Cork/Rubber Pan Gasket - Different Torque Requirement??

[Lembomw]

I began reassembling my 30 Tudor engine today. Had to put a rear main oil return tube in (none there, lots of oil leaking out the back of the pan) and a cam thrust plunger (spring broken, lots of not so pleasant noise). Thanks to all the postings on these subjects it appears that everything went together without a hitch…..I think.
I purchased the cork gaskets to use on the pan (seems like it is mostly rubber though) since I figure they would be thicker and take up any variations in the pan due to warping etc. Anyway, the book says to torque the pan bolts to 20ft lbs. I tightened gradually all around until I got to 20. When I looked at the pan from the top the gasket was squished out a lot between the engine and the pan. In one place I can see the hole in the gasket for the bolt to go through, it squished out that far before getting to 20 ft lbs. If using the cork/rubber gaskets does the torque setting get reduced to eliminate too much of the gasket from squishing out?? I thank you for your experience. Mark

[Dick Deegan]

I had the same experience several years ago. I torqued the pan gasket to 20 ft-lbs as stated in the Les Andrews book and the gasket squished out. I believe that originally Ford used a T handle wrench with very limited torque possibilities to tighten pan gaskets. I think that Model A Times did a study on this and came to the conclusion that, using the original T handle wrench, the torque was about 5 ft-lbs. I have changed the pan gasket again since then and only tightened to "snug up" plus a little bit - nowhere near 20 ft-lbs. I also believe that 20 ft-lbs of torque exceeds (or close to it) the safe operating tensile strength of the bolts. No leaks.

Others should chime in here about the study in Model A Times.

[Russ/40]

Yes, and I do not know what the new number would be. Just start to compress the gasket and stop. Maybe if someone has heard of a torque spec with this type of gasket in a newer application, they can provide a published number. Generally, I think too much attention is paid to torque values when it comes to antique automobiles.

[Russ/40]

Dick, you type faster than I do

[Mike V. Florida]

I hate torque values. There were none in the Model A day. The only time I pay any attention to torque is when all of them in a given area need to be the same.

20 lbs is way too much. The new gaskets for the oil pan is only 5lbs. I beleive. With sealant tighten until you see the gasket compress slightly. There is no pressure in the oil pan to push the oil out.

[Mike V. Florida]

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In the past I tried to start a thread with errors in the andrews book so we could get the best single source of information corrected, it went no where.

[Lembomw]

Thank you all for such quick responses. I will loosen the bolts and see if the gasket "remembers" its old shape then just snug it down. If if doesn't then that is why I buy 2 sets of all gaskets so I can screw up one and "lean" from my mistake.

Thanks again, Mark

[gunmetal blue]

Did anybody think about maybe it is 20 inch. pounds?

[Lembomw]

It said 20 Ft. Lbs in the Les Andrews book, but in the front Bratton's parts book it says 5 - 6 Ft. Lbs. Oh well. I loosened up the bolts and the gasket went back in but when I tightened to 5 lbs it all squished out again. Dropped the pan and found that by tightening to 20 it squashed the gasket so tight that it ripped it between some of the holes so that gasket is no good. Fortunately I bought 2 gasket sets for times like this. Will re-do tomorrow and just use the two-finger tightening rule so it will not swuash out again.

Mark

[Keith True]

If you use any kind of wet sealant on the cork/rubberized gaskets,(except for the very ends)the sealant will act as a lube and will squeeze the gasket out before the lock washers will flatten.I know I can ruin a wet gasket by tightening the bolts by hand with a socket,no ratchet.

[Lembomw]

EXCELLENT point.....I did not think of that. I will just put it on dry and RTV the ends. Thank you. If I put the prematex on again it probably would have slipped out again. Thanks, Mark

[John LaVoy]

When the new gasket that is a rubber cork mix came out we head of problems with it squeezing out at 20 ft pounds. As was mentioned there were no "torque" specs at the time of the Model A, the "torque" was controlled by the wrench that was used specifically for the job. The wrench that was used for the installation of the pan bolts has a very short handle (6" across, so 3" of leverage) using this wrench and going back and testing with a torque wrench gave us 5 ft pounds. That is the number we used in the Model A Times article and the one Bratton's shows.

[Lembomw]

I put the second pair of pan gaskets on today. Just tightened until they squished out a little. Tomorrow I will finish reinstalling everything and start it up. Hopefully it will not leak......too much. Thanks all for your help. Mark