The Ford Barn

Lembomw · 01-20-2012, 08:24 AM

A couple of spring questions. I did a thread search but nothing that helps me.
Yesterday I removed the U bolts that hold the front spring to the frame so I could separate the whole front suspension to get at the frame so I could straighten it. The car is completely disassembled, engine and transmission is out. The frame had a slight sag at the usual location. All straight now.
Once the front end was separated from the frame a few of the top leaves fell off the spring (the center spring bolt was rusted away). The third spring was broken across the middle where the hole is. Can I tig this broken leaf together or will welding cause some sort of structural/safety issue?
Can the rear end be separated from the frame the same way? Remove the U bolts and roll the rear end with spring still attached out from under the frame?
I understand that removing the springs from the shackles while on the car is dangerous and a spring spreader should be used, but if I leave the springs attached to the car can I take the spring clamps off and remove the leaves one at a time until I get down to the last one that is attached to the shackle. There does not seem to be much tension on the front spring. The back spring will have much more tension so perhaps taking is apart one leaf at a time while still attached to the shackles is not a good idea.
Your guidance will be most appreciated.

Mark

John LaVoy · 01-20-2012, 09:13 AM

Using a spring spreader is really your best option. Check around the local chapters and see if someone wouldn't loan you one if you don't want to invest in one yourself. But the spreader is the safest way of doing the job. There is a lot of energy stored in the rear spring so be careful.

Lembomw · 01-20-2012, 09:21 AM

Thanks John. It does look like there is a lot of tension there. Do you know if a broken leaf is usable if I weld it and if I can safely remove the rear end with the spring attached by removing the U bolts? Thanks, Mark

Farrell In Vancouver · 01-20-2012, 09:22 AM

The third broken spring is a short one and probably won't mind being tigged back together as most of the movement is at the end of the leaves. Might be better to hunt around for a replacement though, after you've cleaned each one and looked for cracks and such. Don't forget to chamfer the ends to prevent them from digging in to each other too. I have to echo John above about the spreader especially working on the rear. If you have the body off you should be able to check the integrity of the rear tie bolt, but don't trust it too long. Have some C clamps ready to capture the leaves so you can let them off slowly.

Elcastor · 01-20-2012, 09:27 AM

It can be taken apart like you are suggesting using multiple pipe clamps, BUT invariably the spring shackle bushings are shot and need to be replaced SO you might as well plan on buying, or borrowing, a spring spreader and do it right! Who knows, the spring spreader might even come with "help"!

Lembomw · 01-20-2012, 09:39 AM

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Farrell & Ben, thank you for your responses. I plan on replacing all the shackles, spring bolts and clamps. Did not think about camphering the ends. Great idea. Will contact people in the club for a spring spreader for the rear spring. Looks like I will be taking a trip to Harbor Freight to get a bunch of clamps.

Thanks again, Mark

jetmek · 01-20-2012, 09:56 AM

mark i wouldnt advise trying to weld a spring leaf. new springs assys are a good idea as the origional fronts are usually weak. i have quite a bit of loose spring leaves here we mite be able to match it up if want to try that...i have a rear spreader as well if you want to borrow it.....al

Tom Wesenberg · 01-20-2012, 10:55 AM

For clamps to use on the rear spring you might want better quality clamps than what Harbor Freight sells.

TinCup · 01-20-2012, 11:18 AM

A completely new front spring can be had for 150.00 bucks and with the effort your going through would seem like a good investment. Don't underestimate the rear spring. Use a quality rear spring spreader when trying to work with it.
Here are a few pictures of my buddy and I replacing the spring on my coupe.

Rear Spring Replacement

Steve Plucker · 01-20-2012, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TinCup

A completely new front spring can be had for 150.00 bucks and with the effort your going through would seem like a good investment. Don't underestimate the rear spring. Use a quality rear spring spreader when trying to work with it.
Here are a few pictures of my buddy and I replacing the spring on my coupe.

Rear Spring Replacement

As most say above...do it right and BE SAFE about it...never underestimate the power of the rear spring as TINCUP says above. If you have a rusted spring bolt that even scares me more.

I have wrapped the whole rear springs with chain and/or heavy rope but C-clamps, as stated above work also...BE SAFE.

NOT TO HIJACK THIS THREAD...But TINCUP...just how do you get those flashing lights in your avitar...have seen other avitars with moving fans...Hmmmm?

Pluck

Lembomw · 01-20-2012, 08:56 PM

Thank you gentlemen for all your responses. Based on what I have read, I am going to purchase a new front spring. I have also located a rear spring spreader that a member or the Model A club has. I am going to pick it up tomorrow. He aslo has good clamps.

As usual the advice and guidance received from the forum is great.

Mark

01-20-2012, 08:24 AM	#1
Lembomw Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Orange County, NY Posts: 162	Spring Questions A couple of spring questions. I did a thread search but nothing that helps me. Yesterday I removed the U bolts that hold the front spring to the frame so I could separate the whole front suspension to get at the frame so I could straighten it. The car is completely disassembled, engine and transmission is out. The frame had a slight sag at the usual location. All straight now. Once the front end was separated from the frame a few of the top leaves fell off the spring (the center spring bolt was rusted away). The third spring was broken across the middle where the hole is. Can I tig this broken leaf together or will welding cause some sort of structural/safety issue? Can the rear end be separated from the frame the same way? Remove the U bolts and roll the rear end with spring still attached out from under the frame? I understand that removing the springs from the shackles while on the car is dangerous and a spring spreader should be used, but if I leave the springs attached to the car can I take the spring clamps off and remove the leaves one at a time until I get down to the last one that is attached to the shackle. There does not seem to be much tension on the front spring. The back spring will have much more tension so perhaps taking is apart one leaf at a time while still attached to the shackles is not a good idea. Your guidance will be most appreciated. Mark

01-20-2012, 09:13 AM	#2
John LaVoy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Rocklin, CA Posts: 1,219	Re: Spring Questions Using a spring spreader is really your best option. Check around the local chapters and see if someone wouldn't loan you one if you don't want to invest in one yourself. But the spreader is the safest way of doing the job. There is a lot of energy stored in the rear spring so be careful.

01-20-2012, 09:21 AM	#3
Lembomw Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Orange County, NY Posts: 162	Re: Spring Questions Thanks John. It does look like there is a lot of tension there. Do you know if a broken leaf is usable if I weld it and if I can safely remove the rear end with the spring attached by removing the U bolts? Thanks, Mark

01-20-2012, 09:22 AM	#4
Farrell In Vancouver Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Pitt Meadows BC Posts: 1,003	Re: Spring Questions The third broken spring is a short one and probably won't mind being tigged back together as most of the movement is at the end of the leaves. Might be better to hunt around for a replacement though, after you've cleaned each one and looked for cracks and such. Don't forget to chamfer the ends to prevent them from digging in to each other too. I have to echo John above about the spreader especially working on the rear. If you have the body off you should be able to check the integrity of the rear tie bolt, but don't trust it too long. Have some C clamps ready to capture the leaves so you can let them off slowly.

01-20-2012, 09:27 AM	#5
Elcastor Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Oregon and Baja Mexico Posts: 617	Re: Spring Questions It can be taken apart like you are suggesting using multiple pipe clamps, BUT invariably the spring shackle bushings are shot and need to be replaced SO you might as well plan on buying, or borrowing, a spring spreader and do it right! Who knows, the spring spreader might even come with "help"! __________________ Ben Purkey Mexico and the Pacific NW http://www.martin-parry.com/

01-20-2012, 09:39 AM	#6
Lembomw Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Orange County, NY Posts: 162	Re: Spring Questions Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Farrell & Ben, thank you for your responses. I plan on replacing all the shackles, spring bolts and clamps. Did not think about camphering the ends. Great idea. Will contact people in the club for a spring spreader for the rear spring. Looks like I will be taking a trip to Harbor Freight to get a bunch of clamps. Thanks again, Mark

01-20-2012, 09:56 AM	#7
jetmek Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: albany Posts: 487	Re: Spring Questions mark i wouldnt advise trying to weld a spring leaf. new springs assys are a good idea as the origional fronts are usually weak. i have quite a bit of loose spring leaves here we mite be able to match it up if want to try that...i have a rear spreader as well if you want to borrow it.....al __________________ engine and component overhauls my specialty! Website- www.godevilgarage.com

01-20-2012, 10:55 AM	#8
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Spring Questions For clamps to use on the rear spring you might want better quality clamps than what Harbor Freight sells.

01-20-2012, 11:18 AM	#9
TinCup Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: OKC / Tonkawa, Ok. Posts: 1,977	Re: Spring Questions A completely new front spring can be had for 150.00 bucks and with the effort your going through would seem like a good investment. Don't underestimate the rear spring. Use a quality rear spring spreader when trying to work with it. Here are a few pictures of my buddy and I replacing the spring on my coupe. Rear Spring Replacement __________________ Oklahoma City Model A Restorers Group.

01-20-2012, 08:56 PM	#11
Lembomw Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Orange County, NY Posts: 162	Re: Spring Questions Thank you gentlemen for all your responses. Based on what I have read, I am going to purchase a new front spring. I have also located a rear spring spreader that a member or the Model A club has. I am going to pick it up tomorrow. He aslo has good clamps. As usual the advice and guidance received from the forum is great. Mark