Strange stuff inside engine??????

[kenparker]

In disassembling and engine this morning I found some odd stuff I have never seen before. Can someone identify the "what" and "Why"?????

The first picture shows the four intake valves and the extra spring around each one. The large spring below the guide closes the valve, but what does the small spring above the valve guide do and why? At the bottom of one of the small springs you can see some kind of rope packing material. ????? The "Ring" around the base of the valve guide is a spacer to give the large spring more tension.

Picture 2 shows someones attempt to replace the Oil Drain Tubre. It was stuffed all the way to the bottom of the Cap drain tube sealing it from draining anything. Sombody messed up.

Thrid picture shows the Rod Cap Nut with its "different" lock nut instead of cotter key. Three rods had this style nut nad number 4 rod has cotter key. ODD.

[Bruce Lancaster]

The extra stuff on valves is some sort of added sealing system, presumably to stop oil from getting past the valve stems. Probably aftermarket accessory, possibly home-improvised, certainly a kludge for fixing worn parts.

[Gerard]

The foto from picture 3 shows a locknut on top of the regular nut. This locknut type is often used in aircraft altough never in a aircraft engine .
Bruce answerred the valve spring question spot on.

[Tom Wesenberg]

The only thing I can see that small extra spring doing is blocking the intake flow. I've never heard of such a bogus thing before. That drain tube is also bogus, because it isn't bent forward and doesn't look long enough to set in the oil.

Did that flywheel come off this engine? It looks like it sat in a damp shed on the dirt floor for years. I bought a multiplate flywheel once that looked as bad, but after sandblasting it looked NOS with no wear in the splines. The tin lock nuts are like what Chevy used for years.

[700rpm]

It would be interesting to know the history of owners on this engine.

[Milton]

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1 - Bruce got it.

2 - Not that uncommon.

3 - Somebody worried more about torque readings than cotter pin alignment.

[Bruce Lancaster]

On the valve spring shims, the washers shimming the original springs, only reasonable interpretation is an attempt to increase spring pressure. On long, light pressure springs like Model A the effect was likely minimal with a thin shim like that...but worry about the why! One excellent way to lose spring pressure is to thoroughly overheat the engine, and maybe something like that happened to cause the owner to seek more pressure.

[Russ/40]

The upper spring was a system used in the 60's, and maybe earlier, on flathead V8's as an oil seal when not replacing guides. They were used inside the main spring and cupped a seal against the bottom of the V8 guide. The actual seal material was a graphite like collar.

[kenparker]

Mo Info... The seal material Russ refers to is a rope looking stuff with what looks and feels like graphite.

The washers shimming the original springs is used to increase spring pressure. I use them (.030 thick) in my speedster enging to keep valves from floating. In the Miss E the original spring pressure was approx 40#'s. With the washers in place the spring pressure went up to approx 55#'s. We will see how they work in Greenville, Tn at the end of September.---Greenville 2011 Model A Rally and Hillclimb. Ya'll Come.

[brianthelion02]

Uh-oh,secrets of speed coming out!!LOL

[hardtimes]

Ken,
I had an original Cragar OHV head that had 'dual' springs(smaller inside larger) AND washers on it when tore down. Machinist did away with all that by installing proper Isky springs. He said that it appeared that a 'racer' had done these 'improvements' back when... for racing.
As for the 'lock' nuts that are on top of regular rod nuts, I have found those same style lock nuts on V8-60 ford flatheads, that I've disassembled.

[ldj1002]

Those lock nuts are called palnut and yes some aircraft engines used them inside.

[James Rogers]

Ken, the lock nuts are the same as what Ford used in the flathead V8 to lock the rod nuts. I am rebuilding an unmolested 1951 8BA that had these. Looks like the last builder was a V8 flathead builder because of the palnuts and the valve seals.

[LukeDahlinger]

I've gone thru many a flathead and Y-block Ford motor with those palnuts. the 6cyl motors used them as well.

[Flathead]

I remember seeing ads for those spring loaded intake stem seals, maybe J.C. Whitney?? A long time ago now.

[b ramsey]

pal nuts arent my pals.