Question for carb experts

[Herman Munster]

Does anyone know if it's possible to convert the early type Autolite 4100 to use a the later model accelerator pump. The older type uses a longer accelerator pump and the latter a shorter type.
The longer one gets in the way of the water heater valve on intake manifold which I have relocated elsewhere for now. I'd like to keep the stock location which is why I was wondering it's possible to convert the carb.

[scicala]

There are actually three different thicknesses of accel pump covers. Your's pictured is '57 only (first year of the 4100). The second carb pictured has a pump cover used from '58 thru approx. '63 or '64 (shorter than the '57 style). The third style from '64 and up is the shortest of the three styles.
Shouldn't be a problem converting to either of the other shorter styles. You will need the newer accel pump diaphragm (#59) available at auto parts stores, and a shorter pump rod that goes from the throttle lever to the pump lever. The return spring (#60) should be useable from the early carb.
Of course you will also need to find the shorter diaphragm cover of your choice.

Or get a later 4100 if you want more airflow. The '57 Autolite 4100 has tiny ventui's and may flow about 400 CFM.

Sal

[willowbilly3]

Is the newer accel. pump diaphragm going to work on the earlier check ball type carb> Just wondering.

[scicala]

Originally Posted by willowbilly3

Is the newer accel. pump diaphragm going to work on the earlier check ball type carb> Just wondering.

Yes it will. That check ball version went to approx. 1964. After that they changed the design to a rubber flapper check valve instead of the steel ball. The diaphragms will work all the way till the end of production on 4100, 2100 and 2150 Autolite carbs.

Sal

[rotorwrench]

My problems with those was keeping the vacuum diaphragm working on the secondary. I had a lot of troubles with those.

[Herman Munster]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Sal, the carb I have is a 57 4100. I was just looking for a 4100 with 1.08 venturies for my 56 292 when I got my B manifold and got this carb purely by chance. I didn't want to over-carb the 292. I also like the simplicity of the Autolite.
Thanks for the info Sal.

[deucemac]

You should be able to use a pump body and arm, return spring, do and arm, and elastomer valve from a later 4100 or 2100 2bbl. Without any problem. Just make sure all the parts come from the same donor carb.

[scicala]

Herman, if you are not going to use the '57 4100, and are looking for a 1.08" 4100,
"Streatdreams" on Ford Barn just sold one in the "Swap Meet" section, but said he is going to post more. Might want to send him a PM if you are looking for one. I have a rough one, but it's a 1.12" from a '64 T-Bird (600 CFM). Has internal water damage.

Sal

[Herman Munster]

I have used it but have it off along with the intake right now. The choke heat tube inside the manifold is bad so I have replace it. The carb otherwise works fine. I could switch to an electric choke control but going that route would be more expensive that replacing the tube.

[Herman Munster]

This is my carb and manifold.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by Herman Munster

Here's my air cleaner. I don't know why the 2nd photo uploaded rotated. It appears normally on my computer.

That ACL is 1958 and up.

Originally Posted by Herman Munster

This is my carb and manifold.

Have you been able to modify your 1957 4100 yet? Below are three shots I found with the ECZ-B Intake and a 1966 4100.

I have not been able to find a photo of a 57 312 4100 OEM install yet. All I can figure is that the heater control valve (18495) was moved to the heater hose inlet (@ water pump)and the outlet was connected to the intake with an elbow fitting) as was the 1955 272.

[5851a]

Did 57 have a heat control valve? I had a 58 with 332 and don't remember a heat control valve anywhere. May have been removed but it didn't have any extra cables or vacuum lines. Just assumed they controlled temp from 57 year forward on cars with a blend door in the heater box.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by 5851a

Did 57 have a heat control valve? I had a 58 with 332 and don't remember a heat control valve anywhere. May have been removed but it didn't have any extra cables or vacuum lines. Just assumed they controlled temp from 57 year forward on cars with a blend door in the heater box.

Yes. That is what is being discussed here, the placement of the heater control valve and fitment of the 1957 FORD unique 4100 carburetor.

See the dia below. The actual control valve (18495 and 18502) was placed inside the heater core box for 1958. Notice the call-out on the description @ the bottom of the Ill, 57/58.

This opens another quandary, was the 57 4100 carb equipped YB's control valve moved into the heater control box?

The 312 8V intake had a separate outlet coolant supply cast into the intake.

[Oldmics]

Kultulz

Your illustration of the heater is the same as found in the 57 Ford shop manual.

Valve was inside heater cavity.

Oldmics

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by 5851a

Did 57 have a heat control valve? I had a 58 with 332 and don't remember a heat control valve anywhere. May have been removed but it didn't have any extra cables or vacuum lines. Just assumed they controlled temp from 57 year forward on cars with a blend door in the heater box.

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Yes. That is what is being discussed here, the placement of the heater control valve and fitment of the 1957 FORD unique 4100 carburetor.

See the dia below. The actual control valve (18495 and 18502) was placed inside the heater core box for 1958. Notice the call-out on the description @ the bottom of the Ill, 57/58.

This opens another quandary, was the 57 4100 carb equipped YB's control valve moved into the heater control box?

The 312 8V intake had a separate outlet coolant supply cast into the intake.

Brain-Storm Update-

As I frequently drift in and out from the real world to my dream world ... ... I have time to think ...

There were two heater designs for the '57, not taking into account A/C, RECIRCULATING (base) and FRESH AIR ($$$ option). The '57 4100 equipped car must have had the FRESH AIR HTR standard with the control valve in the HTR box. The HOLLEY and CARTER equipped engines could be ordered with either HTR, the RECIRC HTR still using the valve on the intake manifold..

If you are going to use the 57 4100 and cannot adapt to the later 4100 style accelerator pump asm on your ECZ-B intake on your '56, maybe plumb the HTR control valve onto the WP inlet and use the elbow on the intake to the HTR. This was the design in 1955.

EDIT-

WRONG!

I have since come to realize there were two heater styles in 1955/56 as there were in 1957/58. One style had the heater control valve on the intake, the other at the firewall.

The 1957 4100 had to be mounted on a 57 car with the fresh air heater as the control valve(s) were in the heater box. So to retrofit a 57 4100/ECZ-B carb/intake comb on a 1956, one would have to have the fresh air heater or one would have to install an inline control valve in the inlet heater hose.

While the placement of the control valve from the intake to the WP would stop the hot coolant flow, heat convection from the intake to the heater would heat the heater core somewhat making the cabin unpleasant in the summer.

[Gene F]

I put an electric choke cap on my 57, and glad I did. I replaced the regular one, but it still never worked right, no matter what I did.

[scicala]

Amazing that the carb is basicly as long as the intake manifold. Have no idea why it was designed with the extra extra long accel. pump cover.

Sal

[Herman Munster]

Sal, I didn't realize how long the carb was in relation to the manifold until you pointed it out. The air cleaner I have for it, I believe it's also a 57, is also huge. The element is quite small though. I wonder why Ford made large air-cleaners.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by Herman Munster

Does anyone know if it's possible to convert the early type Autolite 4100 to use a the later model accelerator pump. The older type uses a longer accelerator pump and the latter a shorter type.

The longer one gets in the way of the water heater valve on intake manifold which I have relocated elsewhere for now. I'd like to keep the stock location which is why I was wondering it's possible to convert the carb.

...hmmph...

The 57 4100 was a one year design (HOLLEY) (elongated accelerator pump and divorced choke housing).

I wonder if the 4100 292/312 had a remote mounted heater control valve?

Can you show a photo of your air cleaner asm? I would think it would be the same for the 4100-4150-AFB equipped engines.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

...hmmph...

The 57 4100 was a one year design (HOLLEY) (elongated accelerator pump and divorced choke housing).

I wonder if the 4100 292/312 had a remote mounted heater control valve?

Can you show a photo of your air cleaner asm? I would think it would be the same for the 4100-4150-AFB equipped engines.

EDIT-

The fuel inlet is also elongated. Does it also interfere with the heater control valve?