The Ford Barn

dmsfrr · 10-23-2018, 10:39 AM

Here's a link to a whole bunch of Y-block info you may eventually need...

http://www.ford-y-block.com/technical.htm

KULTULZ · 10-23-2018, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

Here's a link to a whole bunch of Y-block info you may eventually need...

http://www.ford-y-block.com/technical.htm

Good Source.

Specifically-

Quote:

Timing gear installation. Some people try to align the timing marks on the gears toward each other as is common on newer engines. This is bound to happen more often now as the replacement timing chains no longer have the pins marked for correct alignment with the gears. The marks on the Y-Block timing gears aim toward the oil filter side with 12 pins between them.

Yotehunter66 · 10-26-2018, 07:24 AM

Cleaning up the balancer. There is some pitting but not a noticeable groove where the seal rides. I like how they designed the seal so it cannot be put in from the outside. Have to pull the whole cover off to do that. I installed a new chain and gear set and it was definitely tighter than the old one.

KULTULZ · 10-26-2018, 01:41 PM

You might want to lightly sand the snout (fine paper/crocus cloth using brake fluid as a lubricant) until fairly smooth.

When installing the cover, leave loose and install balancer so as to center the snout within the seal. Then position cover to center seal over snout and torque to specs. Use white grease or engine oil to lubricate seal /snout contact surface.

There was a SPECIAL SERVICE TOOL for this years ago ...

rotorwrench · 10-28-2018, 11:02 AM

The flatheads just had timing gears so the Y-block cam chain drive set up was kind of a new thing for FoMoCo. At the time, it must have made some sense to the engineers but over time with various new engine designs and new set ups, it no longer stood up to modern design standards. It looks confusing by todays standards but the relatively long distance between gears was the likely reason for the way they decided set it up.

Yotehunter66 · 03-30-2019, 04:57 PM

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Been a while since I updated this. Just got the carb rebuilt by Sal. Very nice work. Car will actually idle now. I still need to get the timing right. I noticed water leaking between the carb and the front right corner of the intake manifold. Looks like just condensation as the motor gets hot. Should I be concerned about a vacuum leak there. It's a new base gasket.

scicala · 03-30-2019, 06:00 PM

Your car will be very low on power and performance until the distributor is dialed in. With this style distributor, there is no spark advance beyond the base timing without
vacuum to both diaphragms (and good diaphragms).

Sal

Yotehunter66 · 03-30-2019, 07:35 PM

So you don't think the water drip is a problem?

dmsfrr · 03-30-2019, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yotehunter66

...I noticed water leaking between the carb and the front right corner of the intake manifold....
So you don't think the water drip is a problem?

It depends on where the water leak is coming from. Water may be traveling up one of the intake manifold bolts. ???

Yotehunter66 · 03-31-2019, 06:39 AM

Not antifreeze. Clearly a drip of condensation from between the carb and the intake. Was worried about a possible vacuum leak there.

Yotehunter66 · 03-31-2019, 10:55 AM

I know there were two style s of valve adjusters but when I opened it up this is what I found. Although it looks like the adjustment screw is missing from the exhaust on #4 it doesn't appear to have any threads inside it. It's also a different size. Also a little disappointed in my local parts stores. The y both sold me the wrong size cover gaskets.

rotorwrench · 03-31-2019, 01:01 PM

The adjuster is likely home brewed. The parts store catalogs might both have the same part number flaw. No one experienced in Y-blocks behind the counters now days.

scicala · 03-31-2019, 03:03 PM

That adjuster is correct. In '57 they eliminated the one with the lock nut (two piece) and replaced it with one screw using interference threads instead of a lock nut. In '57 they also increased the rocker arm ratio to 1.54:1. Previous to '57 it was 1.44:1 I believe. Maybe 1.41 ? Looks like it's had some parts changed along the line.

Sal

dmsfrr · 03-31-2019, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scicala

That adjuster is correct. In '57 they eliminated the one with the lock nut (two piece) and replaced it with one screw using interference threads instead of a lock nut. In '57 they also increase the rocker arm ration to 1.54:1. Previous to '57 it was 1.44:1 I believe. Maybe 1.41 ? Looks like it's had some parts changed along the line.
Sal

Yes, there are two styles of locking screws and three different part numbers for rocker arms.
I suspect the 1.54 rocker arms may(?) have been used only in the 'performance' engines, T-Bird, etc.
They can often be mixed up by someone not watching the numbers.

EAN-6564 rocker is 1954-1955 1.43:1 ratio
5751066 is 1958 - 1964 1.43:1 ratio
1.54:1 HIGH RATIO ROCKERS ARE ECG-6564

(from this link)
http://www.ford-y-block.com/rockerarm.htm

paul2748 · 03-31-2019, 07:37 PM

The 1.54 rockers were used in all 57 engines, regardless of HP. They had the two kinds of adjusters, the changeover made mid year in 57.

rotorwrench · 04-01-2019, 12:57 PM

I wonder if they just replaced the adjuster and not the rocker arm. A person would have to confirm the part numbers unless the thread was different. Sort of a mix & match.

Yotehunter66 · 04-01-2019, 02:00 PM

The numbers are on the side of the rockers. I'll have to check it out. Just got done adjusting them. Waiting on the gaskets. Hopefully they're the right ones this time.

paul2748 · 04-01-2019, 08:25 PM

The rockers had two different suffixes denoting the ones with the nut and the ones with the interference thread -A for lock nut, B for interference.

Additionally, the rockers were slightly different in the adjuster end. The one that used the interference thread was slightly shorter

The actual thread size and count were the same in both rockers. It was the adjuster that had the interference thread. You can use either adjuster in any rocker, but when using an interference adjuster in a lock nut rocker it is close to bottoming out when the factory clearance was set. I ran a interference adjuster in a lock nut rocker it it was very close but it worked.

rotorwrench · 04-02-2019, 01:22 PM

I noticed that the one in the photo looks pretty deep in the threaded bore. That's what made me think it was a home brewed repair.

Yotehunter66 · 04-03-2019, 07:39 PM

Got everything adjusted and the valve covers back. Suddenly I have no spark. Got six volts going through the primary coil windings. I haven't checked the secondary winding resistance yet. New coil wire so I think it's good. I hooked a jumper wire from the coil wire to a spare spark plug and grounded the plug and got no spark. What's the best way to test the electronic pick up?

10-23-2018, 10:39 AM	#61
dmsfrr Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Abq, NM Posts: 3,607	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild Here's a link to a whole bunch of Y-block info you may eventually need... http://www.ford-y-block.com/technical.htm

10-26-2018, 07:24 AM	#63
Yotehunter66 Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Clayton, Michigan Posts: 48	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild Cleaning up the balancer. There is some pitting but not a noticeable groove where the seal rides. I like how they designed the seal so it cannot be put in from the outside. Have to pull the whole cover off to do that. I installed a new chain and gear set and it was definitely tighter than the old one.

10-26-2018, 01:41 PM	#64
KULTULZ Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: IN A 'GALAXIE' FAR FAR AWAY Posts: 6,475	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild You might want to lightly sand the snout (fine paper/crocus cloth using brake fluid as a lubricant) until fairly smooth. When installing the cover, leave loose and install balancer so as to center the snout within the seal. Then position cover to center seal over snout and torque to specs. Use white grease or engine oil to lubricate seal /snout contact surface. There was a SPECIAL SERVICE TOOL for this years ago ... __________________ *** - WHY IS IT ... - ... that everything you buy in the grocery store is either wrapped in or contained in plastic but the government doesn't want you to carry it out in a plastic bag? WONDERING IN W(BY GOD)V ... DIAGNOSED CDO** - (OCD In Correct Alphabetical Order)

10-28-2018, 11:02 AM	#65
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,436	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild The flatheads just had timing gears so the Y-block cam chain drive set up was kind of a new thing for FoMoCo. At the time, it must have made some sense to the engineers but over time with various new engine designs and new set ups, it no longer stood up to modern design standards. It looks confusing by todays standards but the relatively long distance between gears was the likely reason for the way they decided set it up.

03-30-2019, 04:57 PM	#66
Yotehunter66 Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Clayton, Michigan Posts: 48	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Been a while since I updated this. Just got the carb rebuilt by Sal. Very nice work. Car will actually idle now. I still need to get the timing right. I noticed water leaking between the carb and the front right corner of the intake manifold. Looks like just condensation as the motor gets hot. Should I be concerned about a vacuum leak there. It's a new base gasket.

03-30-2019, 06:00 PM	#67
scicala Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Detroit suburb, MI Posts: 3,706	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild Your car will be very low on power and performance until the distributor is dialed in. With this style distributor, there is no spark advance beyond the base timing without vacuum to both diaphragms (and good diaphragms). Sal

03-30-2019, 07:35 PM	#68
Yotehunter66 Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Clayton, Michigan Posts: 48	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild So you don't think the water drip is a problem?

03-31-2019, 06:39 AM	#70
Yotehunter66 Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Clayton, Michigan Posts: 48	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild Not antifreeze. Clearly a drip of condensation from between the carb and the intake. Was worried about a possible vacuum leak there.

03-31-2019, 10:55 AM	#71
Yotehunter66 Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Clayton, Michigan Posts: 48	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild I know there were two style s of valve adjusters but when I opened it up this is what I found. Although it looks like the adjustment screw is missing from the exhaust on #4 it doesn't appear to have any threads inside it. It's also a different size. Also a little disappointed in my local parts stores. The y both sold me the wrong size cover gaskets.

03-31-2019, 01:01 PM	#72
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,436	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild The adjuster is likely home brewed. The parts store catalogs might both have the same part number flaw. No one experienced in Y-blocks behind the counters now days.

03-31-2019, 03:03 PM	#73
scicala Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Detroit suburb, MI Posts: 3,706	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild That adjuster is correct. In '57 they eliminated the one with the lock nut (two piece) and replaced it with one screw using interference threads instead of a lock nut. In '57 they also increased the rocker arm ratio to 1.54:1. Previous to '57 it was 1.44:1 I believe. Maybe 1.41 ? Looks like it's had some parts changed along the line. Sal Last edited by scicala; 03-31-2019 at 05:01 PM.

03-31-2019, 07:37 PM	#75
paul2748 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Midland Park, NJ Posts: 3,982	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild The 1.54 rockers were used in all 57 engines, regardless of HP. They had the two kinds of adjusters, the changeover made mid year in 57. __________________ 48 Ford Conv 56 Tbird 54 Ford Victoria

04-01-2019, 12:57 PM	#76
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,436	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild I wonder if they just replaced the adjuster and not the rocker arm. A person would have to confirm the part numbers unless the thread was different. Sort of a mix & match.

04-01-2019, 02:00 PM	#77
Yotehunter66 Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Clayton, Michigan Posts: 48	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild The numbers are on the side of the rockers. I'll have to check it out. Just got done adjusting them. Waiting on the gaskets. Hopefully they're the right ones this time.

04-01-2019, 08:25 PM	#78
paul2748 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Midland Park, NJ Posts: 3,982	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild The rockers had two different suffixes denoting the ones with the nut and the ones with the interference thread -A for lock nut, B for interference. Additionally, the rockers were slightly different in the adjuster end. The one that used the interference thread was slightly shorter The actual thread size and count were the same in both rockers. It was the adjuster that had the interference thread. You can use either adjuster in any rocker, but when using an interference adjuster in a lock nut rocker it is close to bottoming out when the factory clearance was set. I ran a interference adjuster in a lock nut rocker it it was very close but it worked. __________________ 48 Ford Conv 56 Tbird 54 Ford Victoria

04-02-2019, 01:22 PM	#79
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,436	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild I noticed that the one in the photo looks pretty deep in the threaded bore. That's what made me think it was a home brewed repair.

04-03-2019, 07:39 PM	#80
Yotehunter66 Member Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Clayton, Michigan Posts: 48	Re: 56 T-bird rebuild Got everything adjusted and the valve covers back. Suddenly I have no spark. Got six volts going through the primary coil windings. I haven't checked the secondary winding resistance yet. New coil wire so I think it's good. I hooked a jumper wire from the coil wire to a spare spark plug and grounded the plug and got no spark. What's the best way to test the electronic pick up?