The Ford Barn

Barber31 · 06-20-2014, 04:31 PM

Just bought the filter that "U's" back under the carb. Suppose to be hi flow filter. I haven't received it yet so I'll see how the fit and finish goes.

FrankWest · 06-20-2014, 04:34 PM

Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters.
Wasn't the first airfilter introduced on the v8?
I am so confused

Growley bear · 06-23-2014, 02:26 AM

Oil bath.

Werner · 05-04-2019, 06:21 AM

Hallo, I would like to ask again about the air-ballanced carburettor.

I suppose I've misunderstood that so far. I thought an air-balance carburetor would have a different underbody with an internal channel from the float chamber bore forward to the air intake (yellow ). I think now that's wrong.

Is that niw in the following right:
1) I close the hole (red) in the float chamber.
2) I file a 2/10 inch wide open channel between float chamber and venturi.

Then this is right for air-ballancing?

Thank you in advance.

eagle · 06-23-2014, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankWest

Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters.
Wasn't the first airfilter introduced on the v8?
I am so confused

When I say "Original" AirMaze filter, I mean an AirMaze that was bought by my grandfather back in the late 30's or maybe 40's. He never told me when he bought it but I do remember him saying it was necessary, in his mind, on gravel roads. It is an aftermarket item. He used it for many years, I use it now.

Jdubwikk · 07-22-2014, 09:30 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

The origional "Air-Maze" filter was used more as a flame arrestor in case of a backfire through the carb instead of as an air filter. If you think about the road conditions today compared to the conditions of the Model A era our air is much cleaner than then. Ford didn't deliver the car with an air filter and they ran fine. One of our club members had several problems with his car running rich and poorly. Once were were on the side of the road because the car stalled we took the filter off and it ran great the rest of the day and he hasn't put it back on since. I would save the money for the K&N and buy an original Air Maze if you want a "filter". Just an opinion is all. Good luck with your research on this one.

DougVieyra · 07-22-2014, 12:36 PM

FrankWest, post #20: "Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters. "
__________________________________________________ _______

Yes, Ford did design his new 'Improved Ford' with an engine 'air filter', to help keep out road dust and debris from getting into the carburetor. He had one on each side of the engine. Not sure what he called them back then, but today's 'A' Parts Supplier catalogs still carry them. Bratton's is part number 9960 (page 45 in their 2014 catalog); Snyder's carries these important dust filters as part number A-116, as listed on their page A 127 in their 2014 catalog; Bert's part number is A-6775-A. The cost is in line with the Ebay filter that was the subject of this (TDO's) original post (#1).

Ford's original design, besides helping to keep out road dust and debris out of the carburetor, also helped the engine run cooler. You really need to check out the original Ford-Designed dust filter / engine cooler, and if you don't have this item on your car you are really missing an important component that should be on your car.

I have used these original dust filters on all the Model A's I have driven over the last 50 years, and I can tell you - they really DO WORK ! However, I do recognize that IF you drive a lot on dirt / gravel roads, that an additional screening device for your carburetor would be advisable. I do use the Air-Maze 'add on' when driving the dirt roads on my ranch, for example, and too, I used a jury-rigged carb. filter hanging up high and attached to my rad. support rods, when I spent a month driving the dirt / gravel roads of Alaska thirty years ago; but for everyday driving on today's paved roads, I find that the Air-Maze is primarily just another 'dress-up' item to embellish the car.

I LIKE embellishments, so don't have a problem with using one - but I know that it really adds very little to actual function to the car. If you have the original designed Ford 'Dust Filter' as mentioned above on your car, most of today's drivers won't need an Air-Maze.

But many of the things we do with and to our cars is not about 'need' - but rather about 'want'. And I am the leader of the parade on that score ! So by all means , enjoy the Air-Maze.

Veger · 07-22-2014, 12:49 PM

I just LOVE the sound of my engine running with no filter on it at all its SO Model A!

Keep On Truckin'

Wrenchy61 · 08-04-2014, 04:53 PM

Car owners throw away the highly efficient pleated paper filter which is sized for twice the air flow requirement of the engine to allow for particle loading and replace it with a K&N low efficiency filter. Stupid is as stupid does!

The only benefit of a K&N is at the maximum rpm of an engine when the pumping loss of the engine is lowered. If anyone thinks this filter will benefit a Model A is sadly mistaken. A K&N filter application on a Model A tells me the owner knows nothing about engines.

Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies!

My Model A has an Air Maze with pleated paper. This filter offers protection against lubricating oil particulate which is extremely important because the standard Model A has no full flow or by pass filtration system for the lube oil.

160B · 08-04-2014, 08:24 PM

[QUOTE=Wrenchy61;922003]...Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies!..../QUOTE]

Could you help me understand your terminology, what is "the screen" on a K&N filter?

Thank you

JOES31 · 08-05-2014, 11:50 PM

[QUOTE=Wrenchy61;922003]Car owners throw away the highly efficient pleated paper filter which is sized for twice the air flow requirement of the engine to allow for particle loading and replace it with a K&N low efficiency filter. Stupid is as stupid does!

Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What the H???

If you can't see through the filter that means it's good?????

Compare the efficiency. Do it. 50 to 200 micron large particle test 90 to. 95% for a K&N filter. Any smaller than 50 microns is a non issue.

Obviously never worked on performance engines. A K&N is ideal for an A where you want as little restriction as possible.

mrraford · 08-05-2014, 10:12 AM

My what reactions to the simple air filter issue!
I have run one of these "above the carburetor" air filters on my pickup for several years. It works properly with no carburetion problems because the filter restricts airflow much less than the old paper filters sold for the other type.
It is pricey but it works very well. I would purchase another if my 68C was ready for the road.

Jerry in Shasta · 08-05-2014, 08:01 PM

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air?

As for running rich I set the fuel level about 1/16" lower.

JB

steve s · 08-05-2014, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry in Shasta

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air? ... JB

I guess engineers and accountants in Detroit (and Japan and Germany and Great Britain and Italy) must have determined early on that air-balancing carbs and using air filters is cheaper than a good set of engine pans!

Purdy Swoft · 08-05-2014, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry in Shasta

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air?

As for running rich I set the fuel level about 1/16" lower.

JB

If filters were so necessary for the model A, Why didn't Henry install them when they rolled off the assembly line and how have so many model A's survived over eighty years without them??? Model A's can't be compared to modern cars. What is very well necessary for modern cars isn't always necessary for the model A. Nobody said that you copuldn't use one if you choose.

Setting the float 1/16 lower is good to prevent stalling when coming to a stop but has nothing to do with actually running rich or lean.

Karl · 08-05-2014, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Purdy Swoft

If filters were so necessary for the model A, Why didn't Henry install them when they rolled off the assembly line and how have so many model A's survived over eighty years without them??? Model A's can't be compared to modern cars. What is very well necessary for modern cars isn't always necessary for the model A. Nobody said that you copuldn't use one if you choose.

Setting the float 1/16 lower is good to prevent stalling when coming to a stop but has nothing to do with actually running rich or lean.

Henry did and didn't do a lot of things. He was a genius but he wasn't always right. He did accept (slowly) that with progress there is a better way to do things hence the model T made way for the Model A and he did install air filters on the V8's. Yes there are a lot of 80 year old model A's that is indisputable. Most have been run without filters but the question is how many have never had the engine done . I suspect not many and precious few that have been driven extensively on dirt roads. Karl

GrandpasA · 08-06-2014, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry in Shasta

If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air?

As for running rich I set the fuel level about 1/16" lower.

JB

I'll try that on mine...

Bob Bidonde · 06-23-2014, 10:47 AM

An intake air filter is not a good idea because it:
> restricts breathing that results in a reduction of toque and power;
> enriches the air/ fuel mixture and fowls the spark plugs.

dlfrisch · 06-23-2014, 11:01 AM

I use the same K&N filter as senior member 160B

My theory: Keep the intake air clean. Seems to make common (cents).

gweilbaker · 06-23-2014, 11:45 AM

Just FYI:

Carburetors fall into two types, one the unbalanced type and the other a balanced type unit. In the bowl cover of the unbalanced type carburetor, is a hole drilled to a definite dimension. It is through this hole that air flows and exerts pressure, or pushes against the gasoline in the float bowl.

The air going through the air horn has no effect on the gasoline in the float bowl of the unbalanced type of carburetor. As a result, should the air filter on the carburetor be restricted with dirt, oil, or any foreign substance the air flow into the air horn would be slowed down or reduced in volume. When this happens, the carburetor not getting sufficient flow of air runs rich, because the pressure on the fuel in the float bowl remains the same as normal,.

In the balanced type of carburetor this cannot happen. The vent hole in the bowl cover is internal and the float chamber is vented by means of a tube into the air horn. If the flow of air into the air horn is restricted, by this internal venting, the pressure on the gasoline is also restricted. Consequently, the pressure in the air horn and the pressure in the float chamber are balanced.

06-23-2014, 02:26 AM	#3
Growley bear Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 777	Re: Air filter for Model A Oil bath.

07-22-2014, 09:30 AM	#6
Jdubwikk Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Moyock, NC Posts: 15	Re: Air filter for Model A Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) The origional "Air-Maze" filter was used more as a flame arrestor in case of a backfire through the carb instead of as an air filter. If you think about the road conditions today compared to the conditions of the Model A era our air is much cleaner than then. Ford didn't deliver the car with an air filter and they ran fine. One of our club members had several problems with his car running rich and poorly. Once were were on the side of the road because the car stalled we took the filter off and it ran great the rest of the day and he hasn't put it back on since. I would save the money for the K&N and buy an original Air Maze if you want a "filter". Just an opinion is all. Good luck with your research on this one.

07-22-2014, 12:36 PM	#7
DougVieyra Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Eureka, California Posts: 1,733	Re: Air filter for Model A FrankWest, post #20: "Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters. " __________________________________________________ _______ Yes, Ford did design his new 'Improved Ford' with an engine 'air filter', to help keep out road dust and debris from getting into the carburetor. He had one on each side of the engine. Not sure what he called them back then, but today's 'A' Parts Supplier catalogs still carry them. Bratton's is part number 9960 (page 45 in their 2014 catalog); Snyder's carries these important dust filters as part number A-116, as listed on their page A 127 in their 2014 catalog; Bert's part number is A-6775-A. The cost is in line with the Ebay filter that was the subject of this (TDO's) original post (#1). Ford's original design, besides helping to keep out road dust and debris out of the carburetor, also helped the engine run cooler. You really need to check out the original Ford-Designed dust filter / engine cooler, and if you don't have this item on your car you are really missing an important component that should be on your car. I have used these original dust filters on all the Model A's I have driven over the last 50 years, and I can tell you - they really DO WORK ! However, I do recognize that IF you drive a lot on dirt / gravel roads, that an additional screening device for your carburetor would be advisable. I do use the Air-Maze 'add on' when driving the dirt roads on my ranch, for example, and too, I used a jury-rigged carb. filter hanging up high and attached to my rad. support rods, when I spent a month driving the dirt / gravel roads of Alaska thirty years ago; but for everyday driving on today's paved roads, I find that the Air-Maze is primarily just another 'dress-up' item to embellish the car. I LIKE embellishments, so don't have a problem with using one - but I know that it really adds very little to actual function to the car. If you have the original designed Ford 'Dust Filter' as mentioned above on your car, most of today's drivers won't need an Air-Maze. But many of the things we do with and to our cars is not about 'need' - but rather about 'want'. And I am the leader of the parade on that score ! So by all means , enjoy the Air-Maze. Last edited by DougVieyra; 07-22-2014 at 01:23 PM. Reason: spelling errors

07-22-2014, 12:49 PM	#8
Veger Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Radcliff Kentucky Posts: 26	Re: Air filter for Model A I just LOVE the sound of my engine running with no filter on it at all its SO Model A! Keep On Truckin'

08-04-2014, 04:53 PM	#9
Wrenchy61 Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 21	Re: Air filter for Model A Car owners throw away the highly efficient pleated paper filter which is sized for twice the air flow requirement of the engine to allow for particle loading and replace it with a K&N low efficiency filter. Stupid is as stupid does! The only benefit of a K&N is at the maximum rpm of an engine when the pumping loss of the engine is lowered. If anyone thinks this filter will benefit a Model A is sadly mistaken. A K&N filter application on a Model A tells me the owner knows nothing about engines. Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies! My Model A has an Air Maze with pleated paper. This filter offers protection against lubricating oil particulate which is extremely important because the standard Model A has no full flow or by pass filtration system for the lube oil.

06-20-2014, 04:31 PM	#1
Barber31 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 687	Re: Air filter for Model A Just bought the filter that "U's" back under the carb. Suppose to be hi flow filter. I haven't received it yet so I'll see how the fit and finish goes.

06-20-2014, 04:34 PM	#2
FrankWest Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 3,157	Re: Air filter for Model A Out of the showroom I thought these 4 cylinder fords had no air filters. Wasn't the first airfilter introduced on the v8? I am so confused

08-04-2014, 08:24 PM	#10
160B Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Port Orchard, WA Posts: 1,498	Re: Air filter for Model A [QUOTE=Wrenchy61;922003]...Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies!..../QUOTE] Could you help me understand your terminology, what is "the screen" on a K&N filter? Thank you __________________ 1931 160B & 1931 68B If you don't have time to do it right the 1st time, how do you have time to do it the 2nd time?

08-05-2014, 11:50 PM	#11
JOES31 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: La Verne California Posts: 283	Re: Air filter for Model A [QUOTE=Wrenchy61;922003]Car owners throw away the highly efficient pleated paper filter which is sized for twice the air flow requirement of the engine to allow for particle loading and replace it with a K&N low efficiency filter. Stupid is as stupid does! Take a K&N filter without the screen, hold it up at eye level, peer through the filter, and watch white cars go by! If you don't believe me, compare the filtration efficiencies! ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What the H??? If you can't see through the filter that means it's good????? Compare the efficiency. Do it. 50 to 200 micron large particle test 90 to. 95% for a K&N filter. Any smaller than 50 microns is a non issue. Obviously never worked on performance engines. A K&N is ideal for an A where you want as little restriction as possible. Last edited by JOES31; 08-09-2014 at 05:41 PM.

08-05-2014, 10:12 AM	#12
mrraford Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 196	Re: Air filter for Model A My what reactions to the simple air filter issue! I have run one of these "above the carburetor" air filters on my pickup for several years. It works properly with no carburetion problems because the filter restricts airflow much less than the old paper filters sold for the other type. It is pricey but it works very well. I would purchase another if my 68C was ready for the road.

08-05-2014, 08:01 PM	#13
Jerry in Shasta Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: (Old)Shasta (Redding) CA Posts: 388	Re: Air filter for Model A If model A's do not need filters, why do all modern cars have them? Don't we all use the same dirty air? As for running rich I set the fuel level about 1/16" lower. JB

06-23-2014, 10:47 AM	#18
Bob Bidonde Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 4,112	Re: Air filter for Model A An intake air filter is not a good idea because it: > restricts breathing that results in a reduction of toque and power; > enriches the air/ fuel mixture and fowls the spark plugs. __________________ Bob Bidonde

06-23-2014, 11:01 AM	#19
dlfrisch Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Florida - 32128 Posts: 416	Re: Air filter for Model A I use the same K&N filter as senior member 160B My theory: Keep the intake air clean. Seems to make common (cents).

06-23-2014, 11:45 AM	#20
gweilbaker Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lindenhurst, IL Posts: 793	Re: Air filter for Model A Just FYI: Carburetors fall into two types, one the unbalanced type and the other a balanced type unit. In the bowl cover of the unbalanced type carburetor, is a hole drilled to a definite dimension. It is through this hole that air flows and exerts pressure, or pushes against the gasoline in the float bowl. The air going through the air horn has no effect on the gasoline in the float bowl of the unbalanced type of carburetor. As a result, should the air filter on the carburetor be restricted with dirt, oil, or any foreign substance the air flow into the air horn would be slowed down or reduced in volume. When this happens, the carburetor not getting sufficient flow of air runs rich, because the pressure on the fuel in the float bowl remains the same as normal,. In the balanced type of carburetor this cannot happen. The vent hole in the bowl cover is internal and the float chamber is vented by means of a tube into the air horn. If the flow of air into the air horn is restricted, by this internal venting, the pressure on the gasoline is also restricted. Consequently, the pressure in the air horn and the pressure in the float chamber are balanced.