1930 Frame - Front Cross Member - Screw/Bolted-In - Old Repair or What?

[Steve Plucker]

Originally Posted by Joe K

Check the height of the landing pad for the radiator. Are frame details consistent with your build date/frame number?

Two radiator landing pad heights are seen normally on a Model A. 28-29 (until October 29) are level with the rails. 30-31 (after October 29 actually) are recessed about 1/4" below the rails. For a short period between October 29 and December 29 when the new body form came into production, there were "shims" used to make up the difference and allow Ford to put the older body form on the "pre changed" newer design frame.

Yours may be a factory frame modified to use up one form or another of the front cross-members?

I have a "transitional" frame sold to me as a 1929 but the date code puts it late November and has the low pads - so I made the shims.

Or maybe I speculate and your frame rotted out under the radiator and was repaired?

Joe K

In actuallity there are three (3) "heights"...Not two! The first was that the radiator mounting pad was about 1/8 inch below the top surface of the frame itself. Then, about March 1929, the mounting pad became flush with the top of the frame. Then about September/October 1929, the new front cross member appeared where the top of the frame was about a 1/4 inch or so below the top of the frame. This style lasted throughout the Model A era of production.

For more information, please refer to the MARC/MAFCA Restoration Guidelines and Judging Standards OR go to my website and read about it in the frame section.

Pluck

[hudsun2340]

Hi can any one help as to where c h a s s i r ivots can be bought ?

[Steve Plucker]

Originally Posted by hudsun2340

Hi can any one help as to where c h a s s i r ivots can be bought ?

Here you go...

RIVETS
1. www.bigflatsrivet.com Big Flats Rivet Company (New York)
2. www.rjleahy.com R. J. Leahy (California)


Pluck

[PeteVS]

Originally Posted by hudsun2340

Hi can any one help as to where c h a s s i r ivots can be bought ?

McMaster Carr... Here's a link:

http://www.mcmaster.com/#round-head-rivets/=lm6wpb

[28-31]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

28-31: Are we doing a restoration, or building a driver?? If a driver, and depending on how far apart it is I would take some measurements and see if frame is close to square. If OK I would weld the c/member in. JMO Probably been done thousands of times before..

Paul in CT

Well...it's a "driver", but that's kind of a subjective term. My definition of "driver" is often other's definition of show car.

Part of me says don't mess with it, since it likely has been this way for 70+ years. However, the rest of me wants it to be rivited as it came from the factory -- and also riveted for strength.

We'll see what I end up doing, but I welcome all of the additional information and opinions I can get.

[28-31]

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Here's what it looks like from underneith (see attached photo). It's the underside of the passenger's side.

I'm not sure what size bolts were used -- but they definitely look weathered. ...which has me leaning towards replacement...with something.

[28-31]

Here's another frame I have -- this one is a 1931 from a Model A Coupe. It also has the front cross-member bolted in by a previous owner. (see attached photos).

This repair looks like it was done more recently than the first one.

This repair appears to have been done with Grade 5 bolts. I'm most likely selling this frame, so I doubt I will do anything with this one.

My focus is still the first frame discussed in this thread above. Just providing info/photos on this one as another example of what I've seen.

[Tom Wesenberg]

If the car is being left all together then I'd leave it for now.
If the front end is apart so the job is easy, then I'd do the right thing and install rivets.

[Flop]

heres another example of a screwed together and bolted front crossmember!

[PeteVS]

If this is the car that Flop's doing the body for, I'd sure as h--- do it up right and rivet it.

[Fred K-OR]

It would seem like it would be what you wanted to have in your car. You said it was to be a driver and maybe not a show car. You also said it has been that way for 70 + years. So again what do you want? It would seem like 70 + years of service may give you some continued good service.

[28-31]

Originally Posted by PeteVS

If this is the car that Flop's doing the body for, I'd sure as h--- do it up right and rivet it.

It is the same car -- he and I will definitely be exploring all options. He does amazing work.

[Joe K]

Originally Posted by 28-31

This repair looks like it was done more recently than the first one.

This repair appears to have been done with Grade 5 bolts. I'm most likely selling this frame, so I doubt I will do anything with this one.

My focus is still the first frame discussed in this thread above. Just providing info/photos on this one as another example of what I've seen.

This one looking like it cracked at the bend between the two applied sets of bolts. If that the case then the smaller side-bolts did nothing to improve the rigidity.

Joe K

[Chuck Sea/Tac]

My front crossmember is bolted and welded. It ain't movin. Been that way for at least 50 years, I'm guessing more. When it was wrecked (50?) years ago, the shop welded reinforcement braces into the fender braces. I wrecked it a few years ago, and decided to leave it that way, because its part of the history of the car!
By the way, I have a front factory replacement crossmember, (not in the car) with the rivited reinforcing plate on it, as described in the service bulletins.
Chuck