Timing and other questions

[Tom in SW VA]

We recently took the distributor off and the reset the points at .025 and reinstall it. Do I have to time the ignition now? And how do you time a 38 221 cu. in. V-8?

Second question: If the diagram on the fuel pump is broken, leaking, etc., will the gas leak into the oil at the fuel pump? It is the glass bowl type fuel pump.

Thanking you in advance................

[ken ct]

On the second ques. its possible if its a big enough leak,First ques, if a helmet up to and including early 36 setting is .014 helmets late 36 and all crab ones are set at .016. ken ct. Its doughtfull it would run with a .025 gap on points.

[Tom in SW VA]

Originally Posted by ken ct

On the second ques. its possible if its a big enough leak,First ques, if a helmet up to and including early 36 setting is .014 helmets late 36 and all crab ones are set at .016. ken ct. Its doughtfull it would run with a .025 gap on points.

Correction: We set them at .015 Sorry ....

[Terry,OH]

check with a mirror on the bottom of the pump where the diaphragm is, are there several small holes in the casting, just under the diaphragm. If so, and the diaphragm leaked you would see some of the leaked fuel come out of the holes. I know you believe you had fuel in your oil and believe it is still leaking into the oil. Is the oil level rising on the dip stick? I am not sure how you would know this unless it is so major the gas will increase the volume of fluid in the crankcase. One of the ways this can happen with a 97 Carb is when the power valve becomes stuck open while your running the car. If your glass bowl fuel pump (incorrect for 37) has the large letters AC embossed in the top, it can be rebuilt Charlie Schwindler in NY or Ken, CT can rebuild it. If it doesn't have the large letters the pump can not be rebuilt, you may want to change it to an original (no glass bowl, also possible leaking top gasket) or get another rebuilt by the above men with the AC so you can run a true fuel filter (NAPA sells a paper filter for this pump). I'll bet your new Carb gets back from Max very shortly.

[ken ct]

Questions for you. You say this is a 37 motor,is the manifold a correct 37 one if so its built for a Stromberg carb not a 94 type carb. Not sure if 37 intakes have a heat passage hole between the 2 front studs. A lot of 35-36 intakes have this hole and do not work with a 94 carb,the heat blows out the PV in a 94 carb with this type of manifold. I have another customer in Fl. has the same trouble and ive seen it happen before. Call me we can discuss it further. 1-203-260-5945 cell.

[jerry grayson]

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Do we know that this is a serious question, or are we being led around by the nose? Just asking.

[ken ct]

Don't know Jerry,but were trying to get to the bottom of this,he never stated what his problem was.??? ken ct.

[V8COOPMAN]

He's stated his problem(s) over and over again. Started last month! Read the link below for a refresher. He admits to being in "over his head" and has begged for help with his issues...lighten-up on the guy! DD

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=122583

[Tom in SW VA]

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

You will need to find #1 Top Dead Center to set up your timing. Do the following procedure to time your engine. The firing order is 1 5 4 8 6 3 7 2. You will find a diagram on vanpeltsales.com

To time your engine remove the spark plug from #1 cylinder. Then remove your distributor cap. Next, have someone bump the starter button over while you hold your thumb over the plug hole on #1 cylinder. When you feel air pushing out against your thumb the piston is on the UP stroke. Now check to see if the rotor on the distributor is pointing near the #1 plug lead on the distributor cap. If the rotor does not point to #1 plug on cap then you are 180 degrees off. Continue to bump the starter until you land on or near #1 plug on the cap. When you feel air pusing out against your thumb and the rotor points to #1 plug on the cap you have reached #1 TDC (Top Dead Center).

Place the cap back on and start the engine. You may then have to adjust the advance on the distributor to finely tune the idle.

If you were near me I would have this car on the road in a few hours. Wish I were closer.

Thanks for this information. I wish you were here also!!! I haven't found anyone locally who really knows anything about the engine, etc. And I have tried on Craiglist, Facebook, and have asked in the small community I live in. And I have contacted the nearest Early Ford V-8 club with no results. I am terribly frustrated.

Which one is the #1 cylinder? I am a 71 year old novice.

[larrys40]

Tom,

Being that you have a pre-timed engine distributor ( as opposed to a later 49-54 8BA) style I would most certainly recommend that you have the distributor set up on a fixture like the KRW V126 timing fixture or stroboscope, one of the heyer units or sun units. That's exactly what the dealers used back in the day. The benefits of having the car run properly by having a distributor that is set up correctly is of great benefit. Back 35 years ago I use to just gap my points at .015 and set timing as described in the book and go... but then one day in my earlier years I sent it off to Seckmans Antique radio who had a ford heyer stroboscope. The distributor came back as new, I installed it and couldn't believe how much better it was.

I do own several of the test sets, stroboscopes, and V126 fixtures ( never use them) and it does make all the difference. Actual point "dwell" ,alignment, point spring tension, electrical resistance, and electrically set timing with the distributor in motion makes a huge difference on the performance. Bubba here on the forum, or other guys like myself are resources to help do a distributor for you. In my opinion, I would not rely on setting it up as described in post #9. Way too much room for margin of error and guesswork of movement of the crank/camshaft for proper TDC.. in addition to the distributor setup.

Also, related to your fuel in oil issue.. I agree with Terry, it would leak out the bottom holes in the fuel pump housing..... You probably have a bad power/economizer valve - loose or otherwise. It would have to be running extremely rich, not to mention hard to start.

If you need a distributor done contact myself, Bubba, or others who do distributor rebuilding/strobing. You would then just bolt them on with your caps and harness.. and you should be running well (once you're fuel issues are solved).

Larry Shepard

[Tom in SW VA]

I have tried my best to describe my problem. I don't appreciate the negative criticism. On the positive side, many Fordbarners have tried to help and I have tried every suggestion. Where else can I turn?

[Tom in SW VA]

Originally Posted by larrys40

Tom,

Being that you have a pre-timed engine distributor ( as opposed to a later 49-54 8BA) style I would most certainly recommend that you have the distributor set up on a fixture like the KRW V126 timing fixture or stroboscope, one of the heyer units or sun units. That's exactly what the dealers used back in the day. The benefits of having the car run properly by having a distributor that is set up correctly is of great benefit. Back 35 years ago I use to just gap my points at .015 and set timing as described in the book and go... but then one day in my earlier years I sent it off to Seckmans Antique radio who had a ford heyer stroboscope. The distributor came back as new, I installed it and couldn't believe how much better it was.

I do own several of the test sets, stroboscopes, and V126 fixtures ( never use them) and it does make all the difference. Actual point "dwell" ,alignment, point spring tension, electrical resistance, and electrically set timing with the distributor in motion makes a huge difference on the performance. Bubba here on the forum, or other guys like myself are resources to help do a distributor for you. In my opinion, I would not rely on setting it up as described in post #9. Way too much room for margin of error and guesswork of movement of the crank/camshaft for proper TDC.. in addition to the distributor setup.

Also, related to your fuel in oil issue.. I agree with Terry, it would leak out the bottom holes in the fuel pump housing..... You probably have a bad power/economizer valve - loose or otherwise. It would have to be running extremely rich, not to mention hard to start.

If you need a distributor done contact myself, Bubba, or others who do distributor rebuilding/strobing. You would then just bolt them on with your caps and harness.. and you should be running well (once you're fuel issues are solved).

Larry Shepard

Thanks Larry.

[Tom in SW VA]

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

Tom, i just thougth of something. You most likey have the helmet style distributor. There should be a small "tang" on the back of the distrubutor and that should only bolt up one way to the engine. Do you have the helmet style or a crab style distributor? There is only one way these distributors will bolt on.

I don't know to tell the difference. Where can I see pics of the two types? I do know that when we took the distributor off there was a "slot" on the back that slid into the block and it could only go one way, Does that help? I do have the coil conversion kit with the coil on the block.

[Tom in SW VA]

Originally Posted by larrys40

Tom,

Being that you have a pre-timed engine distributor ( as opposed to a later 49-54 8BA) style I would most certainly recommend that you have the distributor set up on a fixture like the KRW V126 timing fixture or stroboscope, one of the heyer units or sun units. That's exactly what the dealers used back in the day. The benefits of having the car run properly by having a distributor that is set up correctly is of great benefit. Back 35 years ago I use to just gap my points at .015 and set timing as described in the book and go... but then one day in my earlier years I sent it off to Seckmans Antique radio who had a ford heyer stroboscope. The distributor came back as new, I installed it and couldn't believe how much better it was.

I do own several of the test sets, stroboscopes, and V126 fixtures ( never use them) and it does make all the difference. Actual point "dwell" ,alignment, point spring tension, electrical resistance, and electrically set timing with the distributor in motion makes a huge difference on the performance. Bubba here on the forum, or other guys like myself are resources to help do a distributor for you. In my opinion, I would not rely on setting it up as described in post #9. Way too much room for margin of error and guesswork of movement of the crank/camshaft for proper TDC.. in addition to the distributor setup.

Also, related to your fuel in oil issue.. I agree with Terry, it would leak out the bottom holes in the fuel pump housing..... You probably have a bad power/economizer valve - loose or otherwise. It would have to be running extremely rich, not to mention hard to start.

If you need a distributor done contact myself, Bubba, or others who do distributor rebuilding/strobing. You would then just bolt them on with your caps and harness.. and you should be running well (once you're fuel issues are solved).

Larry Shepard

Where is the power/economizer valve located? In the fuel pump? I have the glass bowl type fuel pump which I know is wrong. Should I change the the dome type with the fliters which is original?

[Tom in SW VA]

From what I can ascertain, I have the helmet type distributor. Does that help in the trouble-shooting? Does this type have to be timed?

[barnfind]

Hope this helps:
http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/f...str-timing.htm

[JM 35 Sedan]

Tom, keep asking for help and plugging away on this, I feel sure you will get this straightened out. Doesn't matter if you are 71 or 17, you are never too old to learn if you are willing.

[ford38v8]

Tom, I just pulled up a map of your area, hoping that you were near a RG of the V8 Club. Unfortunately, Wilksboro NC is the closest to you, at just over 100 miles as the crow flies. Still, I'd advise that you contact James from Blue Ridge RG 146. A V8er seeking knowledge should never have to go it alone given the great number of V8 enthusiasts in this world. I hasten to add, though, that your being a current member of the EFV8CA would go a long way in securing one-on-one advice and help from the membership, although certainly not required. Hopefully, you can find time to attend their next club meeting to introduce yourself and present your dillemma.

Blue Ridge V-8 (RG# 146)
Contact: James Cashman
[email protected]

[ken ct]

Originally Posted by Tom in SW VA

From what I can ascertain, I have the helmet type distributor. Does that help in the trouble-shooting? Does this type have to be timed?

Helmet dist have 2 caps on each side an outer and a inner. Crab has only 1 cap. Rabbit eared ones 46-48 have 2 caps.You can get this running w/o a machine.ken ct. The PV is in the base of the carb not the FP.

[ken ct]

Originally Posted by barnfind

Hope this helps:
http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/f...str-timing.htm

He also has pics of the other ones. That one is a crab 42-45 yrs. Your ok with the glass bowl FP and you can put a paper filter in the bowl ,NAPA #3039 you will have to source out a cork gasket and and a new screen and a spring to place under the filter in the bowl, ken ct.