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05-08-2024, 08:08 PM | #1 |
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Hot rod steering box
A friend brought me a Ford F-100 steeringbox today.
My idea has been use the std box but even if I'm more focus on look or older ideas maybe if one stretch into the early 50's or before 55 both the F-100 box and hair pins might be something. Read its bigger than the F-1, but there is also the Hudsons. One get ’new’ ideas and I has seen Dick Wades 3W 32. Cool car, has Okie axle, hairpins and a Ford F-1 box. The F-1 is 48-52 and the F-100 53-56 ( correct ) So whats the benefit use the F-1 instead of the F-100 in a 32 frame with FH. I seen the input comes in from above on the F-100 ( as std 32 ) but the F-100 it comes in under. I plan use the std angle vs dash. How to get the 32 splines and use the 32 arm ? |
05-08-2024, 08:29 PM | #2 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
F1 steering box has the same spline as the 32, so you can use the 32 arm.
Phil |
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05-08-2024, 09:10 PM | #3 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Quote:
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The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
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05-09-2024, 12:30 AM | #4 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Using the F1 will change the angle where it meets the 32 column drop so that you will have to figure out. New Hudson style steerings are being made by Neal in CA. He is on here as well as the Hamb. Fits perfectly and alignment is perfect. My buddy in Scotland just bought one and had it installed.Another solution is a 1980's Land Rover steering but not period correct. Krylon32 on here has one by Neal in his 32.
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05-09-2024, 03:08 AM | #5 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Just check so far.
I still might go std 32. But it depends on style or how I chose some parts. Think the F-1 are more common for hotrods they but get another angle. I think I dont want a new case just reseach how to get a 32 arm on it ( for now. One here in Sweden said this is the best after a Hudson. Whats benefit of the Hudson. Price is low and fresh on this one. |
05-09-2024, 05:38 AM | #6 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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05-09-2024, 08:18 AM | #7 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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05-09-2024, 11:27 AM | #8 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Whats benefit of the Hudson.
Hank, the benefit of a Hudson steering box in a '32 - '34 chassis is a roller sector, 17:1 ratio and the orientation of the worm gear and sector is the same as a stock '32 steering box. Tom |
05-09-2024, 01:34 PM | #9 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Put one of Neal"s 37 Hudson boxes in my deuce pickup years ago and it drove great and steered easy. Worth the money.
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05-09-2024, 02:07 PM | #10 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
1932 original ratio is 13:1.
Early '33s also had 13:1 but were then changed to 15:1 for the balance of the '33s and '34s. The 15:1 worm and sector pair fit perfectly in the '32 boxes. The Hudson boxes have an 18:1 ratio as do the wonderful boxes that NealCA sells.
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05-09-2024, 05:35 PM | #11 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Yes this box has been in a A-Ford in La before.
I has a new set 34 worm, but this box F-100 is that 17;1? -If I builed a new parts old shool hotrod I should call Neal direct. All this old fuzz parts is a insane killer but its also fun.mi’m on the road, cant change it. I saw one installed a 32 spline in F-100 on internet but not much info. |
05-10-2024, 08:42 AM | #12 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
We have 5 of Neals F1 boxes in 32 fords. They make a tremendous difference in how these cars steer.
The F1 style box will take a 32 Pitman arm. It mounts the worm shaft under the sector, so it changes the angle of the steering column. The shaft winds up 1 inch lower from the original mounting point on the dash. This actually brings the steering wheel 1 inch closer to the driver's lap. I think it's more comfortable than a stock location. The F1 box is definitely the way to go. If you get one from Neal, the flange will be modified to mount like the original 32 box using the stock holes in the 32 frame and you can order it with the provision to work the original light switch as well.
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05-10-2024, 10:37 AM | #13 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Neals F-1 is it old box or new cast ?
In this case I forward my look several times from prewar roadster to late 40 ’s 3w to get the 5W body and into 50’s. If I go hairpins I can go F-100 but the F-1 sounds better if it drops collum 1” lower. ( I will use std collum. I has all my Wings at Abbott’s in Portland ( so gauge is set ) and idea was to use my Hollywood panel. Its cool but some days it feel to wide ( vs change the 32 dash ) but if I like use the F-100 ( new flenge ) I can rotate it to where it will fit ( vs dash ) I dont like the gauges in a row. So its about the dash issue to here. Great look is the Aburn dash ( with panel ) I ask sine my buddy has this box over ( research for me. Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-10-2024 at 11:13 PM. |
05-10-2024, 11:13 AM | #14 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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05-10-2024, 11:20 AM | #15 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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05-10-2024, 12:28 PM | #16 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
What NealCA offers now is his own casting based loosely on a Hudson box.
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05-10-2024, 03:01 PM | #17 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Hank if it was me I would simply use the F-1 box {I use them in all 4 of my Deuces} its much smaller than the F-100 and as others have posted the stock 32 arm fits perfectly.
An additional bonus of the F-1 box is the lower column location which is required if some how in the future you were to decide going to an ARDUN conversion which was designed in 1947. Ronnieroadster
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05-10-2024, 11:13 PM | #18 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Ok make sense.
Thanks on all info. |
05-11-2024, 12:09 AM | #19 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Here's a picture of a F-100 box we put in a '32 that may help give you an idea of where it would live.
Last edited by rich b; 05-11-2024 at 12:10 AM. Reason: Extra |
05-11-2024, 12:41 AM | #20 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
05-11-2024, 07:06 AM | #21 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
The F-1 has some good things, smaller, production 48-52, 32 steerarm can be used and same bolt pattern.
I guess performance is the same also as the F-100. Feel like a uppgrade in a hotrod for early 50’s than use the std box. So now comes steering wheel angle in a lower position. How do people do, so they normally like that and use the std lenghts up to steering wheel ( or short it ) That means I need to put a adapter under my collum ( as angle is lower ) or it might be all Ok as if I use the Hollywood panel the dash needs to be wider. What is the gap ca under dash ( std ) if use std collum and the F-1 box. |
05-11-2024, 07:44 AM | #22 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
How much move the steering shaft down in a F-1 from the F-100 ( or std 32 box )
Look like 3” (?) I measured my 32 dash and its 5.3/4 and the Hollywood panel is 5.3/4 so its 2”. So dash with that set-up means a ca 2” wider dash. Here is a example in a roadster in Sweden. Do not know steering box in that car, look like a 34 collum (?) Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-11-2024 at 07:51 AM. |
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05-11-2024, 08:02 AM | #23 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
The size of the spacer needed to mount the F1 box in a stock 32 is exactly 1'' square.
I use a piece of 1-inch square aluminum about 6 inches long. I drill 2 oversize holes to match the column drop holes. Then two 1.5 inch 5/16 24 Allen cap screws through the original dash mounting holes, through the aluminum into the column drop. The Allens make it easy to install and tighten. I taper the ends of the spacer to blend it to the bottom of the dash. I put a high polish on the spacer itself, I don't like the look painted. The last three were machined turned to match the original gauge panel. I like that look too.
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05-11-2024, 09:50 AM | #24 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Quote:
__________________
The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
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05-13-2024, 07:00 AM | #25 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Found this Hudson 39.
Maybe a bolt on in a 32 ? Is the 39 bigger than the ex 37 box ? What design do Neal use ? One guy build many hotrods in Sweden told me use the F100 as Way better angle on steering wheel, he was not found on the F1. In a chopped coupe one sit low so better with a flatter angle, he mean, and then move it forward for better clearance on exhaust header. Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-13-2024 at 09:39 AM. |
05-13-2024, 08:21 AM | #26 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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05-13-2024, 09:15 AM | #27 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Quote:
__________________
The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
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05-13-2024, 09:41 AM | #28 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
On the headers, once set it up its better get more clearance even if header will be custom made.
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05-13-2024, 09:58 AM | #29 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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Wise words from Tim! Use a modified F1 or one of Neal's new boxes. Space is tight so avoid the F100. Glenn
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05-13-2024, 10:26 AM | #30 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I saw this picture and it was from Neal and said in thread 37 ’only’ but not why, maybe 39 is bigger, or ?
I really not into the F-100 so the F-1 feels good and I will find clearance, but now this Hudson came out so went to see it. Expensive but wanted to trade. |
05-13-2024, 11:52 AM | #31 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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05-13-2024, 12:44 PM | #32 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I read several ( good info.
If ex Neal read this, or other knowledge person ; is the 39 wrong turning ? This box if one turns right sector goes anti clickwise = correct Ford style. -So I think seller told me wrong, its a 37 box, here is steering wheel. |
05-13-2024, 12:55 PM | #33 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
For a Left Hand Drive, LHD; turning the steering wheel CW rotates the Pitman arm CCW which pulls the drag link forward, turning the wheels to the right.
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05-13-2024, 01:12 PM | #34 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Hank, original '37 Hudson steering boxes have the figures "A 04
30585" cast into the housing. That may help you confirm whether the box you have is a '37 or not. Tom |
05-13-2024, 01:24 PM | #35 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
__________________
The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
05-13-2024, 05:21 PM | #36 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Tom, good info thanks.
Get back tomorrow as I ask seller to check. One thing confuse me as at Hamb I saw a picture of a 37 but it look indentical to this as was told be a 39. But with the number it will tell. I guess the 37 is smaller. |
05-14-2024, 07:41 AM | #37 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I notice the box I sas yesterday is a 39 and one see they had a extra cast rib to sector axle.
Why, the 39 had a extra 2” longer sector than the 37. -As Neal has said, 37 ’only’ so now i know why plus the 39 is bigger. But i think I found a 37 box ( 800 USD ) but its in a bad shape. But good on Hudson is a tyny box and roller, steering wheel shaft comes in from above and as Neal showed in his pick-up ( big wheel ) the angle is to step use a F1 ( but I has a 15.5” Bell ) and my window is not tilted but I will sit low ( 3” chop 5W ) So the Hudson 37 might be the way to go but ( $ ) Se pictire of a 37 Hudson in Sweden ( = no extra rib to sector ) |
05-14-2024, 07:45 AM | #38 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
F1 and Hudson 37 on steering wheel angle.
One get the same results on std 32 or the F-100 box as the Hudson ( 37-39 ) Pictures from Neals pick-up. |
05-14-2024, 08:28 AM | #39 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I tested my F-100 än turn steering wheel to right ( CW ) but the sector axle must go anti CW as arm go back and ’drag’ the spindle = so car goes right ( just a note )
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05-14-2024, 08:32 AM | #40 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I found this from Neal 2011/Hamb.
He show a std 32 box and a 37 Hudson to right. Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-14-2024 at 08:44 AM. |
05-14-2024, 08:40 AM | #41 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
The 39 has the rib on sector axle ( se picture and the 39 I saw yesterday ) so that might been a 39 box or ?
I now saw both 37 and 39 boxes so sector is way longer on the 39 vs the 37. Neal on picture say the Hudson has a longer sector ( talk 37 ) but the 39 has a longer. The 37 has no rib to sector axle ( the one I saw anyway ) Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-14-2024 at 08:45 AM. |
05-14-2024, 11:21 AM | #42 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Quote:
__________________
The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
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05-14-2024, 11:38 AM | #43 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Hank, I have an idea regarding modifying a steering box for your hotrod. Give me a call when you get a chance.
Tom |
05-14-2024, 06:11 PM | #44 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Back in about 2021 I put up a tutorial of how to fit a 1935 15 to one Worm and sector into a 32 box ,the best one is a Ford NOS type ,Contact me if more information is required , Ted
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05-15-2024, 07:25 AM | #45 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I has a 32 box and a new made 15 to one Worm ( old made repro / not China ?
My plans is get it in, but new plans is use the roller type ex Hudson. I has try mail Neal or ask here on 37 vs the 39 ( indication ) but has so far never get the real answer to equation. |
05-16-2024, 07:37 PM | #46 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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I still wait on the box ( 39 ? ) in Sweden on partnumber and lenghts from end of box to end of sector axle. This 37 ( ? ) so far seems to be around 9.5”. This might be good informarion for people as me get a Hudson box. As told its the 37 but there are also the 39, and so far I think its tiny bigger and sector axle is longer. Why that is not good for a 32 frame I can’t tell right now. It would be very nice if Neal would explain some here on how and why. On picture as what its told be a 37, but I saw 2 ( 37 ) in Sweden and both had not the rib on sector ( so its kind of confusing. I do will find out one way or another why the 39 is not as ’good’ or why 37 is one year ’only’. Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-16-2024 at 08:31 PM. |
05-16-2024, 07:50 PM | #47 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I'm confused as to why your doing all of this when the F-1 steering box is the easiest, fastest and least expensive way to put a very good steering box on a Deuce frame.
Did I miss something about why you would be interested in making this such a hard thing to accomplish? I ask this question since I know for certain using the F-1 steering boxes on my Deuces has been easy - affordable and always work perfectly as well. Ronnieroadster
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05-16-2024, 08:37 PM | #48 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Ron, you shore is right ! :- )
But the F-100 is made 54 and its bigger. I shore could use it and a buddy has a F-1 I heard yesterday ( cheap and working ) but Hudson is cool and classic, so why not - plus information is never hard carry. So I has locate up one 37. I will be at LARS so I might find something there but I guess I go for this one. |
05-17-2024, 03:10 PM | #49 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
The Ford F-1 steering box came out in 1948 this detail adds to the cool factor for a period correct early Hot Rod build.
Ronnieroadster
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05-17-2024, 03:43 PM | #50 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I don't understand why you are against an F-1 box.
Regarding the Hudson 1939 with a longer shaft than the '37 another ?? NealinCA posts on the HAMB, not here. 3" chop is too much. Any dip in the road or hill you won't be able to see out regardless of how low your seat is. You'll regret it.
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05-17-2024, 07:06 PM | #51 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Neal showed the angle from a F-1 to the Hudson.
But that can be fixed ( rotate a F-1 ) but Hudson is hotrod cool. I can go either way, I has all options, std 32, F-100, F-1, Hudson. Today a called a Hudson shop ( pro in USA ) and he said 37 is the same as 39 so I still ask why Neal said one year ’only’ (?) The Swede find Hudson 39 ? ( is + 9” lenghts on sector from end of box to end of sector thread ) as the so call 1937. ( that’s why I reasach it ) ( My coupe was chopped on the 50’s in USA as a dragcar and is to low, well its up the ones eye. Me I like it at 3”. 2” is nice but std is not look ok with no fenders 4-6 is cool to but the more than 4” is just race. ( my opinion ) Propotianal is say 3” is nice. Look at the aword winning coupe Steday fast builed at 3”, look at the radical chop Hilton build ( 7” ) for a 5W customer so one is to judge. Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-17-2024 at 07:12 PM. |
05-20-2024, 07:37 AM | #52 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
My research goes on..
Today I visit again the guy who has several Hudson boxes. We said the one we think is the 39 is the same as 37 but the 37 has part number A 04 and the 39 has B or D 05. Both are same width 9” to end of sector axle, both has a rib cast on sector box case. But he has another box that are only 8” and no cast rib. Box house is the same but side mount flange is slightly different. Then that box has the same diameter that the steering wheel tube goes on as a 32 Ford but the 37-39 box is bigger there on the diameter. -So one can wonder what box that is ( year ) He think it’s a 37 ( or always thought so ) On picture you see the end of sector don’t look like a 39, this one ends at flange. Last edited by 3W Hank; 05-20-2024 at 12:02 PM. |
05-20-2024, 11:15 AM | #53 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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05-20-2024, 11:59 AM | #54 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I think I has the answer.
This box that has the smaller steering wheel tube same as Ford 32 is a smaller car ( shorter wheelbase Hudson same yeaar 37-39 and that explain the shorter distance from 9 to 8 inch and house is the same ( and internal gears ) but castings is not really the same but as I hear it fit better a 32 Ford frame. Now, need to find one. |
05-24-2024, 12:25 PM | #55 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I will go for a Hudson but to learn I’ll borrowed a F-1 box but its Big, bigger than the F-100, so is really a F-1, se partnumber aswell on it ( 33748(0?)14.
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05-24-2024, 02:25 PM | #56 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Quote:
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The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
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06-01-2024, 01:46 PM | #57 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
That ( F-1 ) box must been to a 3/4 ton truck.
Today at a Swapmeet I bought a box that was told came from fire truck 1/2 ton. This is a F-1. Did feel great at very cheap to. I might try get a Hudson otherwise I use this one. |
06-01-2024, 03:55 PM | #58 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
__________________
The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
06-03-2024, 08:44 AM | #59 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
The box is cleaned off, all is nice so just gaskets needed.
Its a ’crack’ but it might be even from factory ? At the swapmeet I bought this 41 Lincoln drums, also a bargin. |
06-03-2024, 08:51 AM | #60 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
The gaskets are also shims, so read up on proper assembly and clearancing.
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06-03-2024, 09:50 AM | #61 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Close up
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06-03-2024, 10:00 AM | #62 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Maybe it is just me; but that doesn't look very good. Did you try adjusting the box before taking it apart to see how worn the gears were?
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06-03-2024, 06:16 PM | #63 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I did not payed much so I can get new parts inside.
I has not struggle with old steering box before, but its just this ’dent’ and the rest look fine and it did turn around fine ( I never try to test adjust it ) as it was cut out of frame part so I had several hours just get nut lose and steering arm off and it was oil and dirt all over so it had a fast swim in the bath. When I look at the crack/dent it look as it could been in material before grinding. As its hardneeded so is it normal that gears crack like this ? I dont think more parts come off, but again steering box gears has not been on my table before. I can get gasket/schims and test how it feels before I bought parts. This coupe I’m into is huge in all corners try get all part and try to set the style. Last edited by 3W Hank; 06-04-2024 at 05:39 PM. |
06-05-2024, 04:53 PM | #64 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
When one use a F-1 box I hear its not that great in a chopped coupe as a steering will get a ’bus wheel feeling’.
I will use a Auburn 32 dash but use upper part 32 so dash will be lower, so what is benefit just lower steering shaft, vs a std or Hudson or a F-100 box. In this 3W coupe with a F-1 I think the angle look Ok ( or ? ) ( One can rotate and drill new holes in frame ) |
06-05-2024, 06:13 PM | #65 | |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Quote:
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The only thing nice about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others.... "Silver rings, your butt! Them's washers!" "We shot our way out of that town for a dollar's worth of steel holes!" - from 'The Wild Bunch' - 1969 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NReUd2_0u0 |
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06-06-2024, 03:30 PM | #66 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
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06-07-2024, 07:46 AM | #67 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
Stock interior dimensions for your comparison
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Archives of historical but relevant older articles: ------------- Hover mouse over the links below and click! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~--------------- Rumble Seat's Notes Techno-Source for the 1932 thru 1953 Flathead Ford |
06-09-2024, 12:08 PM | #68 |
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Re: Hot rod steering box
I has to see when body is back and sofa is there, how it feels.
I will use the std package tray behind seats. I dont need sit perfect but arms to much above will feel strange. I don't know how much angle will change from std/F-100/Hudson vs the F-1 n reality. One thing, I do like the deal use Ford and from 48, fits me perfect plus I like the look on that box. |
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