Reliability of Early V8 and Highway Driving

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by Brendan

i have driven my 36 over Hopland grade, 25 mph in second gear up hill and 25 in second down. you don't want to go down in 3rd because brake fade.

Now we're getting somewhere. I wouldn't drive it over Hopland grade, I would take it up 20 and over to Ukiah if I was towing, that goes true for my current flatbed as well.

Originally Posted by Brendan

i drove into pope valley , from Angwin, i could not stop in time for the stop sign bad brake fade. the motor in my pickup is all stock and its a 85 hp. i tell people if you want to get somewhere in a hurry, take a newer truck. just enjoy the ride in a old truck or car

This also helps. I have driven up through Pope Valley a number of times, I never knew about it until my neighbors who owned the house next to my property told me about it, they used to haul their boat up that way...that's a fairly tame road, but a bit twisty towards the Silverado Trail side.

Originally Posted by Brendan

in my opinion a Big truck will not go over 45 mph, they where built to haul big loads. also people did not drive as fast as we do today

I think I keep wanting to hear that it would be faster. But truth be told, I saw a video last night on a '39 and the guy said he tried to drive it on the highway and after a year or two he needed 3 rods and bearings.

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

This looks like a good foundation for your desired truck! Remember, a 1/2 ton pickup has the same frame and running gear as a car of the same year. How much would you haul in a car? (And still stop?)

So are you saying that the frame is probably the same as the pickup of the same year? That if I was to swap out the entire rear end, it might be able to drive it on the highway?

That is such a damn cool looking truck, I feel myself getting sucked in...I might be better waiting for something else in a bit better shape. I am not sure I would lay out cash for it, but may try to trade.

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

I see that this truck has a later distributor so it is likely a later (59A) engine of 100 HP. I know in 1940 the 1 1/2 ton trucks had the option of the 100 HP Mercury engine. My grand dad bought one new and it's now sitting at my Dad's place. Maybe 39's had the same option.

That would be even better if it had a 100HP engine.

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

This truck will give you much bigger brakes and suspension (will ride rough, though). Keep the flathead and work on the gearing. To be period correct, find an over/under Browning gearbox to add in the driveline. This will keep you busy shifting: 1st low, 1st direct, 1st over, etc. Then you can split the gears; for example maybe to get the best RPM you need to go from 4th under to 3rd over. A gear for every occasion! The challenge is to make every shift without any gear grinding!
There are later overdrive trans options, too.

This does sound more possible than the AA/BB (until '34) trucks.

Originally Posted by Bob C

The Model A speedometer went to 80 mph but that ain't happening.

Damnit Bob, that's not what I want to hear! j/k Maybe it will go 20mph more than a Model A???

Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois

When you narrow it down, you can swap out the rear end for something with a more highway friendly gear ratio. Ford had those steep gears to haul heavy loads.

I wouldn't mind investing the time to do that, especially if it would make it a usable truck for me. I wouldn't need to use it very often, I literally use my flatbed about 2 a year. Last year it only had 200 miles on it from the previous smog 2 years prior.

Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois

One of my favorites was the '35 ton and a half that the Three Stooges drive in 'Three Little Beers' watch that show, THAT will get you going!!

I have to dig that up now...

Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois

Good luck. We have a '36 pickup with the flathead and it is really a pretty dependable little truck, sure fun to drive!! Keeps up with 55 MPH traffic on the two lanes no problem, but I wouldn't take it on the Interstates where a lot of people run 75-80.

So what you're saying is that it's possible in the 1/2-ton pickup, but that certainly has different gearing in the rear end. This is promising to hear as I am guessing as long as one can put up with getting screamed at and flipped off constantly, the other half of the time when people give you the thumbs up would be golden!

Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois

Running down the two lanes I really don't get much traffic piling up behind me, not like when I drive the Model A at 40 MPH I get a line of cars following me in short order. Most people are pretty good, now and then you get somebody that gets upset but not that often, really. Our pickup has been changed over to hydraulic brakes and they work real well.

That's encouraging. Thanks for linking in those stooges, and pre-Shemp, my faves. That is a way cool truck...I see me having the same issue with logs...LOL

I know where that is, the second video said Echo Park, I grew up in L.A. and do know that area...lots of old cars in those videos...way cool...

Alan

[flatford8]

https://maine.craigslist.org/cto/d/1...492560280.html
I know you were looking for something older and your on the other side of the country but, I thought this might give you something to think about......Mark

[mhsprecher]

I have a 45 jailbar 1/2 ton. It can go 50 and maybe more. One guy near me put in a later rear in his so it wouldn't rev so it was better on the highway. Mine drives easily and is pretty comfortable. It has its own look, but it still attracts a lot of attention.

The jailbars have truck frames and parallel semi-elliptical springs. It's interesting that Henry kept the old transverse buggy springs on the cars up through 48, but allowed the trucks to modernize. I read that he didn't care much about the trucks. The brakes on my mine are very good.

Mark, that's a nice F5. You should buy it.

[40 Deluxe]

Originally Posted by alan_d

Now we're getting somewhere. I wouldn't drive it over Hopland grade, I would take it up 20 and over to Ukiah if I was towing, that goes true for my current flatbed as well.



This also helps. I have driven up through Pope Valley a number of times, I never knew about it until my neighbors who owned the house next to my property told me about it, they used to haul their boat up that way...that's a fairly tame road, but a bit twisty towards the Silverado Trail side.



I think I keep wanting to hear that it would be faster. But truth be told, I saw a video last night on a '39 and the guy said he tried to drive it on the highway and after a year or two he needed 3 rods and bearings.



So are you saying that the frame is probably the same as the pickup of the same year? That if I was to swap out the entire rear end, it might be able to drive it on the highway?

That is such a damn cool looking truck, I feel myself getting sucked in...I might be better waiting for something else in a bit better shape. I am not sure I would lay out cash for it, but may try to trade.



That would be even better if it had a 100HP engine.



This does sound more possible than the AA/BB (until '34) trucks.



Damnit Bob, that's not what I want to hear! j/k Maybe it will go 20mph more than a Model A???



I wouldn't mind investing the time to do that, especially if it would make it a usable truck for me. I wouldn't need to use it very often, I literally use my flatbed about 2 a year. Last year it only had 200 miles on it from the previous smog 2 years prior.



I have to dig that up now...



So what you're saying is that it's possible in the 1/2-ton pickup, but that certainly has different gearing in the rear end. This is promising to hear as I am guessing as long as one can put up with getting screamed at and flipped off constantly, the other half of the time when people give you the thumbs up would be golden!




That's encouraging. Thanks for linking in those stooges, and pre-Shemp, my faves. That is a way cool truck...I see me having the same issue with logs...LOL

I know where that is, the second video said Echo Park, I grew up in L.A. and do know that area...lots of old cars in those videos...way cool...

Alan

Not sure if I was clear on the frame thing.
What I meant was that a half ton pickup used the car frame, brakes and wheels, etc. Basically a car with a pickup cab and bed.
The truck in your photos is different than a car or pickup. It is rated as a one and a half ton with heavier frame, wheels, brakes, springs, etc. A late model one ton dually rear axle with the late springs may fit under that frame with minor mods. Ford, GM and Dodge all used various spring spacing, so a junkyard cruise with a tape measure may turn up just what you need.
Late '80's, early '90's Dodge one ton duallies used a straight front axle but with coil springs. Just weld on spring pads for leaf springs and you will have all modern axles and disc brakes, and still look close to stock. This Dodge axle looks a lot like it's a 4X4, but it's just a hollow tube. Late one tons have a GVW as good as or better than that '38-'39, as I recall.

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

Not sure if I was clear on the frame thing.
What I meant was that a half ton pickup used the car frame, brakes and wheels, etc. Basically a car with a pickup cab and bed.

Ok, I understand what you are saying now. I was thinking you may have meant that I could use the 1-1/2 ton frame and remove some of the suspension and have a similar frame, but you were more referring to it being similar to the car.

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

The truck in your photos is different than a car or pickup. It is rated as a one and a half ton with heavier frame, wheels, brakes, springs, etc. A late model one ton dually rear axle with the late springs may fit under that frame with minor mods. Ford, GM and Dodge all used various spring spacing, so a junkyard cruise with a tape measure may turn up just what you need.

Yes, I understand that. The main reason I was attracted to it, that it has a heavier chassis that can handle the 1-1/2 ton.

Of course I want the convenience of driving a pickup around town with the capability to haul 2 ton worth of load...I guess it doesn't work like that... That's not even really true, I've been after a heavier truck I can haul timber with, and had been focused on the AA/BB all along. The '38-39 I posted is just a slightly newer version of the same truck.

[Adam/Mill Valley CA]

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I'm in southern Marin and I drive my '36 pickup all over the Bay Area, so I'll add my 2 cents. It's pretty much stock, 221 cu in babbitt bearing motor with the cast iron heads milled for higher compression, but otherwise two main mods-a 3.78 rear end, which allows use on the freeway, and hydraulic brakes like Jeff (but I went the extra step and put Lincoln/Bendix type brakes up front, another big improvement). It will run 55-60 all day. I routinely drive as far as San Jose (love the Antique Autos in History Park show in September!), Carmel Valley, up around Napa/Sonoma, sometimes East Bay. Bay Area drivers are generally terrible but I've never had a close call in years of driving it here. It's my only truck so I do all sorts of light hauling (yard debris, furniture moving, etc) with it; it has all sorts of nicks and scratches appropriate to a pickup. With the heaviest loads it does "motorboat" a bit but still OK-definitely not something to haul big lumber with! I think ultimately you would be much happier with a pickup unless you are insistent on hauling big loads.

Adam

[blucar]

I know that "alan d" has stated that his original preference was a AA-BB truck, which I don't think would even come close to do the job he is looking for.
Food for thought.. I have a very nice un-molested '36 1.5 ton flat bed. I have the original 21 stud engine and a 59AB that was the last engine the truck had. The truck was used on a local citrus farm during it's whole life. The flat bed is not the original Ford script bed, it is later model.
The truck needs to be restored, mechanically and body wise, however, the body/chassis is in great shape with no rust out.. Restoring the mechanical components and cleaning the body up would make a nice survivor truck.

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by Adam/Mill Valley CA

I'm in southern Marin and I drive my '36 pickup all over the Bay Area, so I'll add my 2 cents. It's pretty much stock, 221 cu in babbitt bearing motor with the cast iron heads milled for higher compression, but otherwise two main mods-a 3.78 rear end, which allows use on the freeway, and hydraulic brakes like Jeff (but I went the extra step and put Lincoln/Bendix type brakes up front, another big improvement). It will run 55-60 all day. I routinely drive as far as San Jose (love the Antique Autos in History Park show in September!), Carmel Valley, up around Napa/Sonoma, sometimes East Bay. Bay Area drivers are generally terrible but I've never had a close call in years of driving it here. It's my only truck so I do all sorts of light hauling (yard debris, furniture moving, etc) with it; it has all sorts of nicks and scratches appropriate to a pickup. With the heaviest loads it does "motorboat" a bit but still OK-definitely not something to haul big lumber with! I think ultimately you would be much happier with a pickup unless you are insistent on hauling big loads.

Adam

Adam,

This is all I would ask of a truck, and I would be happy to drive it 55mph, that is about as far as I would rive, San Jose to Marin...I would mainly use it around Lake County...currently my '97 w/460 would be used to haul stuff up to the lake from San Jose and/or Morgan Hill.

I guess the $64k question is whether a similar 1-1/2 ton truck could do the same.

Having a truck similar to yours, I would be able to use it as my daily driver to replace my current Tacoma, so that is an option for me...to get a pickup and change the gearing in the rear end and add hydraulic brakes. And BTW Adam, my Tacoma kind of boats around when it's loaded also, so I don't see that too much different.

Having a pickup would be more useful, certainly, for the majority of driving I do, but keep pondering over a flatbed and/or if it is possible to get them up to highway speed safely without damaging the engine, transmission or rear end?

Alan

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by blucar

I know that "alan d" has stated that his original preference was a AA-BB truck, which I don't think would even come close to do the job he is looking for.
Food for thought.. I have a very nice un-molested '36 1.5 ton flat bed. I have the original 21 stud engine and a 59AB that was the last engine the truck had. The truck was used on a local citrus farm during it's whole life. The flat bed is not the original Ford script bed, it is later model.
The truck needs to be restored, mechanically and body wise, however, the body/chassis is in great shape with no rust out.. Restoring the mechanical components and cleaning the body up would make a nice survivor truck.

Yes, I understand what you are saying about the AA/BB, I've come to that conclusion also, they just are not up to being a highway truck which is what I'm after.

That leads me to ask if the rear end gearing could be changed to make them more acceptable? My primary concern at the moment is how that '38-'39 1-1/2 ton could be modified to run on the highway, or even if it could. Still could be useful for me up around Kelseyville and around Clearlake in general, but getting to Kelseyville Lumber and back to my property would be a first step. Sure, I can do that with my current flatbed and/or Tacoma for most stuff. It's when I have a heavy load and need the flatbed that it will be most useful. I'm just trying to figure out how limiting that will be for me.

If that '38-'39 has a 100HP engine, that would be a big plus, IMO, if the rear end gearing was changed, it might be drivable at 55mph on the highway?

Alan

[flatford8]

I guess you know getting the truck to go the speed you want is only one thing....getting it to stay on the road....and then being able to stop it with a load is a different ball game....I think you need to two...one for daily runs and a big truck for the heavy chores...Mark

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by flatford8

I guess you know getting the truck to go the speed you want is only one thing....getting it to stay on the road....and then being able to stop it with a load is a different ball game....I think you need to two...one for daily runs and a big truck for the heavy chores...Mark

Indeed. I mentioned above I saw a '39 flatbed on YouTube, the owner had it for many years and mentioned he drove it at highways speeds and had to rebuild the engine after a couple years...he needed 3 rods and bearings. After his rebuild he only uses it on his farm.

I certainly want to be mindful of what I would do to any older Ford Early V8, so why I was asking here.

Stopping is an issue in itself, and I would update brakes with hydraulics if need be, and I can also change the rear end gears, but if I was to do so I want to know that I won't be destroying and setting myself up for failure.

I agree with you on two trucks, one for smaller loads, driving around town, the other for heavier loads...that was my plan all along in looking for an Early V8 flatbed. But it seems the AA/BBs are not as useful at driving on the highway.

Still not clear on what type of engine is in the '38-'39 flatbed I posted above, but that might have a little extra HP on it per some of the comments, possibly 100HP.

I don't use my flatbed too often, but when I do it's because I can't haul it in my Tacoma.

Alan

[flatford8]

Fords were 85 hp up till ‘46 then they were 100hp I think. Merc in ‘39 went 100. I think. Vanpelts Sales is a great website for info. If Im wrong on any of my statements Im sure someone will correct me........ Mark
PS.... a little truck for the small jobs...big one for the big jobs.....I hope I’ve talked you into two trucks!!!! We all need more than one!!!!.... Aint this a great website!!

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by flatford8

Fords were 85 hp up till ‘46 then they were 100hp I think. Merc in ‘39 went 100. I think. Vanpelts Sales is a great website for info. If Im wrong on any of my statements Im sure someone will correct me........ Mark

Ok, I was thinking it had an 85HP in it, the Ford emblems that are missing on the hood had 85 for them that year, however both are gone. I was only going by what someone else mentioned up higher in the thread, that it looked like it as the 100HP, but I could have mistaken what they were talking about...information overload...LOL

Originally Posted by flatford8

PS.... a little truck for the small jobs...big one for the big jobs.....I hope I’ve talked you into two trucks!!!! We all need more than one!!!!.... Aint this a great website!!

Well, you didn't actually talk me into two trucks as I have two already!

I have a 1997 Ford Super Duty, I believe it's a 2-ton chassis, and it was sold as a chassis and the bed was added. It has a 12' flatbed with a tool cabinet with shelves on each side and a 4 tool boxes. It also has a 60 gallon fuel tank with a pump, I use it for diesel to fuel my forklift.

I have 3 other cars, including a 911 Targa which is my favorite car to drive.

Up above I linked to a '39 that the owner had put an 1991 F-350 460, drive train and rear end on...he was selling it for about $20k or so...but that got me to thinking I could do that with an old truck, but I wonder what that would really get me? My F-Super Duty is more like an F-450 Super Duty in current times.

I really appreciate all of you guys chiming in, and I think Adam pretty much confirmed that modifying a pickup can be done and will work well for my daily driver needs. I think that's convincing me to look for a pickup and just keep my flatbed the way it is, no sense in fixing something that isn't broken.

Like most people here, I like old stuff. As such I'm attracted to old trucks, and would like something cool to drive around.

Alan

[alan_d]

I need to quit looking, up in Brendan's neck of the woods...

This would fit my bill perfectly, I wonder how much the reserve is? Most cases the reserve is not met, but you never know...if someone wants it bad enough...

What do some of you others think the reserve might be set at?

I'm guessing $4k-$5k.

But let me ask you a better question. Let's say I was to buy a truck like this, it needs quite a bit of work. What is something like this worth? I'd rather find one in the barn like he did...LOL But even at $4k-$5k it seems a decent deal considering it looks like a straight original truck.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1939-Ford-O...s/222839785655

Alan

[alan_d]

It's back! I sent the seller a message, and that is a nice truck. All it needs is natural wood stakes, that red has got to go...but what a nice truck...

1934 Ford BB - V8

https://www.ebay.com/itm/37222306335...m=372223063357

[40 Deluxe]

Originally Posted by alan_d

It's back! I sent the seller a message, and that is a nice truck. All it needs is natural wood stakes, that red has got to go...but what a nice truck...

1934 Ford BB - V8

https://www.ebay.com/itm/37222306335...m=372223063357

This is also a later engine, maybe even the 100 HP version. It should have letters or numbers cast into the center of the heads, such as 'A', '41T', '59AB', but apparently has been ground off.
An original engine would have had the water pumps in the heads and hoses going from the pumps to the radiator.

[blucar]

"alan d"... looking real close at the 34 BB flat bed truck, things start to appear that don't quite add up.. I think the seller said it all when he stated that the truck was used for parades.
I would not classify the bed as not being a "working bed". The bed rails are what appears to be 4" channel which have been notched to clear the rear wheels. The wood deck is 1 x 6 that is not a normal tongue and grove type of decking. The wood stake sides are also all wrong..
The engine has already been discussed with some anomalies noted.

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by blucar

"alan d"... looking real close at the 34 BB flat bed truck, things start to appear that don't quite add up.. I think the seller said it all when he stated that the truck was used for parades.
I would not classify the bed as not being a "working bed". The bed rails are what appears to be 4" channel which have been notched to clear the rear wheels. The wood deck is 1 x 6 that is not a normal tongue and grove type of decking. The wood stake sides are also all wrong..
The engine has already been discussed with some anomalies noted.

blucar,

Thanks for pointing all that out. It looks like it could be original, but obviously has many changes.

The previous buyer I'm told was in Europe and backed out, and the seller says he paid the fees to relist it also...

Maybe the buyer realized it had changes to it? Not sure, but I'm not in a real position to be a serious bidder on something like that at this time. I like that '39 PU up in Santa Rosa much better.

EDIT: I do realize I need to keep learning about these Early V8 Fords before buying one. I will be doing more research. Not knowing how to tell if the engine is original or not, knowing the top speed limits, the rear end gearing, etc...there's a lot to know and there's a lot of horked up vehicles as they are old, fragile in some ways, and built like a tank in others...upgraded brakes as another examples, probably good but changes the originality. I would be ok with sacrificing better brakes for loss of originality, and would probably do that myself to make a vehicle more usable.

Alan

[alan_d]

Originally Posted by alan_d

I need to quit looking, up in Brendan's neck of the woods...

This would fit my bill perfectly, I wonder how much the reserve is? Most cases the reserve is not met, but you never know...if someone wants it bad enough...

What do some of you others think the reserve might be set at?

I'm guessing $4k-$5k.

But let me ask you a better question. Let's say I was to buy a truck like this, it needs quite a bit of work. What is something like this worth? I'd rather find one in the barn like he did...LOL But even at $4k-$5k it seems a decent deal considering it looks like a straight original truck.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1939-Ford-O...s/222839785655

Alan

The above is up to $4k and hasn't met the reserve.

Ultimately that's the type of pickup that would work for me.

Alan

[Adam/Mill Valley CA]

I really appreciate all of you guys chiming in, and I think Adam pretty much confirmed that modifying a pickup can be done and will work well for my daily driver needs. I think that's convincing me to look for a pickup and just keep my flatbed the way it is, no sense in fixing something that isn't broken.

Like most people here, I like old stuff. As such I'm attracted to old trucks, and would like something cool to drive around.

I think you need to be a little bit cautious about trying to make one of these old gals your daily driver. I use my pickup regularly but really wouldn't consider using it daily. First, these are simply not safe vehicles in the modern sense of the word, daily use would really sharply increase your risk of getting in an accident, in which you almost always will come off second best. Second, depending on one of these in bad weather (even California-style bad weather, never mind ice and snow) would be both uncomfortable and even more dangerous-poor to none in heating/defrosting, terrible windshield wipers by modern standards, etc. I would keep your Tacoma and use your vintage pickup selectively, for fun and selected jobs in good weather. Just my opinion

Adam