Clutch Chatter

[whb52ford]

I got it from C&G Ford Parts. Not sure what it is. Would think they would have a good clutch, but who knows.

[Zax40]

Originally Posted by whb52ford

Well I still have the clutch chatter. New clutch, new pressure plate, new throw out bearing, new pilot bearing, flywheel resurfaced, new motot mounts, new transmission mount, and new bell housing. Why do I still have clutch chatter?

Are you 100% sure it's clutch chatter? I had a '53 Ford that was smooth as butter letting out the clutch until I decided to install lowering blocks in the rear. Those 2 inch blocks caused the whole car to feel like it was shaking apart when I let out the clutch. Could something else in your driveline be the cause?

[whb52ford]

That is a good question. I checked the u bolts that go over the rear end and they are tight. I could not even tighten them a bit. The shocks are tight on both ends, the springs look like the rubber is in them and not loose. U-joints are not that old and seem tight. I believe I have had this problem for a long time, but since I was not driving the car every day I ignored it. I'm stumped. Today at lunch with the car guys they said they could see the hood vibrating with the clutch chatter, so there is no question that I have it. They are stumped too. They believe clutch chatter is caused when the springs in the clutch get weak or broken. The springs looked good in both clutches. Maybe my best bet is to look for a NOS clutch.

[Zax40]

If you know anyone that has one of those Go Pro type cameras with the magnetic bases maybe you could borrow it and film the drive line as you let out the clutch. Maybe that would give you more visibility into the cause.

[38 coupe]

Originally Posted by whb52ford

I got it from C&G Ford Parts. Not sure what it is. Would think they would have a good clutch, but who knows.

Long story about my experiences with clutch parts behind a 215 six. I had a vibrating engine in my 53. Very early in my ownership I swapped in an overdrive transmission. While I had the transmission out I swapped in a different good looking used pressure plate and disk. That made no difference to the vibration, the out of balance was in the engine, but it now would chatter when starting up on a hill. Since central Texas is mostly flat I didn't bother to tear it all apart and fix it, I just lived with it. Finally I had to rebuild the engine, the vibration was so bad it wiped out the rear main seal. I had a decent paying job by then so I did it right and installed a new clutch kit from a good V8 parts vendor on the rebuilt engine. That new clutch chattered horribly. I pulled the transmission out and swapped that first pressure plate back in, but it didn't make it any better. I took the second (old Ford, not new kit) pressure plate to a clutch rebuilder and got it rebuilt. The rebuilder's advice was to go find a NOS or good old used clutch disk to go with the rebuilt pressure plate. I did that and chatter was gone. I ended up fighting the pressure plate too, but that makes a long story even longer.
Summation: I no longer trust new clutch disks for flathead era Fords.

[whb52ford]

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I looked on eBay for a NOS 9 1/2" clutch and could not find one. Do you have any idea where I could find one?

I'm still looking to find someone with that camera and look at the drive train.

I've got 2 new/modern ones and they both give clutch chatter so it makes no sense to get another one unless it's NOS. Looks like I'm on hold till I find one.
thanks

[38 coupe]

Originally Posted by whb52ford

I looked on eBay for a NOS 9 1/2" clutch and could not find one. Do you have any idea where I could find one?

Get a copy of both the 1953 Ford Passenger Car Chassis Parts Catalog and the 49-59 Ford Chassis Parts Catalog. The first one will tell you what part numbers were being made when your car was produced. The second one will tell you what part numbers were still being made to support the car years later. I have a digital version of the second and a quick look shows two part numbers for 9 1/2 inch clutch disks with 10 spline hubs: 8BA 7550-A and B7A 7550-A.

Take those two part number and search ebay. As of the time I write this there are three clutch disks that match the part number description and appear to me to be old material clutch disks: link one, link two, link three.

One additional bit of information, make sure the disk you end up with has "marcel". From the three linked the first one includes a picture showing the edge of the disk. In the picture you can see there is a gap between the two friction linings. The other two disks probably also have this feature, but the posted pictures do not show that area.

[whb52ford]

Just an update. The guys seemed to think there was an issue with the rear end. I have a rebuilt rear end so I put that in the car. No change.

We jacked the front of the car up on jack stands and removed the inspection plate. With someone in the car with the clutch pedal down and transmission in neutral we can touch the outside edge of the clutch and rotate it. If the transmission is in 1st with the clutch down, we can only rotate the clutch an inch or so. Why would putting the transmission in first stop the clutch from rotating if the clutch is down? Same for 2nd and 3rd gear.

[Nick Bernier]

The pressure plate is attached to the input shaft of the trans. With the trans in ANY gear, you're trying to turn the drive shaft and rear wheels.

[whb52ford]

Even when the clutch is down?

[Nick Bernier]

Sorry, meant to say: clutch disk is attached to the input shaft.
Nick

[Zax40]

Originally Posted by whb52ford

Just an update. The guys seemed to think there was an issue with the rear end. I have a rebuilt rear end so I put that in the car. No change.

We jacked the front of the car up on jack stands and removed the inspection plate. With someone in the car with the clutch pedal down and transmission in neutral we can touch the outside edge of the clutch and rotate it. If the transmission is in 1st with the clutch down, we can only rotate the clutch an inch or so. Why would putting the transmission in first stop the clutch from rotating if the clutch is down? Same for 2nd and 3rd gear.

If by clutch is down you mean the clutch pedal is pressed all the way down. Then yes, that behavior is correct. Remember the clutch disk rides on the transmission input shaft splines. If the trans is in neutral it is uncoupled from the driveshaft and rear end. If the trans is in gear it is coupled to the driveshaft and rear end.

[whb52ford]

I’m trying to get access to a garage with a lift. My friend wants to put the car on the lift, me start it, and slowly let the clutch out till it chatters while he is under it with the clutch cover removed. He wants to see what is going on because nothing makes sense. We know to block the wheels and emergency brake on. On vacation for a week.

[whb52ford]

Today we jacked up the rear wheels on a lift and removed the clutch inspection cover. There is definately a chatter and the only thing they thought it could be was the input shaft on the transmission was not tight with the clutch. I pulled the transmission today and that is not the problem, however we did notice that the outside half, on both sides of the clutch was glazed or shinny. That made no sense. I have ordered a NOS rebuilt clutch.

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by whb52ford

Today we jacked up the rear wheels on a lift and removed the clutch inspection cover. There is definately a chatter and the only thing they thought it could be was the input shaft on the transmission was not tight with the clutch. I pulled the transmission today and that is not the problem, however we did notice that the outside half, on both sides of the clutch was glazed or shinny. That made no sense. I have ordered a NOS rebuilt clutch.

[Mickd]

Originally Posted by whb52ford

Today we jacked up the rear wheels on a lift and removed the clutch inspection cover. There is definately a chatter and the only thing they thought it could be was the input shaft on the transmission was not tight with the clutch. I pulled the transmission today and that is not the problem, however we did notice that the outside half, on both sides of the clutch was glazed or shinny. That made no sense. I have ordered a NOS rebuilt clutch.

If it's the original pressure plate maybe the three fingers aren't evenly adjusted.
Perhaps you need to reface the pressure plate too?
I took my flywheel in to be re-drilled & tapped to take a Falcon pressure plate. Same size clutch plate. And the clutch is lighter too.

[whb52ford]

It's a new one from C&G Ford Parts. The other pressure plate was new 8 years ago and looks good.

[whb52ford]

Could something in the transmission be causing the clutch chatter. I checked to see how much play between input shaft and output shaft and a very small amount of movement

[whb52ford]

Well I bought the 9 1/2 disk from ebay and it is a 10" disk. Just another delay.

[38 coupe]

Will the 10" fit in the 9 1/2 pressure plate? I have done similar things with an 11" clutch and a 10 1/2 inch pressure plate and with a 9 1/2" disk with a 10" pressure plate. Definitely not what I would choose if all parts were available, but it got the vehicles back on the road with what was available and worked well.