The Ford Barn

DBF 30 · 02-11-2012, 01:41 AM

I am getting ready to pull the engine from my 30 roadster and have a couple of questions that I did not find clearly answered using the search function.

Question 1. To pull the engine, is it best to use the adapter that screws into the spark plug hole and if yes, do you need to use two or is one ok?... or is it a ok to just bolt a chain from the manifold stud and the water intake bolt on the other side? I don't want to break something pulling on the wrong location. Not sure how tough the Model a block is especially in reference to question #2.

Quesion 2. Is it reasonable to pull the engine and trans as one unit? Les Andrews book does not refer to it. He only refers to splitting at the bell housing. Many have stated that the benefit of using the side mount bracket for the engine stand is that you can build the engine, bell housing and trans. as a single unit. I assume that the plan would then be to install the engine/trans as a single unit. What have you all found to work best?

Also to all that gave advice on enging stands and lifts, thanks for the input. Much to my suprise after some research I found that the Harbor Freight products to be good quality and the price can't be beat. Looked at a lot of brands in the foldable 2ton hoists and they all appeared to be exactly the same except for the color of paint. Same for the foldable 2000 lb. engine stands. Both stand and hoist are currently on sale at Harbor Freight and then using the 20% off coupon brings the price down to a point that can't be beat.

Again thaks for the help.

700rpm · 02-11-2012, 01:47 AM

These are just my personal preferences and work methods, but I have used both the one hole and two hole spark plug lifts. They seem equally suited. And I have always disconnected the engine from the bell housing for removal. It's less weight to horse around, and it's hard enough to deal with the rear motor mounts without trying to get the bell housing and trans out at the same time.

jcheshire31 · 02-11-2012, 02:07 AM

I wouldn't use one eyelet in the spark plug hole to pull the engine out. You take the chance of pulling and distorting the threads in the head. I've never heard of that doing any serious damage but I know it's hard to put my spark plug in #3 hole now. It would just scare me to do it again. Two would be okay. A lot of people do it that way. If for some reason you don't want to do it that way, don't have the eyelets, heads is already off, etc. You can pull it the other way you said with a chain on the manifold and water intake bolts. And yes it's okay to pull the engine out with the transmission.

Lawrie · 02-11-2012, 02:07 AM

I just refitted my 28 eng,
Bolted the trans to it on the bench,
When I went to fit it and feed the rest under the firewall the pedals looked like they would cause a real problem,
So I took them off the shaft, also had the gearbox top off.
This was the easiest ever reinstall of the eng.
This may help .
Lawrie

James Rogers · 02-11-2012, 08:14 AM

I have pulled probably a hundred in every way you suggested. One plug hole, two plug holes, with the tranny, without the tranny, and others. I have even used a lifting ring in the center head bolt hole with the head off complete to the flywheel.

The stand adapter is the best way to go. I use 3 and have had everything from a bare block to a complete engine including the flywheel and tranny and carb and distributor.

George Miller · 02-11-2012, 08:31 AM

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The safest way is from the head bolts. My lift strap is a cable with two flat taps on the end to fa sen the head bolt to. You can also move the center lift point where you hook the hoist to. That way it is easy to get any angle you want on the engine.

2manycars · 02-11-2012, 08:38 AM

For 50 years I used an eye bolt welded to a sparkplug case that I made in high school, but a year ago I got an engine hoist bracket from Bill Stipe that uses two spark plug holes, and has several lift points to balance the unit whether pulling just the engine, or engine and transmission together. I have done it both ways, and each have their advantage. If pulling the whole unit, I take off the pedals, and the transmission tower, and have a plate I made to bolt to the top of the transmission to keep anything from falling inside. If pulling just the engine, I leave the headlamp bar in place, but with the whole unit, I take it off. The part I hate the most is removing the radiator. What were they thinking when they designed the wiring?
I highly recommend the Bill Stipe engine puller.

V4F · 02-11-2012, 08:41 AM

i use a 1 ton come-along (the big aluminum one) & reinforced garage rafters . i also use the eye-lets in my plug holes . ok so far ................. steve

1crosscut · 02-11-2012, 08:55 AM

Don't forget to check Craig's List for the engine hoist and stand. I was able to get good ones pretty dang cheap that way.
When lifting my engine I used two spark plug holes. I know one will do it but I felt much more comfortable using two.
Dave

Tom Wesenberg · 02-11-2012, 09:26 AM

I use both methods to pull engines; either I use 2 spark plug holes, or I use a seat belt, nylon strap, or nylon rope. I loop the rope around the intake and water inlet and find this works well. I like to pull and install the engine seperate from the tranny if the body is on the frame.

Peter J · 02-11-2012, 10:02 AM

I just finished pulling and re-installing engine/trans. Used #4 and #2 sparkplug holes w/ eyebolt adaptors. Had a 3rd. balance point in the aft. bolt of the water inlet.
No problems in or out. One man job. I used a chain fall from the rafters.

columbiA · 02-11-2012, 11:55 PM

Ive always re & re engines myself.I usually just pull engine unless there is trans work as well.I use 1 spark plug eye-bolt & never had a problem. Dont do it this way if you have an aluminum head.I have no problem with HL wiring as I use plug-in connectors behind the rad shell.I like to remove the HL bar then you dont have to lift the engine very high.

blgitn · 02-12-2012, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Rogers

I have pulled probably a hundred in every way you suggested. One plug hole, two plug holes, with the tranny, without the tranny, and others. I have even used a lifting ring in the center head bolt hole with the head off complete to the flywheel.

The stand adapter is the best way to go. I use 3 and have had everything from a bare block to a complete engine including the flywheel and tranny and carb and distributor.

James and all,

I have the engine/trans assembly on the floor of the shop. I have a chassis with no body or fenders I want to put the engine in. If I remove the trans at the bell housing-flywheel housing joint I can install the trans in the chassis, but it'll just hang on the u-joint. How do you support it until the engine is in place?

BTW: I don't have a cherry picker or engine stand handy, just a son and his friends.

R/ Roger.

1931 flamingo · 02-12-2012, 10:41 AM

Put a jack under the trans. In my opinion for you it would be a lot easier to mate the tranny to the engine. You don't have fenders, firewall, body in your way . JMO
Paul in CT

Tom Wesenberg · 02-12-2012, 11:37 AM

I agree, with no body on it's just as well to install them together.

1931 flamingo · 02-12-2012, 02:41 PM

You say you don't have a cherry picker and frame is bare(no running gear. Position the frame on the floor, manhandle the motor/trans "into" the frame. Pick the frame up and attach the mounts. Now you, your son, and friends can pick up either end to roll the fornt/rear end assy's into position. Took my 29 roadster apart this way bacl in'59, then frame and engine into the cellar to clean up, etc.
Paul in CT

James Rogers · 02-12-2012, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blgitn

James and all,

I have the engine/trans assembly on the floor of the shop. I have a chassis with no body or fenders I want to put the engine in. If I remove the trans at the bell housing-flywheel housing joint I can install the trans in the chassis, but it'll just hang on the u-joint. How do you support it until the engine is in place?

BTW: I don't have a cherry picker or engine stand handy, just a son and his friends.

R/ Roger.

A floor jack or even a stack of wooden blocks would do. You could even use a long pipe and a chain and have your son and 3 of his friends to lift the engine. Just position 2 on each side and let them lift while you roll the chassis under the motor. 4 young scrappers should be able to lift 600# motor and tranny for long enough to align the universal and driveshaft. Once this is done just sit the motor down and catch a breath, lift again, then align the front mount.

JTW · 02-12-2012, 03:37 PM

I have always used 2 lifting points and once I borrowed a lifting bar that was adjustable for tilt. This made alignment very easy. If I remember correctly there were 2 eyelets/hooks on the bottom and an acme thread with a handle at one end and a block/threaded nut w/eyelet on top that you attach to your lift. As you turned the handle and moved the threaded block it changed the center of gravity which gave you some tilt. I do not have a picture as this was some years ago, but I thought at the time that it was the easiest install that I had done.

CRguy · 02-12-2012, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DBF 30

Much to my suprise after some research I found that the Harbor Freight products to be good quality and the price can't be beat. Looked at a lot of brands in the foldable 2ton hoists and they all appeared to be exactly the same except for the color of paint. Same for the foldable 2000 lb. engine stands. Both stand and hoist are currently on sale at Harbor Freight and then using the 20% off coupon brings the price down to a point that can't be beat.

Again thaks for the help.

Personally, I wouldn't use any hoist or engine stand from Horror Freight even if it was free. I've read of numerous failures of the Chinese import crap. My safety is worth more than the dollars saved on a cheap hoist.

Mel

DBF 30 · 02-13-2012, 12:18 AM

Hi CRguy, I started out with the exact same opinion. However after getting numerous members stating that they had good experiences I started looking a lot closer. Do a google image search on 2 ton foldable engine hoist and 2000 lb foldable engine stands,then look at all the various brands that show up. First thing you will notice is that they all are virtually identical in construction, just different paint and pricing. They all look to have come from the same factory. Next I was given a link to a hot rod magazine article where they did testing on various brands of hoist and stands. They tested with weights way beyound the max ratings. The Harbor Freight brands worked just as well as all the other brands and none had catastropic failures.

After assembling my hoist and stand from Harbor Freight I can say that I am pleased with the construction and quality.

Keep in mind that I am using a 4000 lb rated engine hoist and a 2000 lb rated engine stand to move around a 600 lb engine. I feel comfortable with that margin.

Not trying to tell anybody what to do or making a sales pitch for any equipment. Just explaining how I arrived at my decisions on what equipment to buy. Others may feel differently.

Thanks for the input.

02-11-2012, 01:41 AM	#1
DBF 30 Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Posts: 38	Pulling engine questions I am getting ready to pull the engine from my 30 roadster and have a couple of questions that I did not find clearly answered using the search function. Question 1. To pull the engine, is it best to use the adapter that screws into the spark plug hole and if yes, do you need to use two or is one ok?... or is it a ok to just bolt a chain from the manifold stud and the water intake bolt on the other side? I don't want to break something pulling on the wrong location. Not sure how tough the Model a block is especially in reference to question #2. Quesion 2. Is it reasonable to pull the engine and trans as one unit? Les Andrews book does not refer to it. He only refers to splitting at the bell housing. Many have stated that the benefit of using the side mount bracket for the engine stand is that you can build the engine, bell housing and trans. as a single unit. I assume that the plan would then be to install the engine/trans as a single unit. What have you all found to work best? Also to all that gave advice on enging stands and lifts, thanks for the input. Much to my suprise after some research I found that the Harbor Freight products to be good quality and the price can't be beat. Looked at a lot of brands in the foldable 2ton hoists and they all appeared to be exactly the same except for the color of paint. Same for the foldable 2000 lb. engine stands. Both stand and hoist are currently on sale at Harbor Freight and then using the 20% off coupon brings the price down to a point that can't be beat. Again thaks for the help.

02-11-2012, 08:14 AM	#5
James Rogers Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Asheville,NC Posts: 3,104	Re: Pulling engine questions I have pulled probably a hundred in every way you suggested. One plug hole, two plug holes, with the tranny, without the tranny, and others. I have even used a lifting ring in the center head bolt hole with the head off complete to the flywheel. The stand adapter is the best way to go. I use 3 and have had everything from a bare block to a complete engine including the flywheel and tranny and carb and distributor.

02-11-2012, 08:31 AM	#6
George Miller Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NC Posts: 2,975	Re: Pulling engine questions Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) The safest way is from the head bolts. My lift strap is a cable with two flat taps on the end to fa sen the head bolt to. You can also move the center lift point where you hook the hoist to. That way it is easy to get any angle you want on the engine.

02-11-2012, 08:38 AM	#7
2manycars Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern CT Posts: 2,732	Re: Pulling engine questions For 50 years I used an eye bolt welded to a sparkplug case that I made in high school, but a year ago I got an engine hoist bracket from Bill Stipe that uses two spark plug holes, and has several lift points to balance the unit whether pulling just the engine, or engine and transmission together. I have done it both ways, and each have their advantage. If pulling the whole unit, I take off the pedals, and the transmission tower, and have a plate I made to bolt to the top of the transmission to keep anything from falling inside. If pulling just the engine, I leave the headlamp bar in place, but with the whole unit, I take it off. The part I hate the most is removing the radiator. What were they thinking when they designed the wiring? I highly recommend the Bill Stipe engine puller.

02-11-2012, 08:41 AM	#8
V4F Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: ca. Posts: 2,522	Re: Pulling engine questions i use a 1 ton come-along (the big aluminum one) & reinforced garage rafters . i also use the eye-lets in my plug holes . ok so far ................. steve __________________ V4f

02-11-2012, 01:47 AM	#2
700rpm Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 5,906	Re: Pulling engine questions These are just my personal preferences and work methods, but I have used both the one hole and two hole spark plug lifts. They seem equally suited. And I have always disconnected the engine from the bell housing for removal. It's less weight to horse around, and it's hard enough to deal with the rear motor mounts without trying to get the bell housing and trans out at the same time. __________________ Ray Horton, Portland, OR As you go through life, keep your eye on the donut, not the hole.

02-11-2012, 02:07 AM	#3
jcheshire31 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 109	Re: Pulling engine questions I wouldn't use one eyelet in the spark plug hole to pull the engine out. You take the chance of pulling and distorting the threads in the head. I've never heard of that doing any serious damage but I know it's hard to put my spark plug in #3 hole now. It would just scare me to do it again. Two would be okay. A lot of people do it that way. If for some reason you don't want to do it that way, don't have the eyelets, heads is already off, etc. You can pull it the other way you said with a chain on the manifold and water intake bolts. And yes it's okay to pull the engine out with the transmission.

02-11-2012, 02:07 AM	#4
Lawrie Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Qld, Australia Posts: 4,221	Re: Pulling engine questions I just refitted my 28 eng, Bolted the trans to it on the bench, When I went to fit it and feed the rest under the firewall the pedals looked like they would cause a real problem, So I took them off the shaft, also had the gearbox top off. This was the easiest ever reinstall of the eng. This may help . Lawrie

02-11-2012, 08:55 AM	#9
1crosscut Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Lincoln, Nebraska Posts: 1,910	Re: Pulling engine questions Don't forget to check Craig's List for the engine hoist and stand. I was able to get good ones pretty dang cheap that way. When lifting my engine I used two spark plug holes. I know one will do it but I felt much more comfortable using two. Dave

02-11-2012, 09:26 AM	#10
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Pulling engine questions I use both methods to pull engines; either I use 2 spark plug holes, or I use a seat belt, nylon strap, or nylon rope. I loop the rope around the intake and water inlet and find this works well. I like to pull and install the engine seperate from the tranny if the body is on the frame.

02-11-2012, 10:02 AM	#11
Peter J Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Olympia, WA Posts: 691	Re: Pulling engine questions I just finished pulling and re-installing engine/trans. Used #4 and #2 sparkplug holes w/ eyebolt adaptors. Had a 3rd. balance point in the aft. bolt of the water inlet. No problems in or out. One man job. I used a chain fall from the rafters.

02-11-2012, 11:55 PM	#12
columbiA Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 1,746	Re: Pulling engine questions Ive always re & re engines myself.I usually just pull engine unless there is trans work as well.I use 1 spark plug eye-bolt & never had a problem. Dont do it this way if you have an aluminum head.I have no problem with HL wiring as I use plug-in connectors behind the rad shell.I like to remove the HL bar then you dont have to lift the engine very high.

02-12-2012, 10:41 AM	#14
1931 flamingo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new britain,ct 06052 Posts: 9,390	Re: Pulling engine questions Put a jack under the trans. In my opinion for you it would be a lot easier to mate the tranny to the engine. You don't have fenders, firewall, body in your way . JMO Paul in CT

02-12-2012, 11:37 AM	#15
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Pulling engine questions I agree, with no body on it's just as well to install them together.

02-12-2012, 02:41 PM	#16
1931 flamingo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new britain,ct 06052 Posts: 9,390	Re: Pulling engine questions You say you don't have a cherry picker and frame is bare(no running gear. Position the frame on the floor, manhandle the motor/trans "into" the frame. Pick the frame up and attach the mounts. Now you, your son, and friends can pick up either end to roll the fornt/rear end assy's into position. Took my 29 roadster apart this way bacl in'59, then frame and engine into the cellar to clean up, etc. Paul in CT

02-12-2012, 03:37 PM	#18
JTW Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Owls Head Posts: 257	Re: Pulling engine questions I have always used 2 lifting points and once I borrowed a lifting bar that was adjustable for tilt. This made alignment very easy. If I remember correctly there were 2 eyelets/hooks on the bottom and an acme thread with a handle at one end and a block/threaded nut w/eyelet on top that you attach to your lift. As you turned the handle and moved the threaded block it changed the center of gravity which gave you some tilt. I do not have a picture as this was some years ago, but I thought at the time that it was the easiest install that I had done. __________________ Driving old Fords since 1947

02-13-2012, 12:18 AM	#20
DBF 30 Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Posts: 38	Re: Pulling engine questions Hi CRguy, I started out with the exact same opinion. However after getting numerous members stating that they had good experiences I started looking a lot closer. Do a google image search on 2 ton foldable engine hoist and 2000 lb foldable engine stands,then look at all the various brands that show up. First thing you will notice is that they all are virtually identical in construction, just different paint and pricing. They all look to have come from the same factory. Next I was given a link to a hot rod magazine article where they did testing on various brands of hoist and stands. They tested with weights way beyound the max ratings. The Harbor Freight brands worked just as well as all the other brands and none had catastropic failures. After assembling my hoist and stand from Harbor Freight I can say that I am pleased with the construction and quality. Keep in mind that I am using a 4000 lb rated engine hoist and a 2000 lb rated engine stand to move around a 600 lb engine. I feel comfortable with that margin. Not trying to tell anybody what to do or making a sales pitch for any equipment. Just explaining how I arrived at my decisions on what equipment to buy. Others may feel differently. Thanks for the input.