The Ford Barn

todd3131 · 11-20-2012, 06:34 PM

I need to repair my steering gear, I am going to order a new sector gear but when I started looking at the parts available I noticed that they have many modern upgrades so I have some questions for the informed,

1] They have a needle bearing retrofit for the sector gear with a seal at the end to prevent leaking, my question is are they worth the money? Mine is original and does not need to be replaced the bushings are like new does it help with the steering?

2]The end plate for the bale for the light switch, they list a modern type but I don't understand what is different with it. Can any one enlighten me.

3] Steering oil what is the current best to use in them.

As always thank you for your advise.
Todd

RonC · 11-20-2012, 06:43 PM

1, Not necessary in my opinion

2. Yes get this. It helps with leakage.

3. These are the modern equivalents to the Ford transmission, rear end and steering box oils:

Mobilgear 600 XP 680
BP Energol GR-XP 680
Castrol Alpha LS680
Shell Omala 680
Texaco Meropa 680

todd3131 · 11-20-2012, 06:47 PM

Ron what is different about #2? Mine is fifty years old and it has a tube that goes up the shaft and from what I can tell that is all that theirs is. Did they originally not have the tube and mine was changed at some point?
Todd

RonC · 11-20-2012, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by todd3131

Ron what is different about #2? Mine is fifty years old and it has a tube that goes up the shaft and from what I can tell that is all that theirs is. Did they originally not have the tube and mine was changed at some point?
Todd

Todd originally they didn't have that tube.

Rowdy · 11-20-2012, 06:50 PM

IMHO the needle bearings are not really all that good of an idea. I have heard here that the sector wears the shaft prematurely because the sector shafts are not hardened. The sector shaft seal is a good idea along with bottom plate with the stem to keep leaks to a minimum. Nothing wrong with 600W oil, although some are using Penrite. Rod

Great Lakes Greg · 11-20-2012, 06:50 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

I always put the seal on the end, but be advised it requires machining to get it to work. I have heard the needle bearings work great at first, but different metal hardness makes them wear funny later. I'll stick with Henrys brass bushings.

700rpm · 11-20-2012, 07:06 PM

I put the needle bearings in mine last summer. It steers very nicely. How long will it last? Probably longer than I will be driving.

Marco Tahtaras · 11-21-2012, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 700rpm

I put the needle bearings in mine last summer. It steers very nicely. How long will it last? Probably longer than I will be driving.

It's hard to say as it will depend somewhat on the loads put on it where you drive. The biggest problem I've seen is loose installations. Every one I've seen allowed the sector to wobble more than properly fitted bushings. The result is an added inch or two of slop at the steering wheel.

todd3131 · 11-20-2012, 08:21 PM

Thank you all, I will leave the original bushings and I have the end plate that my father had on it and it has the tube. I will see if I can have it machined for the seal. Thanks
tood

Tom Wesenberg · 11-20-2012, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by todd3131

Thank you all, I will leave the original bushings and I have the end plate that my father had on it and it has the tube. I will see if I can have it machined for the seal. Thanks
tood

About 10 years ago I usede the rubber O ring and thin flat washer from Bratton's and slid it on between the frame and steering gear, and it worked fine.

RonC · 11-21-2012, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

About 10 years ago I usede the rubber O ring and thin flat washer from Bratton's and slid it on between the frame and steering gear, and it worked fine.

I use the o-ring and washer trick too

columbiA · 11-20-2012, 11:18 PM

Also add a short pitman arm & teflon ball seats on good round steering balls,correct toe-in & tire pressure and it will steer better than new.

Roger V · 11-21-2012, 08:32 AM

Years ago, a guy in our club was a dealer service manager in the days that Model A's were brought in for service. He claimed that Ford in some year later than Model A production, tried needle bearings and they were a problem. His logic is that needle bearings were for uses that required continual rotation such as a cluster gear in the transmission. He noted that for steering they also were too sloppy right at the begining and this was as bad as very worn bushings.

J Franklin · 11-21-2012, 12:30 PM

I noticed in post #8 you said you would leave the bushings. I hope you meant that you would leave it re-bushed as done originally. a lot of lost motion can occur at this point.

todd3131 · 11-21-2012, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J Franklin

I noticed in post #8 you said you would leave the bushings. I hope you meant that you would leave it re-bushed as done originally. a lot of lost motion can occur at this point.

I'm going to leave the bushings that are in it, there was no wear on the sector and the only real problem I have is wear on the teeth that I can't adjust out due to them hitting the bottom of the valley on the worm gear. The shaft of the sector is like new and I never had any leaks out that side of it.

11-20-2012, 06:34 PM	#1
todd3131 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: cedar rapids iowa Posts: 530	two tooth steering questions I need to repair my steering gear, I am going to order a new sector gear but when I started looking at the parts available I noticed that they have many modern upgrades so I have some questions for the informed, 1] They have a needle bearing retrofit for the sector gear with a seal at the end to prevent leaking, my question is are they worth the money? Mine is original and does not need to be replaced the bushings are like new does it help with the steering? 2]The end plate for the bale for the light switch, they list a modern type but I don't understand what is different with it. Can any one enlighten me. 3] Steering oil what is the current best to use in them. As always thank you for your advise. Todd

11-20-2012, 06:47 PM	#3
todd3131 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: cedar rapids iowa Posts: 530	Re: two tooth steering questions Ron what is different about #2? Mine is fifty years old and it has a tube that goes up the shaft and from what I can tell that is all that theirs is. Did they originally not have the tube and mine was changed at some point? Todd

11-20-2012, 06:50 PM	#5
Rowdy BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Gothenburg Nebraska Just off I-80 Posts: 4,893	Re: two tooth steering questions IMHO the needle bearings are not really all that good of an idea. I have heard here that the sector wears the shaft prematurely because the sector shafts are not hardened. The sector shaft seal is a good idea along with bottom plate with the stem to keep leaks to a minimum. Nothing wrong with 600W oil, although some are using Penrite. Rod __________________ Do the RIGHT thing - Support the H.A.M.B. Alliance!!!!

11-20-2012, 06:50 PM	#6
Great Lakes Greg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,369	Re: two tooth steering questions Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I always put the seal on the end, but be advised it requires machining to get it to work. I have heard the needle bearings work great at first, but different metal hardness makes them wear funny later. I'll stick with Henrys brass bushings.

11-20-2012, 07:06 PM	#7
700rpm Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 6,039	Re: two tooth steering questions I put the needle bearings in mine last summer. It steers very nicely. How long will it last? Probably longer than I will be driving. __________________ Ray Horton, Portland, OR As you go through life, keep your eye on the donut, not the hole.

11-20-2012, 06:43 PM	#2
RonC Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Rhode Island Posts: 1,868	Re: two tooth steering questions 1, Not necessary in my opinion 2. Yes get this. It helps with leakage. 3. These are the modern equivalents to the Ford transmission, rear end and steering box oils: Mobilgear 600 XP 680 BP Energol GR-XP 680 Castrol Alpha LS680 Shell Omala 680 Texaco Meropa 680

11-20-2012, 08:21 PM	#9
todd3131 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: cedar rapids iowa Posts: 530	Re: two tooth steering questions Thank you all, I will leave the original bushings and I have the end plate that my father had on it and it has the tube. I will see if I can have it machined for the seal. Thanks tood

11-20-2012, 11:18 PM	#12
columbiA Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 1,746	Re: two tooth steering questions Also add a short pitman arm & teflon ball seats on good round steering balls,correct toe-in & tire pressure and it will steer better than new.

11-21-2012, 08:32 AM	#13
Roger V Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,593	Re: two tooth steering questions Years ago, a guy in our club was a dealer service manager in the days that Model A's were brought in for service. He claimed that Ford in some year later than Model A production, tried needle bearings and they were a problem. His logic is that needle bearings were for uses that required continual rotation such as a cluster gear in the transmission. He noted that for steering they also were too sloppy right at the begining and this was as bad as very worn bushings.

11-21-2012, 12:30 PM	#14
J Franklin Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Oregon Posts: 6,373	Re: two tooth steering questions I noticed in post #8 you said you would leave the bushings. I hope you meant that you would leave it re-bushed as done originally. a lot of lost motion can occur at this point.