Rebuilt Trans + Torque Tube, Groaning / Grinding On Deceleration

[cas3]

NOS lock washer is wonderful. I thing some of the new ones are too soft, and if you are not paying attention you can break the tang off while snugging up the nuts.

[Mart]

Glad you found the cause. For those interested, the noise on the overrun is generated by the helix on the gear teeth sucking the pinion is and making the mesh too tight. Under power the pinion is pushed away from the ring gear. Hopefully the vehicle was not driven enough to cause permanent damage to the gears.

[Terry,OH]

I agree with post #9 there is a big problem with the transmission. In your first photo of the transmission you can see the front blocker ring appears to be stuck on the input gear. There is very little distance between the brass ring and the gear syncro teeth. When you look at the square U-shaped opening in the perimeter of the blocker ring it appears to be worn sideways most likely from the transmission being forced into 3rd gear. While you have the rear out for repair is a great time to work on the transmission.

[left.covst]

Originally Posted by cas3

NOS lock washer is wonderful. I thing some of the new ones are too soft, and if you are not paying attention you can break the tang off while snugging up the nuts.

Originally Posted by Mart

Glad you found the cause. For those interested, the noise on the overrun is generated by the helix on the gear teeth sucking the pinion is and making the mesh too tight. Under power the pinion is pushed away from the ring gear. Hopefully the vehicle was not driven enough to cause permanent damage to the gears.

Good to know! Definitely drove it enough to cause damage.

Originally Posted by Terry,OH

I agree with post #9 there is a big problem with the transmission. In your first photo of the transmission you can see the front blocker ring appears to be stuck on the input gear. There is very little distance between the brass ring and the gear syncro teeth. When you look at the square U-shaped opening in the perimeter of the blocker ring it appears to be worn sideways most likely from the transmission being forced into 3rd gear. While you have the rear out for repair is a great time to work on the transmission.

Hey Terry - See post #10, the picture in post 9 had the input shaft loose from the case itself. In #10 I posted a picture of it re-assembled.

[Terry,OH]

I noticed the loose output shaft and the bearing out of position causing a lot of space but my comments are bout the condition of the Syncro blocker ring.

[left.covst]

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Originally Posted by Terry,OH

I noticed the loose output shaft and the bearing out of position causing a lot of space but my comments are bout the condition of the Syncro blocker ring.

Got it Terry - They did seem to be in good condition with only a slight wiggle within the syncro block itself. All was tight upon assembly. I think I will leave it for now as there was no shifting/syncro issue going into third and it'd pain me to resplit that fresh transmission.

Reviewing that image referenced, I think it's more of a glare off the main shaft making it look like it's more worn that it truly is. If I end up digging back in for a failed syncro I promise I'll owe ya a beer.

[left.covst]

Got the rear end apart today once my hub puller arrived. All came apart well, but I was surprised to find only one left-side gasket and nothing on the right. It never did leak, but I can't imagine it was setup correctly.

I was also surprised to find a 3.78 gear set (34/9). Not sure if this is original or not, though I expect it is not.

No major carnage, though it looks like the pinion pushed its' snout bearing back a bit, popping off the bottom rivet for its' sheet metal retainer. I'll need to get that re-attached.Anyone have experience re-attaching or replacing with a 3/16" rivet?

I'm waiting on the pinion puller to extract the pinion, its' accompanying bearings, and the double race out the front.

My plan was to replace the ring & pinion, carrier & pinion bearings, and the carrier & pinion bearing races.

Could I get away with reusing any of the originals if they inspect well?

I'll also replace all seals and setup the axle with the correct number of shim gaskets, the right backlash, and the proper pinion preload.

A video of the pinion gear teeth is linked here: https://share.icloud.com/photos/00eP...pZ0y44Qwwfyfxg

[left.covst]

The more I look things over, the more I think I might get away with re-using the ring & pinion and the carrier bearings and races. I'll wait to extract the double bearing race and pinion bearings to make a call on those.

While there is some very light pitting on the carrier races and the R&P, generally the bearings themselves all seem to be in good shape with little to no wear on the rollers or cages.

R&P teeth seem to have some wear but nothing dramatic, save for some tooth edge chipping on the center diameter..

What are y'all thoughts? Too far gone or run-able?

I guess I'd ultimately know for certain when I go to setup all the dimensions but would love some opinions.

[Mart]

If it were me I'd run them but with the proviso that I'd be prepared to rework it if it proved to be noisy. To be honest a couple of mine are a bit noisy and I don't plan on reworking them.
3.78 is a decent ratio. If they were 4.11s I'd say look for something better.

Mart.

[cas3]

I'd run them. When they're set up proper there should be no contact at the end anyway. That happened when it was run loose

[left.covst]

Originally Posted by Mart

If it were me I'd run them but with the proviso that I'd be prepared to rework it if it proved to be noisy. To be honest a couple of mine are a bit noisy and I don't plan on reworking them.
3.78 is a decent ratio. If they were 4.11s I'd say look for something better.

Mart.

Originally Posted by cas3

I'd run them. When they're set up proper there should be no contact at the end anyway. That happened when it was run loose

Thanks guys - I feel the same here. The actual wear surfaces look good. I got the pinion bearing race, pinion, and bearings out today.

Here's a video of how they look. Feeling fairly confident re-using them after a good cleaning. The thrust washer showed some significant wear so I plan to replace that.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/058F...R_-LbK46hqGWAg

So I'll end up reusing the pinion bearings and race, carrier bearings and races, the ring and pinion, as well as the axles and center section components. I actually have a feeling that the bearing retainer / shield rubbing against the pinion gear edge is what created most of the filings I saw in the fluid.

I still need to figure out how I'll rivet a replacement shield back in place, would love any suggestions you all may have.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by left.covst

Thanks guys - I feel the same here. The actual wear surfaces look good. I got the pinion bearing race, pinion, and bearings out today.

Here's a video of how they look. Feeling fairly confident re-using them after a good cleaning. The thrust washer showed some significant wear so I plan to replace that.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/058F...R_-LbK46hqGWAg

So I'll end up reusing the pinion bearings and race, carrier bearings and races, the ring and pinion, as well as the axles and center section components. I actually have a feeling that the bearing retainer / shield rubbing against the pinion gear edge is what created most of the filings I saw in the fluid.

I still need to figure out how I'll rivet a replacement shield back in place, would love any suggestions you all may have.

I don't believe those are rivets. My GUESS is that they are some form of a twisted-flute nail, similar in concept to that seen BELOW, although shorter. I've been wrong brfore. Nevertheless, you could always drill and tap for something like a #12 screw, or similar.

Coop

[left.covst]

Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN

I don't believe those are rivets. My GUESS is that they are some form of a twisted-flute nail, similar in concept to that seen BELOW, although shorter. I've been wrong brfore. Nevertheless, you could always drill and tap for something like a #12 screw, or similar.

Coop

Thanks Coop! I thought the same but they are in fact rivets, pushed in from the back and then peened over on the front. Here's the removed one attached.

I ordered some 3/16 x 5/8 pop rivets to see how those fit.

Just dropped the radius arms, torque tube, center section, axle bells, and the driveshaft off for blasting and powder coating today, hoping that all comes out nicely.

[ford38v8]

Originally Posted by left.covst

Thanks Coop! I thought the same but they are in fact rivets, pushed in from the back and then peened over on the front. Here's the removed one attached.

I ordered some 3/16 x 5/8 pop rivets to see how those fit.

Just dropped the radius arms, torque tube, center section, axle bells, and the driveshaft off for blasting and powder coating today, hoping that all comes out nicely.

Zach, Mask the gasket surfaces and interiors well. Nothing like a little sand in sensitive areas to ruin your day.

[left.covst]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

Zach, Mask the gasket surfaces and interiors well. Nothing like a little sand in sensitive areas to ruin your day.

I did my best to communicate the important ones to the powder coater, but honestly expect I'll need to do a ton of dressing/cleaning when I get the parts back.

It's a bummer but quality work isn't the most common around the bay area in general.

[ford38v8]

Originally Posted by left.covst

I did my best to communicate the important ones to the powder coater, but honestly expect I'll need to do a ton of dressing/cleaning when I get the parts back.

It's a bummer but quality work isn't the most common around the bay area in general.

It's not just cleaning, the blasting will destroy your gasket surfaces, and change critical dimensions.

[left.covst]

Got my parts back from coating, very happy with how everything came out. Masking was well done and it's all nice and clean.

I'm going to give everything a quick rinse to get out any blasting media and start re-assembly. I was able to get the bearing retaining plate reinstalled with some 3/16 x 1 rivets. I should've gone a bit shorter but they don't seem like they'll touch the pinion at all.

Looking forward to getting it all back together and on the road!!

[ford38v8]

Looks like your blaster didn't get the memo. Sorry about that.

[sugarmaker]

Zach,
Welcome to the content portion of the Ford Barn, your doing great with the pictures and updates on your work. I hope this comes out better than expected and wor4ks good and lasts a long time too. Wow the powder coated parts look good. I am not in any way a judge of rear end assemblies. So that I will leave to the experts here! I do like your truck! Very sharp! I would drive that!
Merry Christmas!
Regards,
Chris

[V8COOPMAN]

.

Make sure that when you do re-assemble the torque tube to the banjo housing that you get the drain-back hole in the housing (indicated by the pencil) lined back up with the slot in the rear flange of the torque tube,

Coop