Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN

Yup, a little confusing! Let's try this again. In MOST open drive(shaft) vehicles, the rear end is mounted on two parallel rear springs. The rear springs are mounted essentially on, or under each of the two frame rails. The springs become the unit that transfers the driving force to the chassis, moving the car forward or in reverse. The rear end itself is mounted on the parallel springs such that the rear end does NO PUSHING on the engine/transmission, thus.... NO RODS necessary to steady the engine/trans. Howzat? Izat a little mo-better?

Coop

.

That is helpful - thanks

[deuce_roadster]

Ford did away with them when they went to open drivelines.

[rotorwrench]

Actually, they obsoleted the engine radius rods just after the war when they designed a new mount set up. The rear mount set up was better at taking the push and pull of the torque tube drive system but Ford should have kept the radius rods since even the new style mounts would eventually wear out. Kits were made to add either a single rod back in or duel rods like Ford used before the change depending on what company made the kit.

[PGBuick]

Thank you all for the info. Coop, I looked into doing the torque tube T5 but for me it was much more doable to go open driveline. I even looked at a jeep transmission at one point in the process. I am finding it interesting to learn about Ford's use of their various component designs, as they differ so much from the later cars that I am so well versed in. The early car suspension designs make a lot more sense when one considers the evolution from wagons to horseless wagons, but it's harder to imagine the why of early designs when looking back through 80 years of changes, and when considering the cost of machine work on sand castings - Henry must have had a highly specialized, high volume machine shop to do all that.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by PGBuick

The early car suspension designs make a lot more sense when one considers the evolution from wagons to horseless wagons, but it's harder to imagine the why of early designs when looking back through 80 years of changes, and when considering the cost of machine work on sand castings - Henry must have had a highly specialized, high volume machine shop to do all that.

I think that Henry likely had a capable machine shop or three in at least one of his 'small' industrial complexes. My God, he even had BIG ore boats running the length of the Great lakes bringing raw ore into any of his harbors.

Coop



The River Rouge Plant

[rotorwrench]

When Ford built the Highland park plant, they had a lot more capability as a auto manufacturer but they were also developing the river Rouge property for tractor and boat manufacturing during WWI. That required dredging a turn around in the inlet so that the Ford ships could come in and the boats could go out. Once the Rouge was set up for full manufacturing of the model A, They were still using parts of the Highland Park plant for their upholstery division and the tractor division was moved there too. The rest of Highland Park was leased to Briggs body for a few years after they had a fire that destroyed one of their plants in Detroit.

The Rouge had the largest machine shop in the world for a while. It also had the airport where the Ford Trimotors were built plus engineering and test facilities. Ford even worked on Locomotives for their railroad while they still owned it.