SPECIAL EXPERIMENTAL 1928 Model A Ford Engines...

[Steve Plucker]

ACCORDING TO FORD’S RECORDS OF DAILY PRODUCED ENGINES, THAT WERE ASSEMBLED BETWEEN JULY 9, 1928, (A236,787), AND OCTOBER 2, 1928, (A477,642), A NUMBER OF “SPECIAL EXPERIMENTAL” ENGINES WERE PRODUCED. THE RETURN OIL PIPE ASSEMBLY, A-6645, ALONG WITH THE OIL RETURN PIPE CONECTIONS ON THE BLOCK, A-6015, AND VALVE COVER CHAMBER, A-6520, WERE ALL DELETED. THE ADDITION OF OIL RETURN HOLES WERE DRILLED ON THE FLOOR OF THE VALVE CHAMBER TO ALLOW THE OIL TO DRAIN BACK INTO THE OIL PAN. EACH ENGINE HAD THE REGULAR MODEL A ENGINE NUMBER STAMPING TO INDICATE 1928 PRODUCTION. BETWEEN 1353 AND 1355 ENGINES OF THIS TYPE WERE BUILT. THESE CAN BE SUBSTANUATED BY THE “RELEASE” DATA OF APRIL 23, 1928 FOR EACH SPECIFIC PART AND THOSE FEW WHICH HAVE BEEN DOCUMENTED TODAY. ONE ENGINE NUMBER WHICH HAS BEEN DOCUMENTED SO FAR IS #286,625 (JULY 29, 1928). ARE THERE OTHER KNOWN ENGINES LIKE THIS ONE OUT THERE?

I wonder if any of these "Special" engines ended up in any production Model A/AA's?


Thanks.

Pluck

[kelley's restoration]

i saw one for sale not too long ago at the milwaukee swap meet
i think john from johns antique auto had it
tk

[CarlG]

Steve, ALL CAPS MAKES IT HARD TO READ!

[Peter J]

Pluck,
Are they located where the holes are in the B block valve chamber? If so, I wonder why they didn't go for it and Henry save a few bucks on the pipe and machine work on the cover?

[Steve Plucker]

Originally Posted by Peter J

Pluck,
Are they located where the holes are in the B block valve chamber? If so, I wonder why they didn't go for it and Henry save a few bucks on the pipe and machine work on the cover?

Pete, I do not know where the holes are located in a "B" block valve chamber.

Pluck

[Steve Plucker]

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Originally Posted by CarlG

Steve, ALL CAPS MAKES IT HARD TO READ!

Carl,...Yes I know...sorry about that...I cut and pasted it from my engine block guide which I did a few years back for which one of these days I am going to revise it with photos to match and make it easier to read.

Pluck

[d.j. moordigian]

The oiling system in a B is different(mains). With out seeing the inside of the above
pictured engine, I bet they had an issue in oiling the mains? Vince, do you have
anymore photos, side cover off and from the bottom?
Dudley

[roccaas]

Wasn't the "all internal" oil return system of the Chevy/GM Smallblock (283) a real selling point against the Flatheads and their external oil returns? Less chance of oil leakage if the pan was put on correctly?

I believe I read that the external oil return was an oil cooler, and the engine needed the oil to cool enough on the way down (so the pump could pick it up easier??), hence the external pipe. How did the all internal engines cool the oil?

[40 Deluxe]

Originally Posted by roccaas

Wasn't the "all internal" oil return system of the Chevy/GM Smallblock (283) a real selling point against the Flatheads and their external oil returns? Less chance of oil leakage if the pan was put on correctly?

I believe I read that the external oil return was an oil cooler, and the engine needed the oil to cool enough on the way down (so the pump could pick it up easier??), hence the external pipe. How did the all internal engines cool the oil?

If by Flathead you mean the V8, then no difference in oil return. A flattie V8 has all internal oil return, same as the Chevy smallblock. The only external return on a flathead was the line from the optional bypass external mount oil filter. But guess what! The first Chevy V8's ('55 & '56) also had an external bypass oil filter with exposed lines, same as the flathead. Ford went to full-flow oil filters with the first OHV six in '52 and then the first OHV V8 in "54. Took Chevy until '57.

[SteveTom]

I have a 1928 Briggs Fordor (60A) with one of these engines installed in it. I bought the car in 1967 without realizing the engine was unusual. When I discovered it was not a standard engine, I contacted the Model A Ford Club of America in the early 1970s. They could find no records of this type of engine and published my letter & photographs of my engine in their magazine, but I never heard from anyone who had seen an engine like this until I saw your post. (I replied to your post when it first appeared, but I guess something went awry because my reply was never posted.)

[LeonardS]

Originally Posted by SteveTom

I have a 1928 Briggs Fordor (60A) with one of these engines installed in it. I bought the car in 1967 without realizing the engine was unusual. When I discovered it was not a standard engine, I contacted the Model A Ford Club of America in the early 1970s. They could find no records of this type of engine and published my letter & photographs of my engine in their magazine, but I never heard from anyone who had seen an engine like this until I saw your post. (I replied to your post when it first appeared, but I guess something went awry because my reply was never posted.)

This thread is 13 years old. You might not get many replies from the posters.

[Bob C]

Here's a picture of one.

[wrndln]

I also have one of these engines. They are quite rare. I didn't realize I had one until I noticed it had no oil return pipe on it long after I purchased it. I would like to sell it to someone that would appreciate it.
Rusty Nelson
Lakeville, MN

[ModelA29]

That one was stamped 7-17-28

[dlshady]

Originally Posted by wrndln

I also have one of these engines. They are quite rare. I didn't realize I had one until I noticed it had no oil return pipe on it long after I purchased it. I would like to sell it to someone that would appreciate it.
Rusty Nelson
Lakeville, MN

I'd buy it in a heartbeat, but I suspect getting it from Minnesota to Alabama would cost way more than the engine itself.

[rotorwrench]

A person can contact Steve Plucker through either his web site or at the VFF site. I don't think he has been here for a long time due to one reason or another. Notice the word "Banned" under his name.

The model B engines were made with no oil return tube but the casting is larger so it won't fit a model A. The model B engine integrated the oil pressuring system with the side cover and any drain back excess can still go through the front of the block

[SteveTom]

In case anyone's interested, the engine number on my "special experimental" engine is A297182. The body date is 23 July 1928. The car has some early 28 features such as a red steering wheel, handbrake in front of the gearshift, and a mushroom shaped gearshift knob, but has a single plate clutch. The engine had never been rebuilt when I bought it, but the clutch may have been changed. Or, Henry might have just been using up his inventory of mushroom gearshift knobs.

[SteveTom]

Note to Brent: I tried to reply by email via the link this site sent me, but I don't have 20 posts so the site wouldn't let me use their email. My engine number and body date are given above. I don't know where the car was assembled. I bought it in Indiana, but it was nearly 40 years old at the time so it could have been from anywhere. It's my understanding that production of the Fordor sedans lagged way behind schedule so maybe there was only one branch making Briggs Fordors at the time? Some body features on my car are slightly different from what specialty shops say was standard, so I get the feeling Briggs was still working things out when they made my car.

[J Franklin]

Originally Posted by dlshady

I'd buy it in a heartbeat, but I suspect getting it from Minnesota to Alabama would cost way more than the engine itself.

It's not too late for an exciting road trip!