Mystery transmission

[Beauford]

So getting the engine ready I was rocking the chassis to find the timing dimple. I then thought this car rocks alot in gear. I put the non running car in reverse and you can push it forward or back. So I just got off work and detached the rear to see if u joint turns when in gear while I had crank engine and it does. I put it through every gear and the u joint locks in position and only turns when you crank. I know I installed clutch right with longer part of hub facing the cab.

So I attach the rear end again knowing now the u joint spins in neutral, locks in position through each gear and moves while cranking. With rear attached I place the car in reverse. It can still roll in either direction??? The rear is solid as the drive shaft when turned moves both axles, almost zero play in them and smooth....I dont get it????

[Dick Steinkamp]

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying, but the u joint should not spin in neutral. In neutral, the transmission disconnects the engine from the trans output shaft and the u joint.

Are you sure you have the forks in the shift tower positioned properly in the sliding gears in the trans?

[Mitch//pa]

Do you have the axle keys in.. im sure you do

[Beauford]

Axle keys are in but I am going to check anyway...

Dick..it spins by hand in neutral. I put the vehicle in gear it locks in gear and cant move it by hand but when you hand crank it moves. If that makes sense. How can the car be pushed forward when car is in reverse?

[heneste]

Was the transmission shift tower removed? If it was put back on without making sure the shift forks are engaged with the transmission gears, you could think the car is in a certain gear while it really isn't.

[Mitch//pa]

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So in first second and third if u hand crank it the chassis wants to move forward, but in reverse it just rolls????

[Dick Steinkamp]

Originally Posted by Beauford

How can the car be pushed forward when car is in reverse?

Not a problem. The engine just turns backwards.

[Beauford]

Mitch..I disconnected the rear to just see if u joint and trans was installed correctly by hand cranking while in gear. (I have rotation) Have not hand cranked with rear back in while in gear. I'm just saying with driveshaft off I can put in gear and the u joints locks so how when I attach driveshaft can it move freely either way in reverse?

[Beauford]

Really Dick? Not that I doubt you but if this is the case you just saved me a ton of grief. Where do I send the check?

[Beauford]

Dick, just tested it in reverse pushing forward and reverse and yes, watching the crank pulley it is going both ways! Hope the ebrake holds good on a hill. LOL

[Joe K]

How can the car be pushed forward when car is in reverse?

If the rear axle (banjo) has been disassembled, it may have been reassembled incorrectly with the ring gear on the wrong side. You end up with three reverse gears and one forward gear.

Joe K

[40 Deluxe]

Originally Posted by Beauford

So getting the engine ready I was rocking the chassis to find the timing dimple. I then thought this car rocks alot in gear. I put the non running car in reverse and you can push it forward or back. So I just got off work and detached the rear to see if u joint turns when in gear while I had crank engine and it does. I put it through every gear and the u joint locks in position and only turns when you crank. I know I installed clutch right with longer part of hub facing the cab.

So I attach the rear end again knowing now the u joint spins in neutral, locks in position through each gear and moves while cranking. With rear attached I place the car in reverse. It can still roll in either direction??? The rear is solid as the drive shaft when turned moves both axles, almost zero play in them and smooth....I dont get it????

Just for clarification: When you're pushing the car forward or back in reverse, is the engine turning? That is what it should do. When you push the car forward with trans in reverse, the engine will turn backward but would be extremely hard to do unless the spark plugs are out and even then will push hard.
Put the trans in high and set the emergency brake all the way, then try to hand crank the engine. It should not turn nor should the car move. If you can turn the engine without the car moving, either the clutch is slipping or the trans is messed up. Same for first and second. In reverse, hand cranking may overpower the emergency brake and the car will move backwards if clutch and trans are OK.
You don't have to disconnect anything to diagnose your problem.

[Beauford]

40, yes pushing forward or backwards I see front crank pulley moving. I'll try the others you mentioned. Thanks!

[Beauford]

Joe, I never disassembled the rear axle. It was full of oil (which I changed) axles and driveshaft were good. About the only thing on this vehicle that didn't need major attention. It was the cracked block that caused them many years ago to park this car in the elements. Should have it running today or tomorrow and will give her a test drive.

[Joe K]

Generally, I have found it best to bring things back by "components."

ONe works first on (say) a rear axle. Rebuilding commences by rebuilding everything to the standard of "is this the best I can make it."

Transmission - are these the best gears I can find (used gears) or are these all new and from a known supplier. Are these new original brand Timken bearings? (or an acceptable substitute - there are a LOT of marginal quality bearings available on Ebay.)

Engine - rebuilt using the best techniques at hand or handed off to someone who makes their living doing this sort of thing and offers a warranty.

If each of the major components are made best as you can then you limit the chances of an assembled multitude to "bite you in the a..."

I will usually make good effort to try things out: the motor is usually run in a stand first - or at least in the frame. Then with a transmission attached. Then the rear axle up on blocks. Then a test run minus the body. Good hints on doing all of these in the various "How to Restore Your Model A" series by MAFCA.

The car is rebuilt in stages so that you can gain confidence in each successive stage and before you put a bunch of labor in assembly you have to undo to correct a found deficiency.

But I expect you may be at the point where you're simply trying to get it roadworthy (and license/inspectable) In this case there is more challenge - as you are finding.

The Model A pickup in my signature header is my Model A once finally roadworthy and with registration. It drove like that for another 10 years before I began a ground up restoration - which is still underway as we speak.

Mebbe I should have quit back 10 years ago and left it all together?

I miss driving that car.

Good luck!

Joe K

[Beauford]

Rebuilt engine by Dreamwerks, transmission gears were all in great shape so I just replaced bearings. All new backing plates, hubs/drums, brake rods, distributor, coil. Rebuilt starter, gen....Didn't fool with rear end. It it works why tear it apart. I know some people here just have to know what it looks like inside but I will cross that bridge if need be. The chassis alone I could have bought a nice running A. I have a Fordor body that will need extensive work. I need to weigh the price it will take just in wood against finding another body. Every project has a price....I just want it to crusie around town.