The Ford Barn

1930artdeco · 08-23-2021, 09:27 PM

Hi All,

I will begin to reinstall the lower control arms on my 57 wagon soon-well with any luck

. The little square spacers that attach to the front brace with the front bolts came off on both sides. Here is the question-TIG welding them in is preferable I know but if the outlet won't let me use my 110 welder will JB Weld work?

Thanks,

Mike

craig · 08-24-2021, 08:31 AM

I wouldn't glue anything that has to do with my suspension

paul2748 · 08-24-2021, 04:02 PM

while I pretty much agree with Craig, if I remember correctly the bolt goes thru these spacers so there is zero chance of a problem, especially of falling off.

55blacktie · 08-24-2021, 05:49 PM

I've seen these spacers in diagrams in the 1955 Ford Manual, but I've not seen them in any parts catalogs. I found no such spacers on my 55 Tbird while rebuilding the front suspension and steering. If the OP is asking if the spacers can be glued/welded on, are the spacers supposed to be permanently attached to the front crossmember?

1930artdeco · 08-24-2021, 06:50 PM

Being at work now I am trying to remember, but I think they are welded onto the frame. I am just not sure that my in-laws electrical circuit will let me tack them on with certainty. That is why I asked about JB as plan B.

55... I don't think they are reproduced and have to come from a junk car. Maybe they are not there on Birds? But on regular cars they should be there.

Mike

dmsfrr · 08-24-2021, 10:32 PM

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Is this the square spacer for the lower control arm you're asking about?
Photo is of the top rear side of the right-front cross member.

On this '57 (Bird) they are both welded in place across the top and bottom of the square spacer.

55blacktie · 08-25-2021, 08:44 AM

Thank you, dmsfrr. Is there supposed to be a spacer at the front, between the bolt head and the crossmember?

dmsfrr · 08-25-2021, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 55blacktie

Thank you, dmsfrr. Is there supposed to be a spacer at the front, between the bolt head and the crossmember?

No spacer or washer I can see on this might-be-original '57 suspension, or the '55 I have. I don't know if the hole thru the cross member is sleeved inside but I'd guess it is.
The '55 does have what could be some anti-seize compound around the bolt heads. It went to a front-end shop a little while back for a suspension rebuild.
.

55blacktie · 08-25-2021, 03:02 PM

My 55 front end looked like it hadn't been touched since it left the factory, before I started working on it. I think my dad was the second owner. It's been in the family for approximately 50 years, always garaged, and seldom driven. My dad was more concerned about its appearance than its mechanical condition.

Thanks, again.

Brushwolf · 08-27-2021, 12:13 PM

I would weld them. JB is just epoxy glue despite the name. It should not take a real heavy circuit load to run a 110 mig. I have circuits set up for the welder with heavier breakers, but sometimes use other circuits not set up for the welder. A few times over the years I have kicked out the smaller breakers, but not often and just re-setting it is all that was needed.

Pete · 08-27-2021, 02:32 PM

Those spacers were for front end alignment. They were not welded or glued in on my 57 T-Bird. They can't go anywhere once clamped in.

55blacktie · 08-27-2021, 02:36 PM

Pete, will you post a photo? I'm not sure we're all talking about the same thing.

dmsfrr · 08-27-2021, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete

Those spacers were for front end alignment. They were not welded or glued in on my 57 T-Bird. They can't go anywhere once clamped in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 55blacktie

Pete, will you post a photo? I'm not sure we're all talking about the same thing.

55blacktie, you are correct.
The upper control arm mount does have small spacers for front end alignment,
and in the original post 1930artdeco is asking about a lower control arm mount.
.

Pete · 08-27-2021, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 55blacktie

Pete, will you post a photo? I'm not sure we're all talking about the same thing.

That is entirely possible. My Bird is long gone but from the posted photo it looks like the same is all. Some people called them caster shims.

Pete · 08-27-2021, 03:11 PM

Wouldn't the lower arm shims be for camber adjustment?

Oh no, I see now, the AMOUNT of shims adjusts the camber. The difference in stack heights does the caster.

dmsfrr · 08-27-2021, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete

Wouldn't the lower arm shims be for camber adjustment?
Oh no, I see now, the AMOUNT of shims adjusts the camber. The difference in stack heights does the caster.

You've got it.
There are no front-end alignment shims on the lower control arm mounts, just on the upper mount.

Pete · 08-27-2021, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

You've got it.
There are no front-end alignment shims on the lower control arm mounts, just on the upper mount.

It all comes back after 60 years..lol
After I made a whole bunch of mods to the chassis, the car handled almost as well as a stock Corvette and did fairly well in autocross.

55blacktie · 08-27-2021, 04:29 PM

I dropped some of the upper-control-arm alignment shims while rebuilding my 55 Tbird's front end. I had a few extra when finished. Even if I had put all of them back in the original position, it would still require an alignment, considering everything is now new, Aerostar springs, 1 1/2" dropped spindles, Bilstein shocks, and Hotchkis tubular sway bar.

08-23-2021, 09:27 PM	#1
1930artdeco Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lynden, Wa Posts: 3,785	weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? Hi All, I will begin to reinstall the lower control arms on my 57 wagon soon-well with any luck. The little square spacers that attach to the front brace with the front bolts came off on both sides. Here is the question-TIG welding them in is preferable I know but if the outlet won't let me use my 110 welder will JB Weld work? Thanks, Mike __________________ 1930 TownSedan (Briggs) 1957 Country Sedan

08-24-2021, 08:31 AM	#2
craig Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: The Inland Empire of Washington State Posts: 373	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? I wouldn't glue anything that has to do with my suspension

08-24-2021, 04:02 PM	#3
paul2748 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Midland Park, NJ Posts: 4,292	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? while I pretty much agree with Craig, if I remember correctly the bolt goes thru these spacers so there is zero chance of a problem, especially of falling off. __________________ 48 Ford Conv 56 Tbird 54 Ford Victoria

08-24-2021, 05:49 PM	#4
55blacktie BANNED Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 529	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? I've seen these spacers in diagrams in the 1955 Ford Manual, but I've not seen them in any parts catalogs. I found no such spacers on my 55 Tbird while rebuilding the front suspension and steering. If the OP is asking if the spacers can be glued/welded on, are the spacers supposed to be permanently attached to the front crossmember?

08-24-2021, 06:50 PM	#5
1930artdeco Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lynden, Wa Posts: 3,785	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? Being at work now I am trying to remember, but I think they are welded onto the frame. I am just not sure that my in-laws electrical circuit will let me tack them on with certainty. That is why I asked about JB as plan B. 55... I don't think they are reproduced and have to come from a junk car. Maybe they are not there on Birds? But on regular cars they should be there. Mike __________________ 1930 TownSedan (Briggs) 1957 Country Sedan

08-25-2021, 08:44 AM	#7
55blacktie BANNED Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 529	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? Thank you, dmsfrr. Is there supposed to be a spacer at the front, between the bolt head and the crossmember?

08-25-2021, 03:02 PM	#9
55blacktie BANNED Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 529	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? My 55 front end looked like it hadn't been touched since it left the factory, before I started working on it. I think my dad was the second owner. It's been in the family for approximately 50 years, always garaged, and seldom driven. My dad was more concerned about its appearance than its mechanical condition. Thanks, again.

08-27-2021, 12:13 PM	#10
Brushwolf Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Minnesota Posts: 90	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? I would weld them. JB is just epoxy glue despite the name. It should not take a real heavy circuit load to run a 110 mig. I have circuits set up for the welder with heavier breakers, but sometimes use other circuits not set up for the welder. A few times over the years I have kicked out the smaller breakers, but not often and just re-setting it is all that was needed.

08-27-2021, 02:32 PM	#11
Pete BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Wa. Posts: 5,423	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? Those spacers were for front end alignment. They were not welded or glued in on my 57 T-Bird. They can't go anywhere once clamped in.

08-27-2021, 02:36 PM	#12
55blacktie BANNED Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 529	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? Pete, will you post a photo? I'm not sure we're all talking about the same thing.

08-27-2021, 03:11 PM	#15
Pete BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Wa. Posts: 5,423	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? Wouldn't the lower arm shims be for camber adjustment? Oh no, I see now, the AMOUNT of shims adjusts the camber. The difference in stack heights does the caster.

08-27-2021, 04:29 PM	#18
55blacktie BANNED Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 529	Re: weld or JB weld spacers on lower frame? I dropped some of the upper-control-arm alignment shims while rebuilding my 55 Tbird's front end. I had a few extra when finished. Even if I had put all of them back in the original position, it would still require an alignment, considering everything is now new, Aerostar springs, 1 1/2" dropped spindles, Bilstein shocks, and Hotchkis tubular sway bar.