The Ford Barn

1oldtimer · 01-30-2016, 03:32 AM

My '47 car finally gave up 1st gear, it was missing at least a tooth and making noises for years. I'm going to replace the trans or fix the old trans but have some questions. First time rebuilding an early trans so please bear with me.

1. I have a '40 car trans, could I use that or is the '47 better.
2. What internal parts (bearing/synchros) and seals are the best to use and from what vendor.
3. Is there any upgrades to do to make it work better or use more modern fluids (running GL4 now).
4. Which clutch disc/TO bearing is best, I've read it's better to get the stock cover rebuilt.

I'm sure there will be more questions when I start. I also ordered the Mac Van Pelt trans book.

I just want it to work good, not have to take it apart again and I have a distrust of repo parts.

Mart · 01-30-2016, 05:04 AM

The 40 and 47 transmissions are the same, except for possibly a difference in the detail design of the synchro slippers and balls etc.

There is no reason the 40 trans could not be used if in good condition, again with one caution point.

Do a tooth count on the gears. If the 40 has a 16/28 gearset and the 47 a 15/29 you might notice a difference when pulling away with the taller 1st gear.

You should be able to mix and match parts from the two to get 'er up and running again, with the point about detail synchro design taken into consideration.

Mac Van Pelts book would be very useful and Mac can help with parts.

Mart.

V8COOPMAN · 01-30-2016, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1oldtimer

My '47 car finally gave up 1st gear, it was missing at least a tooth and making noises for years. I'm going to replace the trans or fix the old trans but have some questions. First time rebuilding an early trans so please bear with me.

1. I have a '40 car trans, could I use that or is the '47 better.
2. What internal parts (bearing/synchros) and seals are the best to use and from what vendor.
3. Is there any upgrades to do to make it work better or use more modern fluids (running GL4 now).
4. Which clutch disc/TO bearing is best, I've read it's better to get the stock cover rebuilt.

I'm sure there will be more questions when I start. I also ordered the Mac Van Pelt trans book.

I just want it to work good, not have to take it apart again and I have a distrust of repo parts.

ONE thing you will need to do to the '40 trans is un-bolt the REAR BEARING RETAINER / Trans Mount and replace it with the similar MOUNT from your 1947 trans, because the frame mounting holes in the two mounts are 2" DIFFERENT.......easy swap! See the differences below.....the '40 mounting holes are 10" apart, where-as the '47 holes are only 8" apart. DD

1oldtimer · 01-30-2016, 06:27 PM

Thanks for the info, I need to get as much info/research as I can to get everything lined up.

john in illinois · 01-31-2016, 09:18 AM

As mentioned Mac Van Pelt sells good quality parts and will also give you good advice on your build.

John

supereal · 01-31-2016, 03:47 PM

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If the case isn't damaged, it is usually better to overhaul the unit. Many parts, such as the cluster, are not interchangable, While you have it out, get the flywheel resurfaced. If there is a bronze bushing in the flywheel center, replace it with a bearing. Order a new mount for the rear of the transmission, as the old one is almost always either grease soaked, or hardened. The grease fitting on the u-joint housing is very difficult to reach, so we put an extension on it while it is apart. We get our parts from C&G.

1oldtimer · 04-17-2016, 01:50 AM

Ok, it's really time to get the parts in order as reverse is out now (just pulling it in and out of the garage to work on other stuff).

Preferences on on clutch, cover and t/o bearing anyone?. Also need to replace pedal bushings.

51504bat · 04-17-2016, 10:00 AM

Being as how you are in South OC C&G in Escondido or The Early Ford Store in San Dimas would be a good source for local parts or Van Pelt's as already mentioned.

Vintage Copper 47 · 07-11-2017, 02:22 PM

I need to rebuild my 47 trans as well... besides the parts from VanPelt... where can I get the early 41 style engine/trans stability rods to keep from having my trans mount & motor mounts from going bad due to flex/road conditions?

Seth Swoboda · 07-11-2017, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vintage Copper 47

I need to rebuild my 47 trans as well... besides the parts from VanPelt... where can I get the early 41 style engine/trans stability rods to keep from having my trans mount & motor mounts from going bad due to flex/road conditions?

Van Pelt will have them too. Or put a want ad here on the barn. They are pretty common so you should have them in no time.

oldskool · 07-11-2017, 02:48 PM

I would highly recommend fort wayne clutch for all your clutch needs

supereal · 07-11-2017, 02:51 PM

The "Green Book" shows 15 different cluster gears. They vary from 26 to 28 teeth on the main gear, and two types of bearings. C&G sells kits for 39-48 models with three gears. The cluster is 28 teeth. If you plan to overhaul the transmission, you may consider this kit.

V8COOPMAN · 07-11-2017, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vintage Copper 47

I need to rebuild my 47 trans as well... besides the parts from VanPelt... where can I get the early 41 style engine/trans stability rods to keep from having my trans mount & motor mounts from going bad due to flex/road conditions?

The pics below depict how the rods mount on a '41. DD

Vintage Copper 47 · 07-11-2017, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN

The pics below depict how the rods mount on a '41. DD

Thanks for that... I will check with VanPelt... Totally simple set-up

Mac VP · 07-12-2017, 04:59 AM

Actually I think I may have a set of 41 rods at the transmission shop. I'll be there today and will check...... Mac

Vintage Copper 47 · 07-12-2017, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mac VP

Actually I think I may have a set of 41 rods at the transmission shop. I'll be there today and will check...... Mac

Thanks,MAC VP.. I will PM you

Mac VP · 07-12-2017, 01:18 PM

We had two sets of the 11A radius rods (anti-chatter rods). I've PM'd Walt but for those wondering, I am posting here as well. The 11A-6044 rods are only listed for use with the 1941 V8 engines. Walt has a G series six cylinder and those did not have a comparable rod listed by Ford.

1oldtimer · 07-13-2017, 12:21 AM

Do the rods help for a '47, to keep the new trans mount from breaking. BTW, I did rebuild the '40 trans, used the '47 retainer and a bunch of parts from VanPelts...plus his trans book. Works great now and 1st gear is quite for the first time since I bought the car.

01-30-2016, 03:32 AM	#1
1oldtimer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South Orange County, Ca. Posts: 685	1947 Car trans My '47 car finally gave up 1st gear, it was missing at least a tooth and making noises for years. I'm going to replace the trans or fix the old trans but have some questions. First time rebuilding an early trans so please bear with me. 1. I have a '40 car trans, could I use that or is the '47 better. 2. What internal parts (bearing/synchros) and seals are the best to use and from what vendor. 3. Is there any upgrades to do to make it work better or use more modern fluids (running GL4 now). 4. Which clutch disc/TO bearing is best, I've read it's better to get the stock cover rebuilt. I'm sure there will be more questions when I start. I also ordered the Mac Van Pelt trans book. I just want it to work good, not have to take it apart again and I have a distrust of repo parts. Last edited by 1oldtimer; 01-30-2016 at 05:12 AM.

01-30-2016, 05:04 AM	#2
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,755	Re: 1947 Car trans The 40 and 47 transmissions are the same, except for possibly a difference in the detail design of the synchro slippers and balls etc. There is no reason the 40 trans could not be used if in good condition, again with one caution point. Do a tooth count on the gears. If the 40 has a 16/28 gearset and the 47 a 15/29 you might notice a difference when pulling away with the taller 1st gear. You should be able to mix and match parts from the two to get 'er up and running again, with the point about detail synchro design taken into consideration. Mac Van Pelts book would be very useful and Mac can help with parts. Mart.

01-30-2016, 06:27 PM	#4
1oldtimer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South Orange County, Ca. Posts: 685	Re: 1947 Car trans Thanks for the info, I need to get as much info/research as I can to get everything lined up.

01-31-2016, 09:18 AM	#5
john in illinois Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Illinois Posts: 2,184	Re: 1947 Car trans As mentioned Mac Van Pelt sells good quality parts and will also give you good advice on your build. John

01-31-2016, 03:47 PM	#6
supereal Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,634	Re: 1947 Car trans Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) If the case isn't damaged, it is usually better to overhaul the unit. Many parts, such as the cluster, are not interchangable, While you have it out, get the flywheel resurfaced. If there is a bronze bushing in the flywheel center, replace it with a bearing. Order a new mount for the rear of the transmission, as the old one is almost always either grease soaked, or hardened. The grease fitting on the u-joint housing is very difficult to reach, so we put an extension on it while it is apart. We get our parts from C&G.

04-17-2016, 01:50 AM	#7
1oldtimer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South Orange County, Ca. Posts: 685	Re: 1947 Car trans Ok, it's really time to get the parts in order as reverse is out now (just pulling it in and out of the garage to work on other stuff). Preferences on on clutch, cover and t/o bearing anyone?. Also need to replace pedal bushings.

04-17-2016, 10:00 AM	#8
51504bat Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: SoCal-Redlands Posts: 3,020	Re: 1947 Car trans Being as how you are in South OC C&G in Escondido or The Early Ford Store in San Dimas would be a good source for local parts or Van Pelt's as already mentioned. __________________ Making the simple complicated for over 30 years.

07-11-2017, 02:22 PM	#9
Vintage Copper 47 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: The sleepy San Fernando Valley Posts: 394	Re: 1947 Car trans I need to rebuild my 47 trans as well... besides the parts from VanPelt... where can I get the early 41 style engine/trans stability rods to keep from having my trans mount & motor mounts from going bad due to flex/road conditions? __________________ WALT "We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm". "Old enough for the experience & too young to know better"

07-11-2017, 02:48 PM	#11
oldskool Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: shirley ny Posts: 992	Re: 1947 Car trans I would highly recommend fort wayne clutch for all your clutch needs

07-11-2017, 02:51 PM	#12
supereal Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,634	Re: 1947 Car trans The "Green Book" shows 15 different cluster gears. They vary from 26 to 28 teeth on the main gear, and two types of bearings. C&G sells kits for 39-48 models with three gears. The cluster is 28 teeth. If you plan to overhaul the transmission, you may consider this kit.

07-12-2017, 04:59 AM	#15
Mac VP Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 1,361	Re: 1947 Car trans Actually I think I may have a set of 41 rods at the transmission shop. I'll be there today and will check...... Mac __________________ VANPELT SALES LLC Cincinnati, Ohio Office: 513-724-9486 www.vanpeltsales.com www.classictransmission.com

07-12-2017, 01:18 PM	#17
Mac VP Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 1,361	Re: 1947 Car trans We had two sets of the 11A radius rods (anti-chatter rods). I've PM'd Walt but for those wondering, I am posting here as well. The 11A-6044 rods are only listed for use with the 1941 V8 engines. Walt has a G series six cylinder and those did not have a comparable rod listed by Ford. __________________ VANPELT SALES LLC Cincinnati, Ohio Office: 513-724-9486 www.vanpeltsales.com www.classictransmission.com

07-13-2017, 12:21 AM	#18
1oldtimer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South Orange County, Ca. Posts: 685	Re: 1947 Car trans Do the rods help for a '47, to keep the new trans mount from breaking. BTW, I did rebuild the '40 trans, used the '47 retainer and a bunch of parts from VanPelts...plus his trans book. Works great now and 1st gear is quite for the first time since I bought the car.