The Ford Barn

Chuck Sea/Tac · 08-29-2017, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 100IH

Today's group 1 batteries don't fit the original type of battery tray as snugly as they should. When the battery slides around, the terminals can short to ground. Huge draw and then slide away -go open with a big arc. The hold downs are a poor fit as well. Metal hold downs also can short to ground. Pure havoc for sure. "V" shaped spacers in the diagonal corners can hold the case securely - good practice.

Good point. I have a chunk of hose to prevent the pedals from rubbing on the negative (hot) wire. Point is you can get shorts around the battery

Railcarmover · 08-29-2017, 03:39 PM

An unregulated alternator can spike up to 60v and provide amperage you can weld with...alternators are superior to generators for consistency in current and voltage,components like bulbs and motors last longer with an alternator power...till the rare event that the alternator is un regulated and "runs away"..

Benson · 08-29-2017, 03:55 PM

Maybe a battery wire came loose?

This sounds like what happens when Model A generator loses a battery cable.

https://www.familyhandyman.com/autom...ator/view-all/

Near picture of Fluke meter under heading: How to Test an Alternator with a voltmeter.

If you’re tempted to test an alternator by disconnecting the negative battery cable, don’t do it. A good alternator may indeed keep the engine running, but it was never a good test. In the pre-computer days, you could pull it off without damaging anything. Today, you risk frying every electrical device in your vehicle. The second you disconnect the battery, the voltage regulator pegs the alternator to put out maximum power. With no battery in the circuit to act as a buffer, the alternator can put out up to 150 volts, depending on engine rpm. When the smoke clears, that “simple test” could end up costing you several thousand dollars for new electronics.

I also saw it happen at the Hot Rod Hill Climb at Georgetown in 2016 ?? (Must have been 2015 or 2016 because I did not go 2014, the year that Paul Garrigan died. He had asked me to drive him up there but I had a previous commitment and he died in December)

Battery cable fell off battery 100 feet from starting line while revving uphill in second gear. Blue shiny Roadster.

Model A generator

Bang Bang Pow Pow Bang Bang. Black smoke and fire out tailpipe.

Points looked like they were hooked to a welder ... melted steel inside distributor ... totally destroyed points !!

Ed · 08-29-2017, 06:24 PM

Check behind the dash for bare wires or loose connections.

Kahuna · 08-30-2017, 11:11 PM

Re: Big bang, then dead engine
That happened to me as a kid. # 2 rod had exited the block.
Was a bad day for me

gtoger · 09-02-2017, 06:03 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

I thought I would post back with the results of a few days looking at it with a friend who is also extremely well-versed in Model A.

THE CAR IS RUNNING

We found that internal to the distributor, there was a dead short. It didn't happen all the time, just intermittently. And hence the fuse would then blow and if I was unlucky, some other stuff as well. Flasher relay. Brushes on the horn. Ugh.

Rebuilt the distributor, also got the carb nice and cleaned and adjusted, put a decent timing on and the thing runs like a top.

Have yet to get it on the road because I've only got about 1.5 gallons of gas in it and Texas has gone absolutely nuts with gasoline shortages as a result of Hurricane Harvey fallout. People are nuts, and I'm not going to be one of them sitting in a line for an hour to maybe or maybe not get some gasoline. So the road-test will have to wait.

Wanted to post that the alternator is not the problem. It's putting out plenty of charge, and volts are not excessive.

The ammeter needle now "dances" correctly when starting, and of course indicates charge or discharge. Before the rebuild on the distributor (right before "bang #2") the ammeter barely moved at all.

Now I'm ready for the great gas crisis of 2017 to be over so we can cruise a little!

Thank you for all the suggestions and advice!

1931 flamingo · 09-02-2017, 06:41 PM

Regular here just went to 2.859/gal ! ! !

Paul in CT

JDupuis · 09-02-2017, 07:53 PM

Glad to hear its running.
Gas price last week 1.03/litre
This week 1.30/litre and rising.
Jeff

08-29-2017, 03:39 PM	#22
Railcarmover BANNED Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Sacramento Posts: 1,262	Re: Big bang, then dead engine An unregulated alternator can spike up to 60v and provide amperage you can weld with...alternators are superior to generators for consistency in current and voltage,components like bulbs and motors last longer with an alternator power...till the rare event that the alternator is un regulated and "runs away"..

08-29-2017, 03:55 PM	#23
Benson Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Cen~Col - Central Highlands Posts: 2,757	Re: Big bang, then dead engine Maybe a battery wire came loose? This sounds like what happens when Model A generator loses a battery cable. https://www.familyhandyman.com/autom...ator/view-all/ Near picture of Fluke meter under heading: How to Test an Alternator with a voltmeter. If you’re tempted to test an alternator by disconnecting the negative battery cable, don’t do it. A good alternator may indeed keep the engine running, but it was never a good test. In the pre-computer days, you could pull it off without damaging anything. Today, you risk frying every electrical device in your vehicle. The second you disconnect the battery, the voltage regulator pegs the alternator to put out maximum power. With no battery in the circuit to act as a buffer, the alternator can put out up to 150 volts, depending on engine rpm. When the smoke clears, that “simple test” could end up costing you several thousand dollars for new electronics. I also saw it happen at the Hot Rod Hill Climb at Georgetown in 2016 ?? (Must have been 2015 or 2016 because I did not go 2014, the year that Paul Garrigan died. He had asked me to drive him up there but I had a previous commitment and he died in December) Battery cable fell off battery 100 feet from starting line while revving uphill in second gear. Blue shiny Roadster. Model A generator Bang Bang Pow Pow Bang Bang. Black smoke and fire out tailpipe. Points looked like they were hooked to a welder ... melted steel inside distributor ... totally destroyed points !! Last edited by Benson; 08-30-2017 at 04:12 PM.

08-29-2017, 06:24 PM	#24
Ed Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 88	Re: Big bang, then dead engine Check behind the dash for bare wires or loose connections.

08-30-2017, 11:11 PM	#25
Kahuna Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NorCal Posts: 2,617	Re: Big bang, then dead engine Re: Big bang, then dead engine That happened to me as a kid. # 2 rod had exited the block. Was a bad day for me

09-02-2017, 06:03 PM	#26
gtoger Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 11	Re: Big bang, then dead engine Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I thought I would post back with the results of a few days looking at it with a friend who is also extremely well-versed in Model A. THE CAR IS RUNNING We found that internal to the distributor, there was a dead short. It didn't happen all the time, just intermittently. And hence the fuse would then blow and if I was unlucky, some other stuff as well. Flasher relay. Brushes on the horn. Ugh. Rebuilt the distributor, also got the carb nice and cleaned and adjusted, put a decent timing on and the thing runs like a top. Have yet to get it on the road because I've only got about 1.5 gallons of gas in it and Texas has gone absolutely nuts with gasoline shortages as a result of Hurricane Harvey fallout. People are nuts, and I'm not going to be one of them sitting in a line for an hour to maybe or maybe not get some gasoline. So the road-test will have to wait. Wanted to post that the alternator is not the problem. It's putting out plenty of charge, and volts are not excessive. The ammeter needle now "dances" correctly when starting, and of course indicates charge or discharge. Before the rebuild on the distributor (right before "bang #2") the ammeter barely moved at all. Now I'm ready for the great gas crisis of 2017 to be over so we can cruise a little! Thank you for all the suggestions and advice! __________________ 1931 Ford Model A Tudor Deluxe "Bertie" 1930 Ford Model A Town Sedan "Bart"

09-02-2017, 06:41 PM	#27
1931 flamingo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new britain,ct 06052 Posts: 9,428	Re: Big bang, then dead engine Regular here just went to 2.859/gal ! ! ! Paul in CT

09-02-2017, 07:53 PM	#28
JDupuis Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Maryhill Ont Canada Posts: 834	Re: Big bang, then dead engine Glad to hear its running. Gas price last week 1.03/litre This week 1.30/litre and rising. Jeff __________________ Let's let pylons, be pylons!