Auction prices of antiques

[1930artdeco]

Unfortunately, this hobby is a disposable income hobby. But if prices keep coming down, then people (like me) who have the jobs and time on their side will do o.k. Now if we can manage to encourage other people to get into the hobby of restoration we will be sitting pretty.

Mike

[LukeDahlinger]

I had a full time restoration shop that I opened in 1999 and ran it until early 2009. Enjoyed the work a great deal but didn't enjoy the 80+ hr work weeks. I still build cars and do repair work but only as a sideline to my primary job. My field of specialty is pre 1970 cars & trucks of all makes, but always seemed to have a shop full of Model T's & A's and the occasional solid axle Corvette & old Harleys.

I will not put up the website name 1) I don't have a website 2) I have no agenda to solicit work thru this site by covert methods. 3) I come here for fun, not to use the forum as a brag fest.

[Terry, NJ]

Yes, I will opine, Sounds like a great idea! Go work in a machine shop for 6 months and learn everything you can, lathes and Bridgeports, Boyar Schulze, Brown and Sharpe, what have you. If you can, Go to a Fabrication shop and learn everyting from welding, Stick. MIG, and TIG to layouts, Iron workers, kick press, Press Brakes, shears. Learn the difference between Hot rolled steel (HRS) and cold rolled steel (CRS) tool steels. various types of Stainless. You then should go work in a body shop and see what goes on there. Get a job in a automotive Machine shop and see how things are done there.
Go to Schwalme's babbiting (On the Inet, Schwalmes,com) and read the story of Ora Landis. I've met him a few times and he can't be more 35 or 40 Y.O. Ora is one of the best in the business. He does mostly As and Ts but when I delivered my block to him, he had an "N" engine he was rebuilding. You know, Mod N, R, and S, all pre Mod T with a few Flathead V8s laying aound on stands. And cars that he was fixing. So yes, It can be done! Good Luck!
Terry

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

RcT,

I have given your idea of doing an antique auto repair business some serious thought. I have a great job now that provides some really good benefits (which we all know are very valuable) so my question is how much of a demand for that kind of business is there and is it sustainable? Again without getting into the politics of it, there are so many regualtions that a person needs to go through to get a business of this nature off the ground, epa, osha, dept. of labor ect..... so my question remains, is there enough work, demand and need for this type of service? Brent in TN is a great success story BUT he has an established business started many years ago.

Anyone wish to opine?

[modeleh]

I am in the same age bracket as Luke and the others and was also inflicted with the old car disease by my grandfather and his roadster.
I see lots of old cars listed for sale near my home, and many of them have been for sale for a long time, some for several years. People look at their stuff through rose tinted glasses. They think they have a goldmine on their hands because they drive through town and get some thumbs up and positive comments, but the harsh reality is, if you want more than 15 or 20 grand for your old car, unless it's a Shelby, it's gonna be a hard sell. Anyone with that kind of money already has a full garage. The young guys buy the project cars and put sweat equity into them. They are trying to buy a house, or feed a family, or buying gifts for all your friends who are getting married or having kids. Life can be pretty expensive for young people, and each year it seems a $20 bill just doesn't stretch as far.
My collection is small, at only 5 vehicles, but even if prices on stuff totally crashes, I would have a hard time finding more garage space. Property values are still high around here, anything more than an acre starts around 250K and goes up from there. By the time you get some garage space built, there's just not alot of money left to buy Model As with 20 grand price tags.
I don't hold the delusion that my old stuff will make me rich one day. I enjoy the old stuff and the story that each artifact has attached to it. If the resale value goes to zero, it wouldn't bother me one bit. It is still a better investment than a pint of beer at the pub.

[Jack '29 Sport Coupe]

Wow, great thread! I'll be 70 next month and was not aware that the younger guys are discriminated against-------that's sad. My club doesn't care a hoot how old you are, nor do they care if you even own an "A" or not. They do get a little testy if you want to chop or rod the car. I like hanging with anyone who likes antiques regardless of age. This is one hobby that can bridge all generations.


Jack

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

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Originally Posted by LukeDahlinger

I had a full time restoration shop that I opened in 1999 and ran it until early 2009. Enjoyed the work a great deal but didn't enjoy the 80+ hr work weeks. I still build cars and do repair work but only as a sideline to my primary job. My field of specialty is pre 1970 cars & trucks of all makes, but always seemed to have a shop full of Model T's & A's and the occasional solid axle Corvette & old Harleys.

I will not put up the website name 1) I don't have a website 2) I have no agenda to solicit work thru this site by covert methods. 3) I come here for fun, not to use the forum as a brag fest.

Luke, your comments in your last paragraph is full of "poison" and unappreciated. This is not the first time you have made unfounded and untruthful statements regarding others. Sir, you do not know why I, --or others come here nor do you actually know any of our motives. I believe back in April of this year you sent me a PM apologizing for your actions where you had insinuated the same thing and made derogatory comments here. I can forward your PM back to you if you like.

As for you "running" a restoration business, if you were putting in 80+ hours a week to run it, it sounds like the business was running you, ...or it was a poorly run business! I feel comfortable in assuring you that is not the 'norm' in any successful run restoration shop.

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

RcT,

I have given your idea of doing an antique auto repair business some serious thought. I have a great job now that provides some really good benefits (which we all know are very valuable) so my question is how much of a demand for that kind of business is there and is it sustainable? Again without getting into the politics of it, there are so many regualtions that a person needs to go through to get a business of this nature off the ground, epa, osha, dept. of labor ect..... so my question remains, is there enough work, demand and need for this type of service? Brent in TN is a great success story BUT he has an established business started many years ago.
Anyone wish to opine?

Seth, I would encourage you to start a restoration business however let me give you my take first. To start off with, fewer & fewer hobbyist can "restore" or work on their car themselves anymore. This same scenario rolls into all facets of life whether it is mowing the yard, changing the oil in your modern car, washing the dog, or ??. Therefore being able to be a 'Service' to someone who needs that service will always provide employment for you.

Now here is where the rubber is gonna meet the road. You are correct in that my business started many years ago. My business officially opened the doors in 1997 however I started learning my trade nearly 50 years ago when I was a child working beside my Dad in the garage as he restored his Model A's. While my Dad did not start my business, --nor has he ever had a financial stake in my business, he was my "business partner" from the onset because he educated me on what was correct/incorrect and what to look for during all those years. I took what knowledge he gave me and expounded on it through research and education. To me there is WAY more to doing restoration work than meets the general public's eye just because of the unseen experience that is necessary. Many shops install incorrect year parts on Model A's they are restoring because they don't know the differences, ...they incorrectly assemble the car, ...and they don't take a craftsmanship approach to doing the restoration. Since there are (and have been) plenty of those shops, my advice to you is know your business inside & out, and be the best at performing your craft before you start your business. And yes, all of the government regulations are there. Also, the business management part is crucial too. Leave anything in the last four sentences out and you will likely struggle.

The next thing is I LOVE my job and thoroughly enjoy going to work each day. My next advice is make sure you are truly passionate about your job because if you aren't, it will show in your product. If I wasn't passionate about what I do for a living, I wouldn't be here writing this or talking about Model A's on my day off. Yes, some might imply that I do it all to garner more business but if they truly knew how much time I spend talking on the phone, answering e-mails, and giving free advice simply because I enjoy helping fellow hobbyists with their Model A, they might see things differently.

The final thing is my business philosophy may be different than today's mindset but IMHO you need to own all of your tools and equipment necessary to perform your craft before you venture out into business. I did (--and do) own everything before I started into business. It took years to amass that stuff which delayed my start but I stuck to my goals during that time because of the dream I was chasing. I also studied each area of restoration and became what I felt was proficient at it before I started charging a fee for it. Like I said, times have changed where shops seemingly borrow money to buy all the equipment and then do "on-the-job-training" while the customer pays for it. To me, that is unethical but to some it is their operating procedure. Consider choosing your goals wisely and then work hard to impliment them. If you do it should bring you much happiness!! Good Luck to you sir!



Jeff, so as not to hi-jack your thread any longer, yes I think things in general might be a little 'soft' but good (i.e.: rare, NOS, etc.) stuff still seems to be fetching strong money. History has shown that the Economy is like a pendulum of a clock. It swings back and forth, over and over ...like clockwork. This same history shows that average prices for original Model A cars and parts are still higher than they were each decade before. What does that tell us to expect in 2111 for Model A's?

.

[BrianCT]

When it comes to cars and antiques,it is not the economy. It is the aging population and a shift in what people value. The antiques trade papers are all full of articles on 'How to interest the younger people' .
'You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.'

[Ryan]

Hey fellas... we don't do that name calling, fancy nancy, stuff here... Sorry.