Purchase Advise: 1930 Model A Tudor

[JamesAC]

Glad you got the car, vespaholic. I found a 1930 deluxe coupe last year the elderly previous owner had spent several years doing a nice off-frame body restoration (gave it up due to health and other issues) and the owner previous to him had rebuilt the engine very nicely. Only thing the car lacked was the entire front end, brakes, and steering to be rebuilt and the interior done. Spent a year doing that and just put it on the road in recent weeks. The purchase was a perfect "fit" for me as I like brakes, front end, ignition, carburetors, exhaust, top-end engine work, and interior repairs and finishing, but don't have the set up for paint and body and bottom-end engine work.

I guess everyone has something that fits what they can do and feel comfortable with and that determines how they'll look at a given potential purchase, just as you looked at yours. For example, I couldn't conceive of spending $2000 to have brakes done as I did all mine myself for far less in the cost of new parts and some long winter nights spent out in the garage playing with my new toy.

And don't be afraid of getting into your carburetor. Again, from my growing up on the farm and rebuilding dozens of old tractor and 1950's to 1960's era truck and car carburetors, the carburetors on these old cars are really simple. An inexpensive rebuild kit and some fun time taking the easily disassembled thing off the car and cleaning and putting it back together will reward you with years of good service not to speak of the satisfaction of having done it yourself. And the adjustments are so easy, just an idle mixture and idle speed screws you turn to make the engine idle smoothly at the speed you want is all there is. It's fun to actually get to adjust something just the way you want compared to today's fixed fuel injection systems all controlled out of some black box hidden under all that stuff under the hood.

Best of luck with your new project.

[vespaholic]

Thanks all!
I think I'm OK with how the motor is running for the time being.
I could find no air leaks around the carb or intake manifold.
I sprayed starter fluid, carb cleaner and finally tried a propane tank to look for air being sucked in and found nothing, which is good!
I have MMO in the gas and it seems to run a little better each time I run it.
I'll search the forum for GAV.
If a 1/4 turn is reasonable then I'm not going to screw around with it.
So, I'm turning my attention to safety related stuff:
This weekend I'm making the bracket to relocate the seat 6" back so I can fit.
Then I'll be measuring and ordering seat belts for the front and rear.
I'm also going to put it up on jack stands and pull all the wheels and tires in preparation for getting my new-to-me wheels and tires next week.
While the wheels are off I'm going to check out the brakes and see what my next steps are with them.
The car drives but in my book it's way more important that the car stops! : )
It actually stops fairly well right now so I'm interested in seeing what the dealer thought was wrong.
Maybe they were being overly cautious.

[JamesAC]

Yes, agreed about brakes. You can get a lot of sympathy and interest from on-lookers and others while trying to tinker with a car that won't start or something, but little sympathy for damage done from not being able to stop it. Think of it in this priority--it's nice if they run and great when they look good doing it, but the one thing they HAVE to do is STOP.

[vespaholic]

I moved the seat back 6" using stuff I had laying around the garage.
It came out nicely and does not look bad at all.
Plus I designed in the ability to tilt the front of the seat up a little if I want.

The car runs and starts better and better every day.
The 1/4 turn of the choke knob is no longer required.
I guess the MMO is making it's way through the system and doing it's job.
It idles smooth and does not bog when I rev or hold at a higher rpm.

BUT…...I am now getting a knock from the engine or transmission.
Frankly I can not tell where.
I read a ton of threads on this forum about engine knocks and grounding out spark plugs to isolate a bad issue inside the engine.
No matter what single or combo spark plug I ground out makes absolutely no change in the knock.
The only way I can facilitate a slight difference in the knocking sound is by depressing the clutch.
I think I'll pull the starter and check for a loose flywheel tomorrow.
If that's not it I'll check for a loose or damaged timing gear.
After that……back to reading.

HAPPY THANKSGIVING!

[Mitch//pa]

You might have excessive crankshaft end play if pushing the clutch changes it. Push the crank back with the crank handle, then push in the clutch to measure the play

[vespaholic]

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@Mitch: OK I'll try that.
The car did not come with a hand crank.
Is there something else you could suggest I try for this test?
Also, if it has play, what can I do about it?

@Greg: Thanks.
The interior is not bad at all.
I'm pleased.

[40 Deluxe]

check for crankshaft play while you have the starter out checking the flywheel. You can feel the difference between a loose 'wheel and crank play.

[vespaholic]

@ Mitch and 40Deluxe:
You hit the nail on the head.
It was quite obvious that the flywheel is firmly on the crank.
The crank does have some play +/- 1/8" of play.
While the starter was out I gently pushed the flywheel and crank forward with a pry bar then put everything back together.
The knocking went away.
However as I ran the car for about 20 minutes it was starting to come back.
I need to drop the oil pan to change the gasket.
Can this be fixed while I've got it open or is this a major issue??
Thanks in advance!

[vespaholic]

Repacked all the wheel bearings today and checked out the brake shoes while I was in there.
I don't get why the dealer said it needed new brakes, the shoes looked ok.
There is a little binding on the left rear.
Seems like the spring that joins the 2 shoes together towards the rear of the car, is not putting enough tension.

I also looked at the lights issue and it turned out that the "cup" at the end of the steering column was not pushed up high enough.

I'm still very concerned about the crank play.
Any thoughts?

Thanks

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Vespa, maybe try a post on the AACA forum, not exclusively Model A but a lot of knowledge there as well.

[vespaholic]

@ Steve:
Yeah..I guess I'll give the AACA Forum a shot.
I thought here would be better because it's a Model A -specific forum.
As much as I want this back on the road I don't want to drive it until I figure out how to get rid of that crank play knock.
Thanks

[Mitch//pa]

i'm in Mexico so i have limited internet access
here is a quick search using "crankshaft endplay" many threads show up::::
the end result is redoing the bottom end but at that point i would do a complete rebuild

http://fordbarn.com/forum/showthread...shaft+end+play

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by Mitch//pa

i'm in Mexico so i have limited internet access

Bet is sure beats the weather back home!

[Mitch//pa]

usually an oil leak also developes out the rear main with excessive thrust clearance

[vespaholic]

@Mitch:
Enjoy Mexico and thanks for reaching out!
Yes I have a rear seal oil leak as well.
I guess I'll drop the pan and sees what I find.
Do you think that snugging up the bearing caps would do any harm?

The car came with the original motor so I guess I'll call Schwalm's tomorrow.

PS: I was searching "crank end play". I got much better results searching "crankshaft endplay". Thanks for the tip.

[Mitch//pa]

in dont see any harm but most likely when you start dropping caps it will stay apart pending a rebuild... another place i recommend is http://www.antiqueenginerebuilding.com
even though schwalms is very close to us Rich has very reasonable shipping options. i use his insert engines, have been very happy with the product. he makes the insert rods that gets sold to all the suppliers and rebuilders..personally i wont do another babbitt motor to many variables involved...
off to the beach::::

[vespaholic]

I'll reach out to Rich tomorrow.
Thanks!
Enjoy the beach!

[Tony Martino]

Man Ain't the Barn amazing!
Bet you never thought you'd get so much help!
See you Thursday!
BTW why do you think they call them Bangers!

[vespaholic]

@Tony: See You Thursday!
Yup…lots of help.
And, it's all appreciated.

[vespaholic]

OK, now I feel a little stupid.

I pulled out the floor mat & wood floor and opened the clutch inspection plate on the top of the bell housing.

It appears that my phantom noise is coming from someplace down there and not from the engine…..thank goodness!

When I mash the clutch as far down as it will go the sound diminishes a fair amount.

When I put it in gear and let the clutch out (BTW: The car is on 4 jack stands) I can feather the RPMs and almost get the sound to go away.

I'm thinking that the issue is somewhere from the flywheel back.

Any suggestions on where to start or what terms to search here for advice???

Also, when I was under the car I noticed that a cotter pin (or something that looks like a cotter pin) is hanging out of the bottom hole in the bell housing towards the motor.

As always…..thanks!