1950 Ford F-47 (F1)

[Overkill-F1]

Originally Posted by kirkf

I'm not sure if the plugs are original or not, but they are a threaded screw in plug. Which is different from what I saw in various books. It might be that the pressed in plugs were replaced at some point, or it may be that's how they were done in Canada.



Kirk

My plugs were the same: 1/8"NPT27 plugs. I got one out ok, but had to drill the other 3.
Attached photo shows the plugs front and back.
...Terry '52 F1 C1BA/8RT
Canadian eh!

[kirkf]

Terry,

Those are identical to what I pulled out.
They were very tough to remove, and I was surprised when I managed to get all four of them without having to resort to drilling them out.
As you can see I used an impact driver to break them free.

Since you have the same ones, I think we can safely say its just what they used on the Canadian motors. The reference books I have show something more like a 'frost plug' that have to be drilled out. The books recommend replacing it with a threaded plug.

I think I would prefer replacements that use an allen head rather than slotted heads like these.

Kirk

[Scott Brownell]

I have many F1, F2 and F3 parts if need be. Tkx Scott Brownell in California

[kirkf]

Thanx Scott! Good to know!
Its going to be a long trek before this truck moves under its own power, and I'm going to need all the help I can get.

Kirk

[kirkf]

So I'm coming to the point where I'm going to need to spec out parts for the motor, and I'm not sure whether I should do it in this thread or start a separate one.

I'll do it here for now, and i'll repost it to a separate one if its required.

I'm going to need to pick the parts and where to source them from. As I'm in Canada its easier for me if a lot of parts come from the same source, as it can be a pain dealing with the border, and also some vendors don't like shipping to Canada.
In which case I have to ship them to an address at the border and drive down to get them.

Obviously I'll be waiting for word from the machine shop on actual sizes required.

The rebuild I intend to do is as follows (And this is open to change depending on the advice I get)

1. It will be for the most part a stock rebuild, using quality new parts. I want this motor to run well for a very long time.
2. The parts I will be reusing are the Block, Heads, Crank, Rods, Intake, Timing Gears, Distributor and Carb. Everything else will be replaced.
3. The block, heads, crank, and rods will be going into a machine shop to be hot tanked (or whatever equivalent they use these days) and checked for cracks, issues, etc.
4. I intend to have the bore and any journals moved up to the next standard oversize as required. I don't intend to try and increase the displacement by increasing bore or changing crank / rods.

Some of the initial questions to be answered are:

1. What should I do about valve seats? Replace them with hardened seats? Replace exhaust only, or intake and exhaust?
2. What pistons should I use? 3 or 4 ring? What brand? What vendor? and with those what are the best rings?
3. I'm replacing the complete valve assemblies, valve,spring,guides, clips, etc etc. What is the best source for ordering a complete matched set.
4. I'm intending on using adjustable valve lifters, what specific brand and vendor is recommended for these? Should I have the machine shop drill holes to hold these for adjustment?
5. I'm intending on replacing the cam. It could be with either stock or a mild aftermarket brand. What would everyone recommend?
6. How common is it to paint the inside of the block with rustoleum or glyptol? Is this a good or bad idea?
7. Should I replace the crank bolts with new ones? ARP? Should I brace the center journal? What is the preferred source for the brace?
8. Should I replace head bolts with new ones? ARP or Factory?
9. I'll need to replace the oil pump, again what are the expert opinions on brand and vendor?
10. I would prefer to replace rope seals where possible with modern seals. What are the options?


All opinions welcome. I've got several books, but I know there is a ton of highly experienced builders on here, and Id like to tap into all that knowledge!

And again, nothing above is written in stone, if you have an opinion I'm on the wrong path for any of it, please feel free to throw in your .02

Thanx,

Kirk

[kirkf]

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lol, no takers on my big list of questions. guess I better split them into their own thread.

[kirkf]

December Update:

1. The frame is still at the frame shop. Just getting the final touches. They did excellent work welding up the cracks and bending it back to its original shape. It is going in for final sand blasting and being powder coated in semi gloss black this week.

The bill for the frame work is coming in higher than I hoped. So as usual I'm over budget.

I also ordered up everything for the suspension and brakes. Literally everything that's a wear part is getting replaced. And that's coming in a lot higher than I hoped as well. Which is of course par for the course with this hobby.

2. The block and internals are in at the machine shop, with the first step being to check for cracks, magna-flux. etc. Haven't heard anything from them yet.


Kirk

[RalphG]

I missed this thread from the start and just found it. Interesting to see another Canadian Ford. Reminds me of the M68 I hauled home over a year ago. Big difference is that you are making progress. Mine is still sitting soaking the seized up flathead hoping it will eventually turn over. My outdoor workshop is not too conducive to progress this time of year.
I'll be watching this thread now to follow your progress.

[5851a]

Looks like a great project. Love those trucks, I have plenty of miles in them.

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showth...t=engine+stand
Thought you might find this interesting. Best of luck.

[corvette8n]

Originally Posted by kirkf

So I'm coming to the point where I'm going to need to spec out parts for the motor, and I'm not sure whether I should do it in this thread or start a separate one.

I'll do it here for now, and i'll repost it to a separate one if its required.

I'm going to need to pick the parts and where to source them from. As I'm in Canada its easier for me if a lot of parts come from the same source, as it can be a pain dealing with the border, and also some vendors don't like shipping to Canada.
In which case I have to ship them to an address at the border and drive down to get them.

Obviously I'll be waiting for word from the machine shop on actual sizes required.

The rebuild I intend to do is as follows (And this is open to change depending on the advice I get)

1. It will be for the most part a stock rebuild, using quality new parts. I want this motor to run well for a very long time.
2. The parts I will be reusing are the Block, Heads, Crank, Rods, Intake, Timing Gears, Distributor and Carb. Everything else will be replaced.
3. The block, heads, crank, and rods will be going into a machine shop to be hot tanked (or whatever equivalent they use these days) and checked for cracks, issues, etc.
4. I intend to have the bore and any journals moved up to the next standard oversize as required. I don't intend to try and increase the displacement by increasing bore or changing crank / rods.

My opinions on some of your questions.

Some of the initial questions to be answered are:

1. What should I do about valve seats? Replace them with hardened seats? Replace exhaust only, or intake and exhaust?
2. What pistons should I use? 3 or 4 ring? What brand? What vendor? and with those what are the best rings?
3 ring metric pack rings seem to be popular.

3. I'm replacing the complete valve assemblies, valve,spring,guides, clips, etc etc. What is the best source for ordering a complete matched set.
4. I'm intending on using adjustable valve lifters, what specific brand and vendor is recommended for these? Should I have the machine shop drill holes to hold these for adjustment?
5. I'm intending on replacing the cam. It could be with either stock or a mild aftermarket brand. What would everyone recommend?
A lot of people like the L100 cam.
6. How common is it to paint the inside of the block with rustoleum or glyptol? Is this a good or bad idea?
Don't know how common, but on a regularly used motor I think it is unnecessary.
7. Should I replace the crank bolts with new ones? ARP? Should I brace the center journal? What is the preferred source for the brace?
8. Should I replace head bolts with new ones? ARP or Factory?
9. I'll need to replace the oil pump, again what are the expert opinions on brand and vendor?
I know there are issues with high pressure pumps, an nos pump should be ok.

10. I would prefer to replace rope seals where possible with modern seals. What are the options?


All opinions welcome. I've got several books, but I know there is a ton of highly experienced builders on here, and Id like to tap into all that knowledge!

And again, nothing above is written in stone, if you have an opinion I'm on the wrong path for any of it, please feel free to throw in your .02

Thanx,

Kirk

Sorry I couldn't answer all of your questions, a year or so down the road I plan on rebuilding my 41 motor, so I'll have my own questions by then.
Have fun.

[Newc]

I all; I did an M-47 '48 and found that the rear fender bolts from the bed were a different thread than US! 1/4" 28 fine or sae. Engine and trans were Ford gray. All kinds of tiny differences from US trks, but a fun project. Hardest part... The cowl vent R&R. The dark blue was an excellent color. Newc

[saltracer]

to answer your questions..........contact reds headers and tell them you want to do a stock rebuild. I would stay away from the ARP stuff for this as about all it would do is increase the cost. Just my 2cents. Phil

[36tudordeluxe]

This is what I did in reference to your questions:
1. replaced both intake & exhaust seats
2. 3 ring pistons Egge, Hastings rings
3. C&G Ford Parts in California has everything you need for valve train
4. Adjustable lifters, don't scrimp here, you need good ones that have adjusting screws that
will still in place. Yes, have the lifter bores drilled down low enough in the bores so that a
drift will catch the inside of the lifters.
5. I would use the stock cam.
6. I painted the inside of the lifter valley with Glyptol but probably not necessary with
todays non-detergent oil and frequent changes.
7. Not necessary to brace center main on a stocker.
8. I would use new head bolts, doesn't have to be ARP but whatever you use, seal the ends.
9. Again, C & G or any of the usual vendors can supply the oil pump, you don't need the
high pressure pump as you stated.
10. I use the one piece front seal, but there are guys on this site who get just as good
results with the rope seal when properly installed.
Just my 2 cents, as you said "nothing is in stone."

One thing you're absolutely correct on, is there are some very knowledgeable people on the "Barn."

[kirkf]

The machine shop called, and they say the block checked out fine after it was cleaned and magna fluxed.

Block can be bored to .030
Rods .010 on big and small end.

So now its time to order a pile of parts.


The frame is in for powder coating. Semi Gloss Black.
I ordered up all the frame parts, except for the wheel bearings.
I also picked up a set of original rims for the truck.




Kirk

[kirkf]

Any final advice on parts order for the engine, would be welcome, as I'm going to probably try and get the works on order in the next day or so.

A little more complicated for me, because I'm in Canada, so I'll probably have parts shipped to the border and go pick them up myself.

Kirk

[kirkf]

Frame shop says I can pick up the frame at the end of this week.
I'm having them do the kings pins while they have it all there.

I bought a 1950 mercury motor and transmission off a local facebook ad, so I'm considering changing to the 4" crank. I should have the motor and transmission in the next couple weeks, so its just a matter of having the machine shop check out the crank.

Kirk

[Ross F-1]

Kirk, you might check into having the machine shop buy the parts for you. They typically get a discount, so they can mark them up a little, but with the border situation especially it may avoid some tariffs. It also makes any problems with parts their problem, and they have a bigger stick.

From recent flathead rebuilds, it seems like cast 4-ring Egge pistons are most common, with Hastings c.i. rings. Can't go wrong with Clevite (which I believe are now Mahle) bearings for rods, mains, and cam.

Your engine should have hardened seats on both valves already. If they aren't bad, I would let them be.

[Tienmac]

Kirk, I don't get over to The Barn often. For your Canadian Flathead info Keith Lee of Jitney Auto in Saskatoon is recommended. We have a local builder known as 4TFord (Bill Boomer) on The Barn. If you have any other questions, I may be able to help. We have discussed some of the Canadian Truck differences on the other Ford Truck forum. I just acquired a set of Ford Motor Company of Canada Master Repair books in the original binder to go with my original Parts Catalogues and Sales Information. I you get over to Regina, let me know. I'd be happy to show you my 1951 F-1. Tienmac.

[Campbell Cartel]

Originally Posted by kirkf

I thought I'd start a thread for the 1950 Ford F-47 (Canadian F1) I've recently started working on.

This one sat in a field since the early 1970's, until I procured it in April.

Its original colour was Sheridan Blue, with Tan interior.

Overall its in good condition for a truck that hasn't moved in forty years.

Kirk

I just ended up with one of these. Very interested in what you have learned. I might have to ask some questions as I get going into this.