Bad Clutch?

['31 Patina]

I have a '31 coupe with the stock transmission and clutch. I can no longer get the car into any gear and I'm thinking I need to drop the transmission so I can get to the clutch and see what's going on.

Yesterday I removed the inspection plate that sits on top of the bell housing and with the car running I could see the pressure plate spinning. When I pushed the clutch pedal in the pressure plate keeps spinning so the clutch won't engage and let me shift into any gear.

Do I need to adjust the fingers on the pressure plate? There are six nuts on the pressure plate that look like they could be adjusted? When I push the clutch in the throw out bearing moves freely but it doesn't even come close to contacting the fingers on the pressure plate.

I do have a Les Andrews book and before I decide to remove the transmission from the car to inspect the clutch, is there anything else I should be checking or is there a way to adjust the fingers?

Thanks!

[Tom Wesenberg]

You shouldn't have to touch the 6 fingers adjustment. You might need to adjust the clutch link at the bottom of the pedal. How much freeplay does the pedal have?

[Cider Mill]

I had the same problem - stuck clutch. My cure was to open the inspection plate and spray Kroil on the shaft that the throw out bearing rides on for several days in a row. Then with car in gear, but not running rock car back & forth until it releases. Do a seach on this forum for "stuck clutch" - there is lots of advice available.

[bogdonj]

check to see if you have 1 inch of free play before contacting the fingers like Tom W said! Has the car been sitting for awhile or did this just appear out of no were?

['31 Patina]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

You shouldn't have to touch the 6 fingers adjustment. You might need to adjust the clutch link at the bottom of the pedal. How much freeplay does the pedal have?

I've tried adjusting the link at the bottom of the clutch pedal multiple times and even with 1" or 2" of pedal free play I still can't get it into gear.

['31 Patina]

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Originally Posted by Cider Mill

I had the same problem - stuck clutch. My cure was to open the inspection plate and spray Kroil on the shaft that the throw out bearing rides on for several days in a row. Then with car in gear, but not running rock car back & forth until it releases. Do a seach on this forum for "stuck clutch" - there is lots of advice available.

Thanks. I'll search the forum for stuck clutch.

[Bob C]

The Service Bulletins recommend 3/4" of free play 2" is way to much.

Bob

['31 Patina]

Originally Posted by bogdonj

check to see if you have 1 inch of free play before contacting the fingers like Tom W said! Has the car been sitting for awhile or did this just appear out of no were?

I drove the car a couple of times last fall and was having difficulties shifting into any gear at a stop sign. I would have to sit at the stop sign for roughly 30 seconds or so before I could shift it into gear. The car has been sitting all winter and this spring when I went to pull it out of the garage I was unable to get it into gear.

[Rusty Homestead Fl]

Sometimes when a car sits for a while the clutch disc will stick to the flywheel. With key off or coil wire pulled you can try rocking the car in gear, with clutch pushed in, or pulling it with another car in gear. Put the shifter in gear (2nd or 3rd) with motor off and key in off position and clutch depressed. Pull with another car, slowly, until the dicsc breaks loose from the flywheel. You'll feel it when it does. Have some form of communication with the pulling vehicle so you can stop together.

[Tom Wesenberg]

It sounds like Cider Mill's solution might be the answer. When installing a tranny or clutch, it's important to make sure the disc slides easily on the splines, and I always put a light coat of grease on the splines to keep them from rusting. Try the Kroil.

Years ago I got the stuck clutch on a 1952 Desoto unstuck by putting it in gear, then starting the engine with the front bumper against a tree. It was fluid drive, so I could start the engine and push in the clutch, then give it some gas. That broke the disc to flywheel bond, and the cluch worked fine after that.

You could start the car in first gear, then push the clutch in and give it gas and let off several times. If the disc is stuck to the flywheel, this might break the bond.

[midgetracer]

The pressure plate will always spin with the engine. It is bolted to the flywheel. The clutch disk is what has to stop to allow shifting. I think you have way to much free play. adjust the trunion on the clutch pedal until you have only a small amount of free play. Look inside the inspection cover and make sure the throw out bearing is not spinning with the clutch released and that it touches the clutch fingers with a small depression of the pedal. It should shift fine then.
Also 600wt oil is necessary in the transmission to stop the gears. 90wt will cause the transmission gears to grind since there is a tendency for the gears to keep spinning.

[1931 flamingo]

Ck the arm on the side of the trans, could it be cracked and not giving full motion to te t/out brg??
Paul in CT

[Will N]

Originally Posted by '31 Patina

I drove the car a couple of times last fall and was having difficulties shifting into any gear at a stop sign. I would have to sit at the stop sign for roughly 30 seconds or so before I could shift it into gear. The car has been sitting all winter and this spring when I went to pull it out of the garage I was unable to get it into gear.

I had a situation where the clutch arm cracked where the retaining pin that holds it on the shaft goes through. Each time I stepped on the clutch, the arm would loosen up on the shaft a little more as the crack widened. It started off feeling that the clutch pedal was easier to depress, and with each step on the clutch, it would be harder to get into the next gear. Got to the point where the clutch wouldn't release at all. I tried a roadside fix of putting a vice grip around the clutch arm to try to tighten it on the shaft. No good, had to get flatbedded home.

['31 Patina]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

It sounds like Cider Mill's solution might be the answer. When installing a tranny or clutch, it's important to make sure the disc slides easily on the splines, and I always put a light coat of grease on the splines to keep them from rusting. Try the Kroil.

Years ago I got the stuck clutch on a 1952 Desoto unstuck by putting it in gear, then starting the engine with the front bumper against a tree. It was fluid drive, so I could start the engine and push in the clutch, then give it some gas. That broke the disc to flywheel bond, and the cluch worked fine after that.

You could start the car in first gear, then push the clutch in and give it gas and let off several times. If the disc is stuck to the flywheel, this might break the bond.

I did a search on 'stuck clutch' and someone said they put the car up on jacks, started in gear, and then pushed the clutch in followed by applying the brakes. Is this worth a try? Does it matter what gear I start it in?

['31 Patina]

Originally Posted by Will N

I had a situation where the clutch arm cracked where the retaining pin that holds it on the shaft goes through. Each time I stepped on the clutch, the arm would loosen up on the shaft a little more as the crack widened. It started off feeling that the clutch pedal was easier to depress, and with each step on the clutch, it would be harder to get into the next gear. Got to the point where the clutch wouldn't release at all. I tried a roadside fix of putting a vice grip around the clutch arm to try to tighten it on the shaft. No good, had to get flatbedded home.

I will check the clutch arm for cracks. Thanks.

['31 Patina]

Originally Posted by midgetracer

The pressure plate will always spin with the engine. It is bolted to the flywheel. The clutch disk is what has to stop to allow shifting. I think you have way to much free play. adjust the trunion on the clutch pedal until you have only a small amount of free play. Look inside the inspection cover and make sure the throw out bearing is not spinning with the clutch released and that it touches the clutch fingers with a small depression of the pedal. It should shift fine then.
Also 600wt oil is necessary in the transmission to stop the gears. 90wt will cause the transmission gears to grind since there is a tendency for the gears to keep spinning.

Okay...so it's normal for the pressure plate to always spin with the engine? I did not know that so that's why I thought something was wrong when I pulled the inspection cover off and saw the plate spinning with the clutch in.

I'm a little confused with the free play term? I understand it as how much the pedal can move before the clutch engages? I had the adjusting arm turned almost all the way in where I thought I had about 1" of free play in the pedal. Maybe I don't understand the free play part?? I did buy a new adjusting arm and trunion last fall but no matter where I adjusted it I still couldn't get the car in gear.

Thanks everyone for your help so far. I plan on trying some of the things mentioned tonight. I will let you know the results.

[jkeesey]

Remove your inspection cover and look inside. With the no pressure on the clutch pedal the throwout bearing should not be contacting the pressure plate. It should have at least a quarter of an inch to be safe . The 1-2" that everyone is refering to is at the foot pedal end I hope. Putting the car on jacks like you described works great I just did it to a car this morning.

[jkeesey]

Being that the car was doing this before you put it away I would check to make sure your full of 600wt oil or your clutch could be getting worn. Generally a clutch doesn't stick on a car that is being driven they stick when sitting for long periods of time.

[JoeWay]

Originally Posted by '31 Patina

...I'm a little confused with the free play term? I understand it as how much the pedal can move before the clutch engages?...

Pedal free play is the short distance the pedal moves from the rest position before the "lost motion" is taken up--that is, before it can be felt that the pedal is beginning to do some work. It's best felt with the hand rather than the foot.

1" is the standard recommendation. You can get by with less, but then you must be careful to pay attention over time as wear in the clutch reduces free play. If it wears to the point where there is NO free play, the throwout bearing will be touching the pressure plate fingers and rotating with them when the pedal is at rest, greatly accelerating bearing wear.

If you have more than 1", you risk not having enough travel to get a full release of the clutch.

Joe

[bogdonj]

when you get it in gear or last year when you said you were driving it did you notice clutch chatter from take off?