What would be considered high mileage..?

[bobpo]

After reading the entries concerning Oil Filtered vs. Non-Oil Filtered, I am curious as to what kind of Mileage can you get on a Rebuilt Model A Engine without a Filter..?

I know there are a lot of variables, is there an overall consensus ?

[IrishHills]

I'd say it depends on how often you change the oil.

[Mike V. Florida]

I would think there would be too many variable to be able to pin point only the filtering od oil. As was said it would also depend on the miles between oil changes.

[bobpo]

I only have 1,000 miles on it and have changed the oil 3 times.

[V4F]

new rebuilts should have the oil changed at like 250 miles , then 500 miles thereafter . filtered oil can be used longer , like maybe 1500-2000 miles . i have a filtered motor & change it around those #'s . sooner than later ................ steve

[columbiA]

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I put over 75,000 miles on a 31 Vicky & dont know how many miles were on the engine before I got it,but I looked after the car very well & usually changed the oil every 500 miles,unless I was on a long trip & always drove the car sensibly.--Not over 45 or 60 if in OD.

[Special Coupe Frank]

Short -trip driving ( defined as running the engine at less than full operating temperature for less than 20 minutes ), and running without a thermostat necessitate more frequent oil-changes, if this applies to your driving habits.

Stock Model A's ( no thermostat ) are notoriously cold-blooded, and if you are just poking around the neighborhood ( or idling the car in the driveway), you will build-up condensation and blow-by contaminants in the oil much more quickly than with an engine that gets-up to 160-180 * F quickly and is kept there for 20 minutes or more.

Once you are through the break-in period, if you are running detergent oil, and staying on paved roads, you could probably extend your oil-change interval to 1,000 miles or so... or spring & fall...

My '28 Special Coupe is showing 87,000 miles on the OD (the last 8,000 miles are mine), and while I've head the head off the engine to replace a blown head-gasket when I first got the car, I don't think the engine has had major work. It is still running original Ford script valves and original Ford script pistons, which don't have any marks indicating that they are over-sized, so I don't think the engine has been overhauled ( at least not bored-out)... this summer it pulled 60-65 lbs on a compression test...

I have not had the pan off, so I don't know that bottom-end looks like.

It sounds like a threshing machine and is due for a rebuild, but it is still chugging along, and that's having run most of its working life under who-knows what kind of conditions, on non-detergent, sludgy-old dinosaur squeezins, etc. Previous owner brought it back to life around 2003.

If you are running filterless, using good detergent oil, and change it every 1,000 miles, I should expect that you would get at least 50,000 - 75,000 miles before the motor starts showing signs of age... depending on the quality of the rebuild too.

It also depends on driving habits...

If you can find a copy, "Drive it Forever", by Robert Sikorsky, SAE , is an excellent book on what kills engines and cars, and how to make yours last longer... good basic stuff whether you're caring for a Model A or a modern daily driver.

[Kevin in NJ]

Oil will not be the limiting factor in the amount of miles you get out of an engine.

You can change the oil every 3 weeks and the babbitt will still fail in 3 months if the babbitt was done wrong.

If you fail to keep enough oil in the engine or you go way too long (10,000 miles?) between changes then the oil might be a factor.

We have been victims of many years of advertising by the oil companies that make money with every oil change. Yes, in 1930 you needed to do an oil change every 500 miles. The oil then was poor quality with no additives. The lubrication would break down quickly (the molecules were not stable) and there was nothing to handle dirt and the bad chemical build up. Today they know how to make better oil. The lubrication properties last a long time and additives prevent nasty chemicals from forming.

So the real limiting factor is how much attention to detail was done during the engine build. The guys who build paying attention to details run the cars at 55 to 65 MPH and expect up to 50,000 miles on an engine. I think you will find the oil change habits vary from a few hundred to a few thousand between changes on these engines.

On the other hand, I think we can come up with a list of guys with less than 5000 miles on engines that failed even with 500 mile oil changes.

[Roadster Rich]

My 30 Standard Roadster had 122,000 miles (second time around) when the speedo failed in the late 70's. Only driven about 3,000 since then, but it was my dad and my car through high school and college both. Dad had the car since new. Replaced piston rings only, replaced and relapped valves with adjustable tappits in the 70's. Never had the bottom end apart ever. So I guess I have just been lucky! I would like to get the engine rebuilt and balanced though, it is a rough ride!

[700rpm]

"On the other hand, I think we can come up with a list of guys with less than 5000 miles on engines that failed even with 500 mile oil changes."

Amen to that, Kevin. I had an engine rebuilt about 30 years ago by a fella who had a reputation for doing good rebuilds. I was religious about break-in and oil changes, and I only got about 10,000 miles out of that engine before the center and rear mains went kerflooey. When my new rebuilder took it apart, his diagnosis was "Bad Babbitt."

About five years ago I had a different guy, who also had a great reputation, do an engine for me, and he put a lock washer under the crank nut, which didn't allow the crank nut to tighten completely on the pulley. That caused me all kinds of grief.

It seems like with everything else, you pays your money and you takes your chances. I need another engine rebuilt now (different car), and I wish your shop wasn't 3000 miles away.

[Marco Tahtaras]

This was Jim Boehmke's first Coupe. He keeps records or EVERYTHING he does with his cars. Here is what Jim told me when I asked him:

Purchased 4/1/80 odometer 25,822 (clearly 125,822) Drove it home from the shed it had sat in for 15 years. The engine had been restamped with a non-original number so something had been done in it's past.

At 35,700 the compression was 60 on all 4, Pulled .003 from all mains, sanded all rod caps down & put in .006 in all rods. At 50,122 tightened up rods. At 97,085 pulled more shims from rods. Odometer turned over on 10/5/02. Sold 6/8/07, 18,402 on the odometer. Head never removed from time of purchase. Checked compression only 1 time after purchase.

Ok, I have to add that Jim never drove the Coupe on the highway. However that is still 92,580 miles he put on an engine that was far from "fresh" when he purchased the car. The bottom end was still quite when he sold the car but the "Fumaze" was useful!

[Jim Boehmke]

I never took ole Nellybell over 35mph. I did sell her when I finished my late '31, black on black std coupe. Nice pocket of change on that sale.

[Keith True]

I have a 30 Standard roadster that I bought with about 28000 miles on it.The crank is still standard sized,and good,but the block is .040 over.Very common thing around here.No paved roads,when you drove down the road you were in the center of a cloud of dust.It was like shoveling gravel into the carb as you went down the road.My grandfather sold A's new,he bought a new 30 Phaeton and bragged how he didn't have to overhaul the engine until 33 or 34.That was quite a feat here back then.I have a 1928 automotive trade journal that states the average life expectancy of a vehicle then was 28000 miles.Vehicle life,not engine life.