The Ford Barn

DavidG · 11-03-2014, 02:28 PM

The raised deck was adopted as a cost savings (less grinding) as a running change in August, 1940 according to the engineering release forms on file at the Benson Ford Research Center. The subject block is likely a service part produced in late 1940 or 1941 or thereafter.

oldford2 · 11-03-2014, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jambottle

I have a bare block( crack free) non raised intake with the 5/8 hole in the bottom of the front depression,24 stud, with frost plugs in the pan rail.how can i tell if it is a 38,39,or 40 :.221 cu in. thanks

Hey Chris, That block is what I could use to start another build. I will stop by at your secret stash barn and pick it up when I am in Pictou.

LOL John

G32 · 11-03-2014, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jambottle

I have a bare block( crack free) non raised intake with the 5/8 hole in the bottom of the front depression,24 stud, with frost plugs in the pan rail.how can i tell if it is a 38,39,or 40 :.221 cu in. thanks

Jambottle; 38 US 81a has short crankshaft just the same as Canuck's 37-38 ---id by noteing the flatfaced crankpulley (first picture above) --
39-40 have long crank and pulley hub extends 1 1/4" out from pulley sheave. Check to see if rod bearings are
flanged (1938) or flat-- 39 and up.
Canadian blocks should be cast coded
C81A on deck --front of head but check bell
housing too.
Not sure if US block features can be used
to ID year 41-42 on Canadian blocks , 81s
or 99s .
There are variations for military, export,
etc. on Canadian blocks.
Look and post what you find
Gene Tulsa

jambottle · 11-03-2014, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G32

Jambottle; 38 US 81a has short crankshaft just the same as Canuck's 37-38 ---id by noteing the flatfaced crankpulley (first picture above) --
39-40 have long crank and pulley hub extends 1 1/4" out from pulley sheave. Check to see if rod bearings are
flanged (1938) or flat-- 39 and up.
Canadian blocks should be cast coded
C81A on deck --front of head but check bell
housing too.
Not sure if US block features can be used
to ID year 41-42 on Canadian blocks , 81s
or 99s .
There are variations for military, export,
etc. on Canadian blocks.
Look and post what you find
Gene Tulsa

WILL A 46-48 CRANK DROP RIGHT IN THIS BLOCK? tHANKS

flatjack9 · 11-03-2014, 06:27 PM

37 - 38 had smaller main journals on the crank. The 59 crank could be ground to the smaller specs.

Bruce Lancaster · 11-03-2014, 06:41 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Ron posted on that...regrinding a 4" merc to fit. A cut down 59 woudn't do anything for you.
The Canadians produced only 24 stud engines during WWII, I think, both '39 type and 1942 type. The British produced the 1937 type all through the war and then on civilian vehicles after the war. They made some with longer crank snouts, as a few '39 type cars with this engine were assembled in England before war shut down civilian cars, and I would guess these were also used in bren carriers to drive all the pulleys and big fans.
I just received a picture of the front of a long crank 37 from an Australian...since they used Canadian motors, it must have reached the antipodes in some sort of british military vehicle or generator.

28A · 11-03-2014, 08:25 PM

Bruce,

That picture i posted above with the ally heads and edelbrock manifold is the entire engine of the photo i sent you the other day. Also, my engine was originally in a half cut '36 chassis and it was used to power a saw mill, then a welder.. until 20 odd years ago where it sat in the chassis unused ever since until i got it about 2 years ago.

I have no idea if it was ever a running car, but apparently it was chopped up and turned into the saw mill thing either during the war, or not long after.

28A · 11-03-2014, 08:28 PM

Here is the picture of the front of mine that i sent Bruce the other day for an ID on the crank, as i'd heard mention of this "long" and "short" crank variates. Mine has as pictured, a twin pulley crank and Bruce believes it to be either a super duper rare long crank, or it has some form of adapter thingy. The water pumps are also twin pulley, however i will likely use a single pulley on the water pumps..

Bruce Lancaster · 11-03-2014, 08:50 PM

The "long" indicator on that one is the snout on pulley and the nut way out there. The reason I mentioned adapter is that I once bought a late pulley, '42-8 type, and found it to have an obstruction in there...when I pounded it out, it turned out to be a male.female threaded adapter that had extended a crank by the difference between normal long and short!

Bruce Lancaster · 11-03-2014, 09:05 PM

By the way...the normal '37-8 21 stud crank is the same as 1936 LB insert main engines AND the oddball 1938 only 24 stud short crank engine. All other 24 stud engines have the main size and spacing same as all '39-53. This later crank has been transplanted into the '37s for the Merc stroke with some machine work...Ron has done this and described the process. This allows, with some risk on the boring, a 255 21 stud.

11-03-2014, 02:28 PM	#21
DavidG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: southeastern Michigan Posts: 10,102	Re: Is this a '37 engine? The raised deck was adopted as a cost savings (less grinding) as a running change in August, 1940 according to the engineering release forms on file at the Benson Ford Research Center. The subject block is likely a service part produced in late 1940 or 1941 or thereafter.

11-03-2014, 06:27 PM	#25
flatjack9 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Oshkosh, Wi Posts: 4,527	Re: Is this a '37 engine? 37 - 38 had smaller main journals on the crank. The 59 crank could be ground to the smaller specs.

11-03-2014, 06:41 PM	#26
Bruce Lancaster Member Emeritus Join Date: May 2010 Location: Madison, NJ Posts: 5,230	Re: Is this a '37 engine? Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Ron posted on that...regrinding a 4" merc to fit. A cut down 59 woudn't do anything for you. The Canadians produced only 24 stud engines during WWII, I think, both '39 type and 1942 type. The British produced the 1937 type all through the war and then on civilian vehicles after the war. They made some with longer crank snouts, as a few '39 type cars with this engine were assembled in England before war shut down civilian cars, and I would guess these were also used in bren carriers to drive all the pulleys and big fans. I just received a picture of the front of a long crank 37 from an Australian...since they used Canadian motors, it must have reached the antipodes in some sort of british military vehicle or generator.

11-03-2014, 08:25 PM	#27
28A Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 44	Re: Is this a '37 engine? Bruce, That picture i posted above with the ally heads and edelbrock manifold is the entire engine of the photo i sent you the other day. Also, my engine was originally in a half cut '36 chassis and it was used to power a saw mill, then a welder.. until 20 odd years ago where it sat in the chassis unused ever since until i got it about 2 years ago. I have no idea if it was ever a running car, but apparently it was chopped up and turned into the saw mill thing either during the war, or not long after.

11-03-2014, 08:28 PM	#28
28A Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 44	Re: Is this a '37 engine? Here is the picture of the front of mine that i sent Bruce the other day for an ID on the crank, as i'd heard mention of this "long" and "short" crank variates. Mine has as pictured, a twin pulley crank and Bruce believes it to be either a super duper rare long crank, or it has some form of adapter thingy. The water pumps are also twin pulley, however i will likely use a single pulley on the water pumps..

11-03-2014, 08:50 PM	#29
Bruce Lancaster Member Emeritus Join Date: May 2010 Location: Madison, NJ Posts: 5,230	Re: Is this a '37 engine? The "long" indicator on that one is the snout on pulley and the nut way out there. The reason I mentioned adapter is that I once bought a late pulley, '42-8 type, and found it to have an obstruction in there...when I pounded it out, it turned out to be a male.female threaded adapter that had extended a crank by the difference between normal long and short!

11-03-2014, 09:05 PM	#30
Bruce Lancaster Member Emeritus Join Date: May 2010 Location: Madison, NJ Posts: 5,230	Re: Is this a '37 engine? By the way...the normal '37-8 21 stud crank is the same as 1936 LB insert main engines AND the oddball 1938 only 24 stud short crank engine. All other 24 stud engines have the main size and spacing same as all '39-53. This later crank has been transplanted into the '37s for the Merc stroke with some machine work...Ron has done this and described the process. This allows, with some risk on the boring, a 255 21 stud.