merc cam price

[ole39]

guess i should have done this 1st, what is a good price for a good 8cm cam? i found one for $150.

[Tim Ayers]

Seems high to me. I would think $50-ish

[KiWinUS]

Tim has it. Used $50 to include shipping.

[ole39]

thanks guys, kinda where i was at.

[tubman]

New or used? After seeing the price of aftermarket and reground cams (which both should have adjustable lifters) these days, I wouldn't be surprised to see NOS cams (especially an 8CM) go for significant money.

Things are very different now than they were even 5 years ago. New Offenhauser heads (if you can even find them), go for $1800.

[Pete]

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Originally Posted by ole39

guess i should have done this 1st, what is a good price for a good 8cm cam? i found one for $150.

$50 for a good core.
$150 for a CHEAP stock regrind.
$200 for a good STOCK regrind.

Any NOS core should be reground at this point. There is NO preservative in existance that could keep it's surfaces good for this long except a full vacuum chamber and think of the cost to have operated a vacuum chamber since 1953.
A lobe surface that appears good to the naked eye will easily be rejected under a microscope.

It is far cheaper to use orginal steel lifters than adjustables. They are far better quality, not to mention they make a far superior finished product.

[Tim Ayers]

Originally Posted by Pete

$50 for a good core.
$150 for a CHEAP stock regrind.
$200 for a good STOCK regrind.

Any NOS core should be reground at this point. There is NO preservative in existance that could keep it's surfaces good for this long except a full vacuum chamber and think of the cost to have operated a vacuum chamber since 1953.
A lobe surface that appears good to the naked eye will easily be rejected under a microscope.

It is far cheaper to use orginal steel lifters than adjustables. They are far better quality, not to mention they make a far superior finished product.

I need to learn how to do it the "stock" way.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by Pete

Any NOS core should be reground at this point.
A lobe surface that appears good to the naked eye will easily be rejected under a microscope.

It is far cheaper to use orginal steel lifters than adjustables. They are far better quality, not to mention they make a far superior finished product.

Now Pete, since YOU brought it up, I'm gonna let you show us just how dumb I really am. Please help me understand how a 70-year-old, NOS cam core is going to be "all messed-up" looking at it under a scope, whereas an ORIGINAL (70-year-old) steel lifter is going to be of better quality than an adjustable? How zat work?

Coop

.

[cjshaker]

Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN

Now Pete, since YOU brought it up, I'm gonna let you show us just how dumb I really am. Please help me understand how a 70-year-old, NOS cam core is going to be "all messed-up" looking at it under a scope, whereas an ORIGINAL (70-year-old) steel lifter is going to be of better quality than an adjustable? How zat work?

Coop

.

And how do you control valve clearance then? When a cam is reground, you're going to lose material. Granted, maybe just a few thousandths, but you are still opening up the clearance. Do you sink the valves (not good)? Do you buy new valves and grind to proper clearance (not cheaper, and labor intensive)?


I'm genuinely asking here, not trying to poke.

[Tim Ayers]

Originally Posted by cjshaker

And how do you control valve clearance then? When a cam is reground, you're going to lose material. Granted, maybe just a few thousandths, but you are still opening up the clearance. Do you sink the valves (not good)? Do you buy new valves and grind to proper clearance (not cheaper, and labor intensive)?


I'm genuinely asking here, not trying to poke.

You weld the stems and grind to length is how I understand it

[Pete]

Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN

Now Pete, since YOU brought it up, I'm gonna let you show us just how dumb I really am. Please help me understand how a 70-year-old, NOS cam core is going to be "all messed-up" looking at it under a scope, whereas an ORIGINAL (70-year-old) steel lifter is going to be of better quality than an adjustable? How zat work?

Coop

.

The marginal cam surface after many years is due to oxidation. While many people get away with using an NOS cam by just washing it off, I have seen enough low mile failures that I would never do it.
Comparing an old NOS cam lobe oxidized surface to a freshly ground one it very obvious the oxidized one is rougher. The mountains and valleys are still about the same height on both but the old ones are more random and rougher.

As to the lifters, the original steel lifters are better for several of reasons.
1 - They are much lighter than cast iron.
2 - They are much stronger than cast iron.
3 - They are faster and easier to install.
4 - NO MANUFACTURER OF ADJUSTABLE LIFTERS HAS YET TO FIGURE OUT
HOW TO 100% ASSURE THE SCREWS WON'T COME LOOSE.

Coop, I have to comment on your statement about "dumb". You just lacked info on the subject. Same as I have very little info on round motors although I love to hear them run. I think you are one of the most knowledgeable people on here.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by Pete

Coop, I have to comment on your statement about "dumb". You just lacked info on the subject. Same as I have very little info on round motors although I love to hear them run. I think you are one of the most knowledgeable people on here.

Ya know Pete, I really appreciate the compliment. It ain't that I'm really all that knowledgeable. I think it's more like maybe I have a little more info on a few more subjects than a lot of folks, and that I maybe pay a little bit of extra attention to most of the details, while overlooking the superfluous BS.

Hey, I LOVE round motors, too! So here's one for you. WHY MUST ALL ROUND MOTORS HAVE AN ODD NUMBER OF CYLINDERS PER ROW?

Coop

.

[Pete]

Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN

Ya know Pete, I really appreciate the compliment. It ain't that I'm really all that knowledgeable. I think it's more like maybe I have a little more info on a few more subjects than a lot of folks, and that I maybe pay a little bit of extra attention to most of the details, while overlooking the superfluous BS.

Hey, I LOVE round motors, too! So here's one for you. WHY MUST ALL ROUND MOTORS HAVE AN ODD NUMBER OF CYLINDERS PER ROW?

Coop

.

Well there ya are ya see, I never thought about that. Without looking it up, I will take a wag at it and say, cylinder offset so it can't get stuck "on center"???

[cjshaker]

Originally Posted by Tim Ayers

You weld the stems and grind to length is how I understand it

There's no way that would be cheaper, as claimed. And I'd have to wonder how well the welded tip would hold up unless it was properly re-heat-treated. I like the idea of using the steel lifter; fewer pieces means fewer related problems, but is this actually the way guys are doing it?

[Tim Ayers]

Originally Posted by cjshaker

There's no way that would be cheaper, as claimed. And I'd have to wonder how well the welded tip would hold up unless it was properly re-heat-treated. I like the idea of using the steel lifter; fewer pieces means fewer related problems, but is this actually the way guys are doing it?

Yes, and I'm hoping Pete or others chime in. If you ever look at an old Sioux or similar valve grinder, most have a fixture to grind down the stems square.

From what I recall Walt Dupont explaining, you add length to the valve stem by welding and set the correct height by grinding.

This is what I understand is done when using a reground performance cam with a smaller base circle due to the regrind. Stock cam may be a different process.

[L-head]

Years ago, I had a flathead cam from an old 59A that I tore down for parts. The cam had what looked like air pockets, bubbles, pores throughout the whole cam. It was that way on the lobes and brg surfaces. I could not believe that it had run for years that way and still looked like it was still usable. Has anybody ever seen anything like that? How could that make it through "quality control"?

[KiWinUS]

Originally Posted by L-head

Years ago, I had a flathead cam from an old 59A that I tore down for parts. The cam had what looked like air pockets, bubbles, pores throughout the whole cam. It was that way on the lobes and brg surfaces. I could not believe that it had run for years that way and still looked like it was still usable. Has anybody ever seen anything like that? How could that make it through "quality control"?

Seen many that way. Hold more oil.

[Kurt in NJ]

Various valve clearance setting fixtures for measuring and using with valve grinder, the grinding machine has a micrometer type adjustment that controls how much is removed from the stem
the one on the top i think came with a B&D machine, it will do T,A,B,60hp, and regular flathead V8, the others won’t do 60hp, one of those sets is Snap On blue point brand

[cjshaker]

Yes, grinding tips is nothing new. It's been done for many, many decades. All the old machines that I've ever seen had that function. But welding them first? Never heard of that, and I have to question it's viability.

[Tim Ayers]

Originally Posted by cjshaker

Yes, grinding tips is nothing new. It's been done for many, many decades. All the old machines that I've ever seen had that function. But welding them first? Never heard of that, and I have to question it's viability.

Like I said, I hope Pete, Ronnie, Kiwi Tony or others chime in to explain.