New guy to the Barn - 1929 Model A

[painterrick]

ENJOY and when you get to know these Model A guy's and their knowledge,soak it up.My dad is in his 80s very model A wise.I try to absorb all of his wisdom that I can.zzz model A s are the best of fun

[Al 29Tudor]

Hi Matt,
Would love to meet you and your dad. I'm in Venice, just bought my first model A in February and have done quit a but of mechanical work on it in 10 months. I lean toward chris, #10, at least change the oil SOON.
Maybe Jazzjr from Punta Gorda can get together also.
Will send a privat message if I can figure out how.
Best of luck - what a great project for you and your dad.
Al

[Gumpy]

HI Matt

nice to put a smile on Pop's face enjoy every moment with him!

[Christoph]

Welcome @the barn
Dont take your car apart too much.
Change fluids, drive it and keep your dad happy
Long distance greetings
Christoph

[kartknut36]

Congrats to you Matt, and to your Dad.
Enjoy the experience together !
My Dad and my Roadster are both 29's.
Life is good !

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

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Originally Posted by kartknut36

Congrats to you Matt, and to your Dad.
Enjoy the experience together !
My Dad and my Roadster are both 29's.
Life is good !

Geez! Matt,
A Model A in the woods, I'm HOMESICK! Car looks great, did you just wash it in the crick?? Chief & I would drive under the WPA bridge on Buzzard Creek to wash the car. Momma would sit in the back seat & feed us biscuit sandwiches & Ice tea out the window. She said she had "tender" feet! LIFE WAS GOOD, PO', BUT GOOD! Bill W.

[columbiA]

Matt-If you are going to keep the 16" wheels,get hubcaps for a 32 or 33 model B as they have the Ford script instead of V8 on them.If you let most of the air out of the spare it may fit in the side mount & carry a tire pump.Ive never liked SM,s,but the PU,s came with them.

[matt92vr4]

Hi guys, thanks for following this thread and all of your help! My dad and I got a few hours to work on the A last night. We had the gas tank off to clean out the rust on the inside. We reinstalled the tank and successfully feed nice clean gas to the carb. This led us to our next challenge, the bowl gasket was toast and dumping gas everywhere. No problem, my dad is going to either find or make a new gasket today.

When we bought the car, none of the lights or horn worked. We started looking into this last night and were able to manually work everything by supplying power and ground to each unit (original 2 wire horn sounds awesome!!). Anyways, I stumbled upon something strange to me! We have what looks to be a 12v positive ground system. I'm not sure exactly. I work on new japanese cars so this is certainly strange for me. I've been studying wiring diagrams all day but they are not exactly like the truck. The truck has a 1960'sish fuse block on the firewall that seems to be the grounds?? Why would grounds be fused? Is this normal?

I removed the light switch on the bottom of the steering column. It's old and greasy but it appears that it will work after I clean it up.

Question: Does this switch deliver 12v+ to the units, or does it complete the grounds to each unit? According to the wiring diagram it should receive the yellow wire from the relay. Mine does not.

Question: The diagram shows the negative battery terminal connected to the starter and then being distributed to the keyed junction box. I currently have the 12v+ hooked up like this. Do I need to connect the battery "backwards"?

Question: Why do I have fuses in my grounds???

AHH! Thank you for your help.

[columbiA]

If I were you, I would rip out all the old wiring & replace with the correct parts.You only need 3 harneses--The light,horn & brake harness #A-11647 for cars W-O cowl lamps,the gen or alt to terminal box wiring#A-11406A fabric loom & wires,or if fussy, wiring #A14406-B steel tubing & wires.The steel tubing has a tendency to crack at the bend & short out the wiring.The other harness you need is the terminal box to dash wiring. The light switch delivers voltage to the lights & all lights must be well grounded.I like to solder a ground wire near back end of bulb socket & run wire to lower hood hook screw for each head light.I also solder wires to socket wiring inside H L ,s & use bullet connectors behind rad shell. The short yellow wire on harness goes to horn,the blue-yellow tracer wire goes from horn to center terminal on L S disc.The horn is grounded when button is pushed to get the Ahooga sound. If you have a 12V alt it likely should be neg grd. To protect the wiring,I use a 30 amp breaker mounted on one side of the starter switch with the main wireto terminal box on one side & short wire to switch post on starter.An original A 6V gen will likely outlast you if properly rebuilt & if all grounds are kept clean,will be very trouble free.

[Mike V. Florida]

[matt92vr4]

Hello guys, thanks for the help. If it was my truck I'd certainly replace all of the harnesses with new ones however my dad is an 82 year old retired engineer who makes everything he owns lol. Thank you VERY much for the part numbers. I appreciate your time. Perhaps one day I will purchase these and slip them in when my dad is out of town! Until then...

Mike, that is the wiring diagram that I've been using. I think it is for a 6v positive ground setup?? Notice that the negative terminal is connected to the starter. I know the truck was originally positive ground but what I need to determine is whether or not it has been switched to negative ground. We've been using it as negative ground and have been able to start the engine and keep it running with no problem. I just thought it was strange that the fuses (see pic) were in-line with the negative grounds.

Also, there is/was no 12v+ going to the switch. On a 12v+ negative ground system, which power line needs to go to the switch? Currently the yellow wire that is suppose to go to the switch from the relay is actually running to the alternator.

If this is a 12v+ negative ground system, is it safe to run 12v+ to the old steering column switch? Thank you very much for your help!

-Matt

Also, the output from the alternator is not connected to anything. Should this be connected to the +starter cable?

[John LaVoy]

Welcome Matt, hope you get involved in the hobby and become a Model A owner too.

[Fred K-OR]

Wow! What a bunch of wires. I agree with the recommendations of replacing all this stuff. But you do need to try to let your Dad get involved. Maybe after a few blown fuses and burnt wires, he may see the "light". Merry Christmas and have fun with your Dad.

[matt92vr4]

Thanks guys. Worked on the a all day yesterday. The carb was leaking out of the bowl so my dad made a new gasket. Put it back together and the leak stopped but then the carb was puking large amounts of fuel while the engine was cranked. Took the carb back off and noticed the float was not making contact with the needle. Fortunately we have 2 extra carbs. We swapped floats with a good one and also cleaned all of the other internal parts. Put the carb back on and she started right up and ran great! We wanted to change the oil so I climbed under and removed the drain bolt. The sludge was so thick that the oil would not even drain out. After a couple minutes a very little amount was hanging out of the hole. It reminded me of a soft serve ice cream machine, chocolate flavor.

Time to drop the pan. Very easy. I think it took about 5 minutes. We had about 4 quarts of oil and one quart of sludge. It was discusting. Now we have that nice and clean. I have to order a new gasket.

After that we decided to work on the wiring. I determined that whoever did the 12 v conversion/rewire never actually finished because there was no way for any of the light or horn to receive power. The previous owner must have rriven it around with no lights! I have a plan to fix everything.

So we made a lot of progress. Couple more days should do It. where is the best place to buy a pan gasket? Thank, Matt

[Fred K-OR]

Originally Posted by matt92vr4

Thanks guys. Worked on the a all day yesterday. The carb was leaking out of the bowl so my dad made a new gasket. Put it back together and the leak stopped but then the carb was puking large amounts of fuel while the engine was cranked. Took the carb back off and noticed the float was not making contact with the needle. Fortunately we have 2 extra carbs. We swapped floats with a good one and also cleaned all of the other internal parts. Put the carb back on and she started right up and ran great! We wanted to change the oil so I climbed under and removed the drain bolt. The sludge was so thick that the oil would not even drain out. After a couple minutes a very little amount was hanging out of the hole. It reminded me of a soft serve ice cream machine, chocolate flavor.

Time to drop the pan. Very easy. I think it took about 5 minutes. We had about 4 quarts of oil and one quart of sludge. It was discusting. Now we have that nice and clean. I have to order a new gasket.

After that we decided to work on the wiring. I determined that whoever did the 12 v conversion/rewire never actually finished because there was no way for any of the light or horn to receive power. The previous owner must have rriven it around with no lights! I have a plan to fix everything.

So we made a lot of progress. Couple more days should do It. where is the best place to buy a pan gasket? Thank, Matt

Matt, pan gaskets I found come in two different kinds. The old cork ones and the newer kind that I am not sure what they are made of. I think it is a plastic of some kind. I don't have a lot of experience with gaskets but I prefer the cork ones. They seem to stay in place better.

You can get gaskets from just about any of the vendors and I think most of them carry both kinds of gaskets. Bratton's, Mac's, Bert's and others.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

PLEASE talk your Dad into goin' back to ALL stock looms, much simpler & you will have original wiring diagrams to refer to when needed. Bill Volt (Bill W.)

[Mike V. Florida]

Do you and Dad a favor and rip out all that junk witing and get the correct harnesses they are not that much money and you will save future time and trouble.
Mike, that is the wiring diagram that I've been using. I think it is for a 6v positive ground setup?? Notice that the negative terminal is connected to the starter. I know the truck was originally positive ground but what I need to determine is whether or not it has been switched to negative ground. We've been using it as negative ground and have been able to start the engine and keep it running with no problem.

http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/ignition/ig104.htm will help you with the polarity to the coil and plugs.

I just thought it was strange that the fuses (see pic) were in-line with the negative grounds.

You can use the diagram for either 6v or 12 v. You can also still use the wiring diagram with pos or negative ground as the only thing labled Pos and Neg is the battery. If you take the wiring to the amp meter literaly it has to be switched as well.

You can use it for the "standard" one wire Alt also as the wiring to the cut out or the one wire post on the alt is the same.


Also, there is/was no 12v+ going to the switch. On a 12v+ negative ground system, which power line needs to go to the switch? Currently the yellow wire that is suppose to go to the switch from the relay is actually running to the alternator.

Use the new harness and the diagram and you cant go wrong.

If this is a 12v+ negative ground system, is it safe to run 12v+ to the old steering column switch?

The 12 volts is actually kinder on the wires then the 6 volt, with the 12 volt there is less current than with the 6 volt.

[matt92vr4]

Thanks guys, new oil pan gasket ordered from MAC's along with some fabric wire loom, moto-meter, and dash light

[QGolden]

I envy you Matt, I lost my Dad this year, and his last 4 or 5 years were pretty dysfunctional for him. Enjoy every minute with this new adventure.

Quinn

[matt92vr4]

Dad and I worked on the A Saturday. We were able to get all of the electrical 100% functional! It's very cool to have the lights and horn all working on the original switches.

The old owner must have been driving around with no lights! The main switch did not have any power, and the tails were run to the stop light switch. It's nice to be able to get things straightened out. New oil pan gasket arrives tomorrow with the other goodies. If everything goes well we might be driving this thing around by the weekend. Thanks for all of your help.