Whose Knowledge Is It, Anyway?

[Brentwood Bob]

Bob's Rule #3. About one in 100 are jerks, they even enjoy being jerks. You have been attacked before on the old Site, and its followed you here. I, for one, value you input, freely given. Looks like I'm not alone. The individual who attacked you for whatever reason needs to look at what he did. That type of thing has no value here. He should move on. If he's lucky, in his travels he will run across others he can argue with. Just leave me, and my friends alone. Bob

[marc hildebrant]

Just found your web site due to this posting.
It's a good site and has a lot of useful info.

Thanks for your time in setting up the web site.

Marc

[Bob S]

I guess I should thank that attacker, because now I know about Vince's site. What a great resource. I'm sure I will use it often. Now I just need to find all those other sites that RockHillWill referred to. Anyone have addresses to post? I think it is great when people like Vince and the others take the time and effort to help others in this way, and can't imagine why anyone would make such an attack.

Bob

[Bruce Lancaster]

Goood sites, all very useful, all different:

http://idisk.mac.com/forever4/Public/index.htm
http://www.abarnyard.com/
http://jmodela.com/
http://www.plucks329s.org/
http://www.mantiquesresto.com/
http://home.comcast.net/~68c/
http://www.motormayhem.net/mode-a-fo...pecifications/ (not really a great site in general, but reprints many salesman's illustrations)
http://rkkaww2.armchairgeneral.com/galleries.htm (another odd entry...scroll down and blow-up the Gaz AA and AAA entries to see veryinteresting modernizations/upgrades to otherwise bearly normal Ford structure)

[Craig Lewis]

1) Vince I find your website excellent. As a personal contributor to the site I recall a polite & curtious request if you could include my item regarding tempered glass.
2) I have no problem with reading copyrighted material online providing the author is given recognition. I think those with strong feelings in this regard should step back a bit and view the reality of what they're "policing" and perhaps do something instead to bring some FUN back into the hobby.
In the case of samplings of someone's book posted online
(as carried out by an individual who recently moved to the "other side")
...I see it as a tremendous advertizing plug for the book....they likely sell more copies as a result.
3) Anybody who sacrifices valuable personal time, to provide a website of free info to a bunch of hobbiest's shouldn't be discouraged and I truly hope and expect you will eventually pick up some form of reward for your efforts. What that reward is, is none of my concern nor business, but hopefully it's something more than the guy who restores licence plates for $25xx each! (he was recommended on a recent thread)
Thanks again for the info you share Vince.

[Freddie (Memphis)]

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Vince...your website may indeed be a collection of other people's experiences ... coupled with your personal experiences. But, in all our daily lives, isn't that what makes up our collective knowledge of anything and everything...? If I want to know something about Jippy Car, I come here...or go to your website...or others...or look it up in one of the books I might have on hand already. Bottom line is all of our learning comes from those who preceeded us...and their learning came from those who preceeded them...and so on.

I wouldn't let someone's misguided personal attack get to me...and it doesn't sound like you did...good for you!

Meanwhile...I will thank everyone who posts knowledge of all things Model A related - or just old car related. Without folks publishing their collective knowledge...no matter WHERE it originated...many of us would continue to roam in the darkness of ignorance.

Thanks guys...continue to post stuff you may have learned from someone else. If I didn't know it already...I had to learn it from one of you. And I hope someday to be able to pass along what I have learned from others.

...and screw the naysayers...

[V4F]

ya know what they say ...... jokem if they cant take a screw ! ...................... steve

[Tom Foster]

Originally Posted by Bruce Lancaster

There isn't anyone left alive with firsthand knowledge of Model A and B engineering and manufacuring changes. Ford's public offerings (parts books, bulletins, change orders, etc.) are not well organized, are not nearly complete enough to support detailed restoration, and in fact had purposes entirely different than ours. Ford was interested in function and to some extent updating...if you had dropped off a thoroughly thrashed 1928 A at a Ford dealer in 1932 and given the dealer a blank check to tear it down and rebuild, what emerged would sure have not been a restoration by modern lights.
ALL our information comes through others now (apologies if there are any 130 year old Ford engineers or plant managers here), and has to be extracted through nearly inaccessible paper and from studying ancient iron. Like Vince, I have been through gathering Ford paper over many years (not sure of the count, but I have '28-32 literature from at least 8 different countries now, ALL of it offering tiny bits of information not otherwise findable), fragments gathered from old non-Ford garage magazines, torn boxes with numbers, and a basement full not of just paper but of a sort of iron library. I have left quarts of blood in ancient rural junkyards over the years, and have lived on Ramen Noodles a few times when I found a unique but wildly expensive bit like a salesman's manual or obsolete bulletin page.
A lot of this stuff is only accessible to normal humans who would buy groceries before buying a service bulletin (the weak, the many, the normal!) through folks like Vince and Marco and the other hardcore researchers on here. I cannot imagine the work they put into getting their knowledge online...I can barely keep such stuff stacked neatly in my basement and don't even know how I would make it usable by the world.
These guys have thousands of dollars in ancient paper, years of contact with other researchers and piles of ancient iron, and they are publishing it for us to read FOR FREE. And people are complaining because their information from the untouchable past came from...gasp!...the PAST?
If you feel like that, go back to your cage full of bad parts and information from imbeciles and fling dung at the tourists.

Whoohooo! Hooray for you, Bruce, let 'em have it!

In case the Fordbarners aren't that familiar, Mr. Lancaster is regarded on the HAMB as The God Who Walks Among Us for his knowledge and willingness to help.

Fearless

[Jim Mason]

the offline attacks are the main reason I haven't update my site in some time. Also lack of time. I did take my site down for a short period, and got talked into putting it back up. (often wish I hadn't). I'm actually considering taking it down (the yearly fee is due soon). No this is NOT a request for support, advertisement, or an offer to have the site moved to someone else. Please don't take it that way. I also seldom post here or anywhere because of the flame mail. Vince, in the end you'll have to decide what to do. don't let people talk you in to or out of something...fwiw,jm

[joe plumber]

I wouldn't worry about it .Sounds like someone is jealous of your site .Keep on keeping on.

[Bruce Lancaster]

There are lots of attack lunatics in the Model A community, apparently, and a lot of real rancor. JM was shut down for a while, Ahooga was nearly destroyed when some of the best resources abandoned the place forever...whoinhell are these people, and why can't we just make them into gaskets or something?? Gett'em online and Ryan will likely ban them. HAMB is boisterous, but simply does not have the sort of stalker-type animosities that came up on the old Barn...that sort of thing leads to banishment, leaving the perps to amuse themselves by pulling the wings off of flies or something.

[peters180a/170b]

i checkout your website twice ... Sounds like i should of checked it out more often...

[Tom Wesenberg]

Sometimes the slimeballs slither out from under their rocks and think they can lift themselves up by pulling others down.

I've also had a couple of those type emails.

[Jim Huseby]

Vince - I like the way you expressed your intentions with all kinds of useful, technical and fun info on the 'barn. Coming in, I thought that those kinds of exchanges were the friendly, unthreatening general mode of communication on this site. Well, I got some hate mail on the old barn that took me for a loop, but I didn't see any possible outcome other than escalation by responding to it. It doesn't take long to discern personality types on this site, and I recognize the huge majority of barners are truly great people; smarter, wizer and more mature than me. There will always be miserable people; just smile and keep barning, please.

[Cool Hand Lurker]

Vince, I wish I could tell you how to stop the slammers. If you respond, then more come out of the woodwork and join in like a pack of dogs. It doesn't matter if they have never dealt with you or even been aware of your site. It is an illness of the weird and we have them in the Ford community, unfortunately.

It takes all kinds of good people to make a good forum, the knowledgeable and the searchers and the users. Otherwise there would be no need for the forum. Thanks for your site and your help.

[henry494]

OK Vince. Now with well over 50 responses patting you on the back and advising you to ignore the fools, can you get back to work on your excellent site and add more content? I can't really add to what all the others have said so well, but I couldn't help adding my two cents of support for what you and many others provide to us in your spare time, for free. There is no explanation for folls like that. I too have received some very colorful personal attacks, and for what? I never figured out where any of them were coming from.

One word of advice I would offer to you;

DELETE
(Hit that button a little faster next time)


Dave Lopes

[ford1]

hey vince, let ryan know who he is and i bet he will get banned, the most positive solution

[pdora]

Growing pains for the new FB. So far good order and civility are winning.

[hardtimes]

Originally Posted by pdora

Growing pains for the new FB. So far good order and civility are winning.

'Growing pains'..indeed! Bottom line is, this should not be recurring! Mabe more moderators? Mabe more power to moderators, if indicated? Mabe make it mandatory(RYAN) that a fellow Barner report such allegation immediately to you..for whatever action you decide necessary, if any!
At any rate, THANKS Ryan for this site....

[Chuck Kuntz]

I enjoy your site very much and find a lot of useful info there. Those that sent the attacks must be the same ones that go off on a rant when someone offers a response to a question that they don't agree with.