Locating dimple on timing gear

[Jacksonlll]

I know it is easy to turn the engine over using the fan blade, but I think it is the wrong thing to do. The pulley was designed to drive the pump and generator, not the engine. If you break your pulley, you have a bigger problem.
If you damage the fan blade, that is a major safety problem. I always just rock the car in third gear. Just my opinion.

[J Franklin]

Originally Posted by Jacksonlll

I know it is easy to turn the engine over using the fan blade, but I think it is the wrong thing to do. The pulley was designed to drive the pump and generator, not the engine. If you break your pulley, you have a bigger problem.
If you damage the fan blade, that is a major safety problem. I always just rock the car in third gear. Just my opinion.

That is what I think also. It is very easy to turn the engine with the crank when the plugs are out.

[Nosetime]

My first car was an MG midget, engine was apart in a couple milk crates...I got it together and running at 15 years old. I've owned and worked on lots of stuff over the years and when I came to the Model A a couple years ago, I remember laughing at the simplicity. Why finding TDC is a problem, I find amusing. I guess the point is, we all bring a different set of skills and experience to the table.

[katy]

I guess the point is, we all bring a different set of skills and experience to the table.

Ditto

[erdaviesjr]

I tried all the above suggestions. I found that I was not able to turn the engine easily using the belt even with all the plugs removed. So, I continued to use the crank. I located the dimple before I loosened the rotor so I had a good idea where it should be by watching the rotor. I replaced the lower condenser with a modern upper plate from Nu Rex, and also changed the plugs. I'm still not sure the timing is in the exact right location, but it seems to be at TDC and the car is running really well through all speeds. No stuttering like it did before. Lots of pick up between 2nd and 3rd and I easily got the car up to 55 MPH on a 2 lane road near my house. i can't wait to take it out on the open road and she how she does. Thanks for all the suggestions!@

[katy]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Homemade crank nut wrench:

[30 Closed Cab PU]

I bought a crank wrench form a Model A part venor, is painted green I do not remember who I bought it from. The wrench handle hits the fan belt so is somewhat more difficult to use, so I take the fan belt off.

[wgmatt]

I had trouble finding the dimple also but bought this tool from Snyder's and now it's a breeze.

https://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/P...earchByKeyword

[erdaviesjr]

I'm going to get one! thanks!

[Patrick L.]

Set point opening [ .018-.022"/ preferred .020"]
Locate TDC with timing pin as you did, good.
Then use continuity meter or test light to set point opening by loosening and turning rotor. Make sure all shaft back-lash is removed when doing this.
It is important to do these procedures in correct order.

[30 Closed Cab PU]

Originally Posted by Patrick L.

Set point opening [ .018-.022"/ preferred .020"]
Locate TDC with timing pin as you did, good.
Then use continuity meter or test light to set point opening by loosening and turning rotor. Make sure all shaft back-lash is removed when doing this.
It is important to do these procedures in correct order.

Also make sure the spark advance lever is fully retarded (up) when setting the timing/points.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU

Also make sure the spark advance lever is fully retarded (up) when setting the timing/points.

If there's any chance the engine will be started the engine with the crank handle - ever, I time the engine with the lever a couple of notches down. I run a high compresssion (5.5:1) head so I don't need as much advance as Henry gave us so the slightly less advance this gives me is not a worry.
By doing this, when the lever is all the way up, the spark fires slightly AFTER TDC so there is NO chance of the crank handle kicking back.
Just my safety tip!

[Patrick L.]

Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU

Also make sure the spark advance lever is fully retarded (up) when setting the timing/points.

Ooopps, senior moment.

[100IH]

Everyone needs to learn a method that is always useful under all circumstances. That means don't rely on the distributor. On a new engine or just after head gasket the dist. has been out and needs to be re-installed in time with the camshaft position so one needs a method that does not rely on the rotor. If the rotor has not been moved, that's OK but often the thin washer underneath dist. cam can get lost leaving the cam able to migrate out of time with eveything else.

[30 Closed Cab PU]

Realize most errors in this post so am editing to prevent possible long strings.


I think I understand what is said below is in cases where there may have been an assembly error and the dimple no longer indicates TDC #1, or a new gear timing mark is incorrectly stamped, an alternate method may have to be used. If all is assembled correctly and parts are correct then no problem. Ideally all you should really have to check is points gap and points timing (at full retard) with the dimple indicating TDC #1.


From what I think I understand, since the distributor is fixed, and only the points plates move, rotor position should be a close indicator for #1 TDC if it is lined up with the #1 position on the dist. body.


So changing the points timing does not affect rotor position, bur rotor position affects points timing. So I do not understand below about points timing affecting rotor position.


Would appreciate comments if my understanding is incorrect.

Originally Posted by 100IH

Everyone needs to learn a method that is always useful under all circumstances. That means don't rely on the distributor. On a new engine or just after head gasket the dist. has been out and needs to be re-installed in time with the camshaft position so one needs a method that does not rely on the rotor. If the rotor has not been moved, that's OK but often the thin washer underneath dist. cam can get lost leaving the cam able to migrate out of time with eveything else.

[alexiskai]

Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU

So changing the points timing does not affect rotor position, bur rotor position affects points timing. So I do not understand below about points timing affecting rotor position.

I think all he's saying is that one needs to be practiced in a method of setting timing that doesn't rely on the rotor position to get you in the ballpark of TDC, because there are many scenarios in which the rotor gets disconnected from the camshaft or loses its precision over time.

[katy]

Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU

Realize most errors in this post so am editing to prevent possible long strings.


I think I understand what is said below is in cases where there may have been an assembly error and the dimple no longer indicates TDC #1, or a new gear timing mark is incorrectly stamped, an alternate method may have to be used. If all is assembled correctly and parts are correct then no problem. Ideally all you should really have to check is points gap and points timing (at full retard) with the dimple indicating TDC #1.


From what I think I understand, since the distributor is fixed, and only the points plates move, rotor position should be a close indicator for #1 TDC if it is lined up with the #1 position on the dist. body.


So changing the points timing does not affect rotor position, bur rotor position affects points timing. So I do not understand below about points timing affecting rotor position.


Would appreciate comments if my understanding is incorrect.

"I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
but, I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant." Author unknown.

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by 100IH

Everyone needs to learn a method that is always useful under all circumstances. That means don't rely on the distributor. On a new engine or just after head gasket the dist. has been out and needs to be re-installed in time with the camshaft position so one needs a method that does not rely on the rotor. If the rotor has not been moved, that's OK but often the thin washer underneath dist. cam can get lost leaving the cam able to migrate out of time with eveything else.

If the timing is correct in the first place , the distributor can be removed and replaced without needing to loosen and move the distributor cam as the timing will remain the same . If the distributor cam has been loosened and moved it will be necessary to reset the timing . When the timing pin drops into the dimple on the cam gear , loosen and adjust the distributor cam so that the trailing edge of the rotor tip points at the number one contact in the distributor cap with NO clockwise backlash . Anyone that doesn't understand this doesn't really know how to set the timing . Where the rotor tip points is MOST important . Points gap also matters because the spark happens when the points begin to open . This is one reason it is important to pay attention to the points gap when attempting to set the timing . A person MUST also pay attention to the distributor and where the rotor tip POINTS if they expect the engine to run at all .

[30 Closed Cab PU]

Deleted/edited my post above, got confused with what I thought I knew, and was off on a tangent.

[Forddan]

I think my question is more or less on the topic.

I want to have a backup distributor. If I time a distributor and take it out to have it as backup:

Will keep the timing ?

Thanks