The Ford Barn

oneoldtruckguy · 08-23-2015, 05:30 PM

In the other post I just put on I am talking about a 3 speed side loader. I power washed this tranny and then opened it up. What I found was all VERY VERY nice gears. Great Condition tranny!!! My problem is the gears have a different number of gears than my 3 speed top loader. My question is Can You install gears with a different number of teeth in my top loader if all the gears are changed. Hope that's not too stupid of a question. Thanks Fordbarners

Ken/Alabama · 08-23-2015, 05:48 PM

Year??

oneoldtruckguy · 08-23-2015, 05:52 PM

Truck is a 50 and tranny is out of a 40 pickup. I have no idea what year the side loader is other than it had a open drive shaft bearing retainer.

39topless · 08-23-2015, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oneoldtruckguy

In the other post I just put on I am talking about a 3 speed side loader. I power washed this tranny and then opened it up. What I found was all VERY VERY nice gears. Great Condition tranny!!! My problem is the gears have a different number of gears than my 3 speed top loader. My question is Can You install gears with a different number of teeth in my top loader if all the gears are changed. Hope that's not too stupid of a question. Thanks Fordbarners

The only stupid question is the one not asked. I ask a lot of them. Sorry, I can only answer your question with a stupid answer. You don't want that.

JM 35 Sedan · 08-23-2015, 06:12 PM

If you could give us a tooth count on the cluster gear and main drive gear for each transmission we could give you some idea of the gear sets you have. Some of the gears and the main shaft from a closed drive 3 speed side load passenger car transmission will not work in an open drive 3 speed PU top load transmission. Mac VanPelts website http://www.vanpeltsales.com/ will answer many of your questions and his book is a must have if you plan to work on these transmissions yourself.

V8COOPMAN · 08-23-2015, 06:42 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

If you have a COMPLETE 3-speed gearset out of a closed drive, side shift case, that COMPLETE gearset will swap into a '40 pick-up, top shift 3-speed case.

The picture below shows the only different parts required to change a CLOSED drive box to an OPEN drive. Does this help ya figure it out? DD

russcc · 08-23-2015, 07:09 PM

The typical main drive gear and cluster gear combinations that work together are 15 teeth on the main, and 29 on the cluster, or 16 on the main and 28 on the cluster. On the cluster the teeth you count are the ones directly under the main shaft. The rest of the issues were covered by the other posts. Macs book is key to understanding all the variants, along with how to do it.

cas3 · 08-23-2015, 09:17 PM

many folks like to use the gears out of the 42-48 side shift trannys in the top loader 3 speeds. reason is, they have a more usable ratio than the early gear sets with very low first and second gears, then a big jump to 3rd. example, when driving my model A ,i very rarely use first gear unless starting on a hill. by the 40's roads had improved and taller gears were acceptable. as v8 said, you must use the whole set from the side shift, and as others said, look at vanpelts web site to learn all about it

skidmarks · 08-23-2015, 09:38 PM

And when you end up with a pile of parts from all the transmissions you have taken apart in a pile on the bench . Juat remember the number 44

George/Maine · 08-23-2015, 10:40 PM

I'm working on about same thing. I have a 47 trans with teeth gone.
I had a pu trans with same gears open drive.
The cluster was same number teeth.
I used cluster and main input shaft and 1st gear out of pu trans
I just swapped out the rear shaft and reused the enclosed motor mount.
This trans was rebuilt and was having lot of slop in leakage and popping clutch thinking it was in neutral.
Note when I removed the trans someone didn't put the bolt in to hold it the Ujoint on.
The rear shaft was moving about 1/4" and caused me to take some of the teeth out of cluster. New car to me guy paid $3000 the rebuild trans and labor.
As they say reverse assemble waiting on new clutch and pressure plate.
I changed over to floor shift

V8COOPMAN · 08-24-2015, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skidmarks

And when you end up with a pile of parts from all the transmissions you have taken apart in a pile on the bench . Juat remember the number 44

skidmarks does mention one very important point that I forgot......44.

44 is ALWAYS the TOTAL number of teeth (of a PROPERLY-matched set) when you add together the number of teeth on the input shaft, along with the number of teeth on the corresponding front gear on the cluster. If the total number of teeth on the two, meshing gears does not equal 44, the trans will self-destruct the first time the engine tries to turn the input shaft. Count carefully! DD

Hoop · 08-24-2015, 09:27 AM

The "Rule of 44" always applies unless ... the "Rule of 43" applies.

Check part numbers 67-7017 and 11Y-7017. Both mate to 67-7113-A.

Yes, I've run into a set.

08-23-2015, 05:30 PM	#1
oneoldtruckguy Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Bozeman, Montana Posts: 56	3 speed toploader gear question In the other post I just put on I am talking about a 3 speed side loader. I power washed this tranny and then opened it up. What I found was all VERY VERY nice gears. Great Condition tranny!!! My problem is the gears have a different number of gears than my 3 speed top loader. My question is Can You install gears with a different number of teeth in my top loader if all the gears are changed. Hope that's not too stupid of a question. Thanks Fordbarners

08-23-2015, 05:48 PM	#2
Ken/Alabama Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Alabama Posts: 3,394	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question Year??

08-23-2015, 05:52 PM	#3
oneoldtruckguy Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Bozeman, Montana Posts: 56	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question Truck is a 50 and tranny is out of a 40 pickup. I have no idea what year the side loader is other than it had a open drive shaft bearing retainer.

08-23-2015, 06:12 PM	#5
JM 35 Sedan Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Near Rising Sun, Maryland Posts: 10,876	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question If you could give us a tooth count on the cluster gear and main drive gear for each transmission we could give you some idea of the gear sets you have. Some of the gears and the main shaft from a closed drive 3 speed side load passenger car transmission will not work in an open drive 3 speed PU top load transmission. Mac VanPelts website http://www.vanpeltsales.com/ will answer many of your questions and his book is a must have if you plan to work on these transmissions yourself. __________________ *John* *"Never give up on what you really want to do. The person with big dreams is more powerful than one with all the facts". Albert Einstein*

08-23-2015, 06:42 PM	#6
V8COOPMAN Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: East Shore of LAKE HOUSTON Posts: 11,184	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) If you have a COMPLETE 3-speed gearset out of a closed drive, side shift case, that COMPLETE gearset will swap into a '40 pick-up, top shift 3-speed case. The picture below shows the only different parts required to change a CLOSED drive box to an OPEN drive. Does this help ya figure it out? DD __________________ *Click Links Below* __ ▼ *'35-'36 W/8BA & MECHANICAL FAN* *T5 W/TORQUE TUBE*

08-23-2015, 07:09 PM	#7
russcc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,871	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question The typical main drive gear and cluster gear combinations that work together are 15 teeth on the main, and 29 on the cluster, or 16 on the main and 28 on the cluster. On the cluster the teeth you count are the ones directly under the main shaft. The rest of the issues were covered by the other posts. Macs book is key to understanding all the variants, along with how to do it.

08-23-2015, 09:17 PM	#8
cas3 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Beverly Kansas Posts: 5,299	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question many folks like to use the gears out of the 42-48 side shift trannys in the top loader 3 speeds. reason is, they have a more usable ratio than the early gear sets with very low first and second gears, then a big jump to 3rd. example, when driving my model A ,i very rarely use first gear unless starting on a hill. by the 40's roads had improved and taller gears were acceptable. as v8 said, you must use the whole set from the side shift, and as others said, look at vanpelts web site to learn all about it

08-23-2015, 09:38 PM	#9
skidmarks Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: newark, delaware Posts: 3,780	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question And when you end up with a pile of parts from all the transmissions you have taken apart in a pile on the bench . Juat remember the number 44

08-23-2015, 10:40 PM	#10
George/Maine Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mid coast Maine Posts: 1,878	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question I'm working on about same thing. I have a 47 trans with teeth gone. I had a pu trans with same gears open drive. The cluster was same number teeth. I used cluster and main input shaft and 1st gear out of pu trans I just swapped out the rear shaft and reused the enclosed motor mount. This trans was rebuilt and was having lot of slop in leakage and popping clutch thinking it was in neutral. Note when I removed the trans someone didn't put the bolt in to hold it the Ujoint on. The rear shaft was moving about 1/4" and caused me to take some of the teeth out of cluster. New car to me guy paid $3000 the rebuild trans and labor. As they say reverse assemble waiting on new clutch and pressure plate. I changed over to floor shift

08-24-2015, 09:27 AM	#12
Hoop Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Jacksonville FL Posts: 1,137	Re: 3 speed toploader gear question The "Rule of 44" always applies unless ... the "Rule of 43" applies. Check part numbers 67-7017 and 11Y-7017. Both mate to 67-7113-A. Yes, I've run into a set. __________________ "Remember that when it comes to intelligence, half of all of us are below average."